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SereneWolfParticipant
Hi Anita,
Thanks for your response.So, first thing to do is to lower the intensity of this emotional pain. One way to do so is to verbally express it, in writing (journaling), sharing about it here, and best, of course, would be to share it within the context of quality, in-person psychotherapy.
I would like to start journaling – what do you think is the good way put down your thoughts on paper? I find it difficult.
And I’m already sharing it hereFor verbally I don’t actually have a group or person who have kind of psychology knowledge. I’m surrounded with people who thinks only crazy and mentally unstable people needs psychotherapy – Crazy I know
SereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
Hope you’re doing wellGood to hear! Did you have a situation in which you stopped yourself from using sarcasm and responded differently?
Yes. I did stop sarcasm in a harmful way. It’s been more than a week I think
I’ve watched both of the videos about the Empathy
Important thing I realized that it makes them think you’re on their side and it builds trust and how much important communication style is… And also think how would I feel?And for anger
I found out that there is still some level of controlling behavior
Because of someone says No I can’t directly accept it. It really opened my eyes that it’s just my expatiations towards them. Also about making mistakes it’s the perfectionist inside of me that gets angry.
So it’s a signal and not a solutionI spent two hours on journaling this morning đ
Yes, the child always blames themselves when the parent criticizes them. Later, when you got older, you saw that their behavior was wrong, but the child part of you still believed that he is the one to blame, that heâs not good enough. And now your inner critic (which are the internalized voices of your father and mother) is blaming your inner child. The same dynamic as when you were a child, only now the critic is within your own head, not outside.
Yes I agree. That’s why today while meditating I tried to connect my inner child. And it did felt good. I think not just today but like I’m already connected with my innerself/child more or less because that’s why I rarely feel alone and very comfortable spending time with myself
You can try it when you get upset about something and your first reaction is to beat yourself up for not being super calm and serene. You can tell yourself âitâs okay Addy that you feel angry, no wonder you feel angry, this was indeed hurtful what they did⌠â And so you validate your own anger, instead of scolding yourself for it.
You can also get yourself a cute fluffy animal (a teddy bear or something that symbolizes your inner child) and hug that animal and talk to it, caress it⌠Maybe it will help you communicate better with your inner child if you have something physical, not just an image in your head.
I like how simply you guide with step by step. Maybe I’ll try that…
Although nowadays I did start spending time with my neighbor’s little kid. and oh boy It’s really fun. and funny enough I do feel kinda caring father towards him. I’m teaching him how to ride a bicycle and it did give me water in the corner of my eyes time to time.
So does that counts?You will, just have a lot of patience with yourself. Small steps, baby steps⌠and lots of validation of your own feelings, rather than judging yourself for it.
Also, if you get frustrated with yourself for not healing faster, instead of criticizing and blaming yourself, have empathy for yourself, have patience, tell yourself itâs okay, youâre fine, youâre lovable, thereâs nothing wrong with you⌠The key is self-acceptance, radical acceptance of all your feelings, allowing them to beâŚ. without judging yourself for it.
The paradox is that the more accepting we are of our âfaultsâ and âimperfectionsâ, the faster we heal. Thatâs the power of self-compassion.
Well as in INFJ + Aries it’s not really easy but yeah I’m trying and I’m lot patient than before
I’ve read that combing traits are great a visionary leader, but it can also present some challenges. Like struggle with self-doubt and insecurity, and find it difficult to trust own instincts and abilities, also have difficulty setting boundaries and saying no to others, and may feel overwhelmed by the demands and expectations of others
SereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
How are you? Recovered from Covid?The video is on youtube and is titled âUsing Empathy to Fuel Trustâ.
Thanks for sharing I’ll watch the video and let you know. Also I want to let you know nowadays I’m being more mindful about being empathic which does making me feel better.
something you expect from her, which she isnât fulfilling. The question is a) is it a reasonable expectation, and b) have you communicated it with her? Because she might be doing something innocent, but it is triggering your childhood wound and you feel similarly like you did in your childhood, and you want it to go away. But itâs not really your girlfriendâs fault, but your own unresolved issues.
That’s right but reasonable expectation or not I don’t want to get angry or disappointed. More like in serene state like I shouldn’t have problems with her actions, and I just have to see my reactions. and I can communicate first but If still she’s not able to understand then well we don’t need to continue doing the same spirals.
This might change, but for now, itâs still scary.
I want to change it. Yes
Alright, so youâre saying that you knew it was wrong, both your fatherâs and your motherâs behavior, already when you were a child? So you werenât blaming yourself for your fatherâs verbal abuse and your motherâs blaming you if you lost your temper?
Hmm so I knew they’re wrong yet still I blame myself sometimes. but you’re right it’s the self-critic
You as the adult Addy would need to get in touch with that child and tell him heâs not to blame. That thereâs nothing wrong with him. You, the adult Addy, need to show him love and compassion that neither of your parents showed to you as a child. You need to be a good and loving parent to that boy â thatâs how you will heal those childhood wounds. As I said, best do it in therapy.
Right and I did started practice (Mostly via sitting and imagination) that but because I didn’t do that before I don’t know how to do that progress of loving my inner child and being compassionate with him
Once you heal those core wounds (e.g. the wound of not being good enough), youâll have a different relationship with yourself. You wonât blame yourself any longer, youâll respect yourself more. And you wonât allow your parents to treat you with disrespect either. Youâll be able to set some basic rules for communication with them, so they cannot treat you the way they have been treating you all your life.
I totally agree I’m hope I’ll be able heal those core wounds of mine.
SereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
Iâm glad youâre doing better.you havenât started trusted them suddenly, right? You were still afraid that maybe you shared too much and that they havenât shared that much about their own weaknesses, which might put you in an unfavorable position.
You see? Their supportive reaction didnât do anything to disperse that fear of yours and make you trust them moreâŚYes youâre right and It does took time for me to start trusting them. Iâm guessing I need to loosen up hard grip a bit more
No, not at all. Not everyone is well intentioned and have our best interest in mind. You donât need to show too much vulnerability in professional settings. Or with acquaintances and people you only know superficially. Or even with some family members, with whom you donât feel safe.
I totally agree
And youâd need to be open to listen to your partner if she has such worries herself, and empathize with her, without judgment.
Both of you would need to be free to be yourself in the relationship, i.e. to be authentic, without sugar-coating things, pretending, hiding parts of yourself, or walking on eggshells etc.
Yes, I think some of these are the things that I have work on for my romantic relationships
That would include feelings of hurt, anger, sadness, impatience, envy, jealousy and other negative feelings that you may have either towards yourself, your partner, or other people. I am not saying you have all those feelings, just that these emotions would be unacceptable for you to express to your partner, right?
Yes so expressing this kind of negative feelings I just donât know how to do that well, I donât feel comfortable and I just try being more sarcastic or just sugar-coat things maybe?
For example, you said youâve been trying to be patient with your current girlfriend⌠but I can imagine it was hard for you, and you might have been trying to hide your anger and impatience? You didnât want to show it, but yet, you felt it?
Yes, Exactly!
Youâre still in the phase of looking for a suitable partner, right? And perhaps a suitable partner for you would be someone who shares the wanderlust, who likes to travel and hike and enjoys similar activities like you do. What I am trying to say is that having a deep, intimate relationship is not in contradiction with e.g. your love for adventure.
However, fear of emotional intimacy is indeed in contradiction with having a deep, intimate relationship. Those two donât go together.
That does sounds nice, But I donât really know what kind of person I want to be with or the fact if I want deep emotional intimacy with someone just yet. I just donât feel like ready for it?
Anyway, I think the solution is in rewriting some key scripts from your childhood, i.e. saying what needs to be said to your parents.
I think I already did that in my childhood like not in front of my parents but l did that because I knew that itâs wrong but out of respect I wasnât be able to tell them their mistakes
But I can try again in my imagination as you suggested
The above is called finishing the unfinished business. The best would be to do it in therapy, with a skillful therapist.
Okay I will do that. Probably from next month
(Donât do it to your parentsâ faces).
Obviously not.
The idea is to express what you need to express, feel all your emotions (including anger and hurt) and by doing that, put an end to the âold scriptâ. The old script is where you just endured and accepted abuse silently, made excuses for your father, and pretended that all is fine in front of your mother.
Yes expressing these things arenât easy for me but still Iâll try and hopefully finish this unfinished business and be strong and vulnerable at the same time.
you’re very understanding and insightful person. So thanks for your valuable insights, I highly appreciate it.đSereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
How are you feeling today?I see⌠your assumption here is that when you show weakness, youâll be attacked. Although you said that when you did share some of your weaknesses and vulnerability, both of your girlfriends showed understanding for it. They didnât attack you, condemn you or ridicule you.
âŚ..Can you see now how our childhood experience shapes our worldview, i.e. the narrative we live and operate in? To you, showing weakness means being attacked. And this is probably what prevents you from emotional intimacyâŚI mean yeah, I understand that. But thatâs why I said I need to develop the trust first. And I do have trust issues as well so⌠Are you suggesting that I should be vulnerable and showing weakness with everyone? At this day and age?
Youâre not a weak person â your parents gave you that message. Theyâve convinced you that you are. And a part of you (your inner child) believes them. Another part fights against it. Thatâs the Protector, who says âyou canât hurt me, Iâll never admit that youâve hurt me.â
You are indeed very resilient (youâve lived on your own since you were 16 or 17, right?)⌠but regardless of that, a part of you (your wounded inner child) feels weak. And the Protector part will do anything in his power not to show it to anyone. The Protector part will do everything to appear strong and cool. Thatâs the part that often uses sarcasmâŚ
Hmm Right I agree with this. And as I said before itâs the confusion and battle between these two things does tires me emotionally sometimes
Seems like you really want to be prepared for a âprojectâ called relationship. You want to plan everything, so you wouldnât fail and none of your weaknesses gets revealed, right? You want to pass it with flying colorsâŚ. But the thing is that if you plan too much, perhaps spontaneity is lost? If itâs a project, and youâre the project manager⌠whatâs the role of your girlfriend? The one who goes along and fulfills the plan set by you? I am being provocative here on purpose, but do think about itâŚ.
Not quite. I mean planning as like go and visit things and just different activities from both side obviously.
And Iâm actually a Product Manager so maybe thatâs why Iâm just more organizational.I do like the spontaneity… However about the weaknesses I may or may not be afraid of that thing. Because Iâm sharply honest⌠And another thing is that I think is weaknesses are just some things you havenât learned yet and to be honest it can be fun too. So in my 1st relationship I didnât knew how to drive that time.. So whenever we have to go out she used to drive and then later on she taught me too and It was really a fun experience. In 2nd relationship I learned that how much impatient I was with lot of things so I worked on that and I told her that as well. So I think itâs more like learning from each other and have fun with that.
But for emotional weaknesses in particular I havenât revealed too much I accept that.
Yes, I understand⌠but I donât think your reason for not settling is the fear of missing out. Because you said youâve never approach the girl first â itâs always them who approached you. This tells me youâre not a butterfly, wandering from flower to flower, afraid to miss out⌠You might have been fine alone, had those girls not initiated a relationship with you.
Thatâs why I think your fear of settling and commitment is caused by what weâve discussed above: your fear of showing weakness, i.e. being seen as weak.
When I said âDo not settleâ mindset I meant more for like places because Iâm just changing cities every few months. I need to explore lot of places and wonders of nature.
And Yeah Iâd be fine without those girls, but the thing is that Iâm grateful for that because all those girls taught me about myself (more or less) and also not to mention Iâve spent a quality time.
But yeah I do accept I fear being seen as weak.
SereneWolfParticipantAnd another thing is that I’m trying to love myself but I’m doubting myself too. Maybe that’s all these questions and confusion is there?
SereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
Hope you’d able to have good rest and recover. When I have sleep problems, I try warm milk or just warm honey + turmeric waterThis seems like youâre afraid of showing too much vulnerability,Â
I think Yes. and That’s why the shield because showing weakness meaning afraid of more attacks you know?
Also I was thinking like if I show me too much weakness how can I be the protective figure for them?So, weak is bad, but weaker than is even worse?
I guess so, Yeah
Or an even deeper fear: you donât want a committed relationship, because it would sooner or later reveal all of your (perceived) imperfections and weaknesses to the person, and you couldnât bear that?
Iâm not worried about the imperfections thatâs okay for me but I do worry about showing myself as a weak person. Because part of me doesnât accept that Iâm a weak person, The things Iâve been through the weaker person wouldnât be able to pass that. I know Iâm very resilient and strong about what I want.
I think Iâm fear of committed relationship maybe because of fear of missing out. Part of my mind thinks that my freedom wouldnât be the same. What if I meet someone better later on? Because now Iâm doing remote work and able to change cities whenever I want so I just want to explore more. But If I go for the committed route, It feels like Iâd just question my wanderer soul more because I do have what you can say âDo not settleâ mindset.
On another hand If I do start the dating or relationship, I make sure fulfilling my responsibilities from my side. Giving proper attention, Communication, Planning and Spending time together.
So for another fear that what if I hurt the person? Like obviously If we spending good time together there would be connection and etc. and then I show up like sorry but Iâm not ready for any commitment? You know what I mean?SereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
Right⌠so it seems to me that she felt inferior in your relationship, specially since youâve never or rarely shared about your own weaknesses and vulnerability……………………… And you didnât like that about her. So you stopped being attracted to her, and eventually left her. Does this roughly describe what happened?
Yes actually you guessed it very well.
 You did share some of your âimperfectionsâ and self-doubts. And how did they respond to that?
They both were supportive and trying show me the bright side. But even though I felt like I was being too much vulnerable with them and they’re kind of not that much open? But that may could be also because I told them about my complaining thing
You said that you start feeling trapped very soon after the initial elation about the girl. So when you shared those weaknesses or yours, being authentic, several months into the relationship â at that point did you already start feeling trapped in the relationship?
Hmm I mean I feel trapped after there is good bond. I know good enough about her and she knows good enough about me and then there’s this commitment you know like okay you both love each other and now you’re couple and then this fear of commitment and fear if we’re really good for each other.. about the future.. It just comes and starts to eat up my mind from everywhere and it makes me feel stuck…
So because of this fear of commitment and etc I talked to my friends and they told to go for casual things.. And I’m still confused if that’s really for me or not because I need to feel connected as well but without too much attachment…
Finally just tired and I’m just more focused on workSereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
I’m glad you’re feeling better todayshe wasnât being authentic with you and was faking that she likes the things you like, so that you would approve of her?
Maybe yeah I guess… and also I felt like she’s just doing too much for me, So I didn’t felt it right and I felt pressured and after that I started to question myself if I really love her.. So that’s whyLet me ask you something: with your later two girlfriends, have you sometimes shared when youâre not in the best mood, or when you have doubts about yourself (such as what youâve shared here on the forum: that you fear youâre not doing enough, not being successful enough, etc). Do you share those self-doubts with the person youâre involved with?
So yeah with my 1st girlfriend I wasn’t very vulnerable but with later two girlfriends yes.. but like after spending few months…
SereneWolfParticipantDear Tee and Dear Anita,
Tee Wrote*
If you believe that you cannot be honest with the other person, that you need to pretend to be perfect (perfectly happy and capable and optimistic and driven) â then no wonder youâll feel trapped.
So it seems to me that you believe â due to your childhood conditioning â that you need to fake it in relationships, and you donât want that. Youâd rather be alone.
Anyway, thatâs my best guessâŚ
What do you think?
 Anita Wrote*
While I am at it, examples: Oct 2: âDear Anita. How was your weekend?â, Oct 29: âDear Anita: How are you? Good Plans for the weekend?â â too close, too friendly, we are not that close. Feels Fake to me.I appreciate that. Maybe youâre right maybe youâre wrong I donât know
But as of now Iâm thinking like being fake like that takes an effort too. And I donât think Iâm that much effortful my relationships or with other peopleI prefer authenticity thatâs what I know
Because When I broke up with my 1st gf (Not LDR) Just because she was trying to fit in with me. I knew sheâs doing these things and showing sheâs enjoying (More or less) Hiking and Walking for hours at the beach..etc but I knew sheâd prefer more if itâs indoor activities
And thatâs what you can say not being authentic or faking?But what I agree with is this what you (Anita) told me before,
(2) your openings are very outgoing and very optimistic. Some people will like it, others will not feel anything in particular about it, and yet those of us who are significantly less outgoing and optimistic than you appear to be- will not like it. âI hope youâre having great Sunday morningâ- is too optimistic for me: I am not in the habit of experiencing great mornings, nor do I expect great mornings, or great days: good isâŚÂ good enough for me. When replying to a personâs message/ communicating with a person, pay attention to their style and somewhat adjust your outgoingness and optimism to theirs.
So that could be my communication part.
If (in another dimension) I was your age and I was your long-distance girlfriend, and this is how you opened your communications with me, I would feel inadequate for not having great and happy weekends myself, wondering:Â whatâs wrong with me for not having weekends as happy and as great as Addyâs?
Then my answer would No because in that case my opening communications would be lot different and even more on in your words âExtremely optimistic and outgoingâ
Iâm not sure how itâs in USA but things like this in my culture These are very basic gestures here
Dear Anita. How was your weekend?
Dear Anita, Hope youâre having a happy weekend
Have you eaten?
Did you sleep well?
How was your journeyâŚetc
Â
So again itâs my communication part
I should know that all doesnât come from same culture. And different people take this in different ways.
Addy
SereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
Oh, Iâm sorry to hear that. covid is still there? Well, I hope youâll be better. Are you trying lemon-ginger tea though? When I tested covid positive around a year ago
Drinking Warm Water instead of normal tap water and having lemon ginger tea at least 3 times a day helped me a lotI am not saying that you should be angry at either your father or mother, and go to attack them and tell them all your grievances. No, thatâs not what I am saying. But what I am saying is that you need to first accept that certain abuse and false, harmful conditioning happened in your childhood. Even if your parents didnât know better â even if they didnât do anything outside of your culture â still, they have harmed you. Their parenting left a mark on you, left certain wounds in your psyche, which you need to heal. If you want to have a happy and fulfilling life.
Admitting that the damage happened â even if your parents didnât do it on purpose â is the first step to healing.
*Sighs* Well yeah I already accepted that I didnât had the best childhood emotional needsâŚ
And Iâm not angry at my parents at all
But I said those things because Itâs better NOW
But youâre right damage is already done in the childhood and that I have to focus and healStarting of this thread Anita told me this,
âlike lot of people my parents didnât knew my emotional needs and they did what they thought is right for me. They just wanted to protect meâ-
â unfortunately, consequences donât care about reasons and intents: a child gets hurt in certain ways because of parentsâ behaviors regardless of the parentsâ intent or ignorance vs. knowledge/ education. Think of it this way, if you will: when you drop a piece of glass to the floor, it breaks regardless of your intent (dropping the glass on purpose or by accident), and regardless of your ignorance vs knowledge/ education (knowing or not that this particular glass will break if dropped to the floor)
And thatâs true. Because without accepting, I canât start my healing journey
SereneWolfParticipantDear Tee,
How’s your weekend going?Buckle up because this is going to be a long one đ
I guess you didnât want to admit it to your father out of spite, because you didnât want him to see you as weak and needy. Maybe another reason is that he didnât approve of âweakâ boys (maybe he sent you the message that âboys donât cryâ?)…….
The thing was that he was mostly indirectly comparing. Like He’s stronger/intelligent than you. (That’s how lot of village parents are) kind of competitive with kids… They be like my kid did this, My kid did that.. etc.. it’s just how it goes here even in small town areas… All just want to protect their own ego by using kids. Itâs sad but yeahâŚ
So I already knew no matter what I do someone would do something better and there’s just no end of that. So I decided like I’m out of the competition I don’t care what my father says anymore.
I donât need his approval. But when I stopped looking for his approval after few years when I started things by myself and doing well without his help heâs more supportive with me. Even though in my tough times my parents were supportive with me when I wasnât be able to find a job. But the thing is theyâre still comparing they see me better because some other kids in village in bad line of work and now heâs like weâre happy, You took your time but at least youâre not doing anything wrong. But thereâs also a thing about it. I definitely learned honesty from my parents. (Me and my parents talked about that on call for more than hour)
So yeah⌠Things are complex to explainEven to this day, you donât want her to see you in a bad mood. You put a big smile whenever you talk to her and pretend that all is well, donât you? And your mother likes it when you wear that signature smile of yours, âthe brightest smileâ.
In fact, this attitude of yours:
I donât want complaint about him or as a matter of fact complain about anything. I just donât see any value in doing that.
âŚ. seems to me like a direct consequence of your motherâs expectation/plea to stay silent and not to complain about your fatherâs abuse. There was no point in complaining because you didnât want to upset her. Was that the reason you left home at the age of 16 â so you wouldnât need to take your fatherâs abuse silently any more?
Hmm itâs not that my mother likes it when I hide, But thereâs a motherly thing you know, Like if Iâm sad and I just act like Iâm good she just knows.. Even on the phone. So also sometimes she pretends that she doesnât know that I know because she knows I donât like her seeing worried. But still tells me itâll be alright.
Now about my father.. I donât think she wanted stop complaining and blah blah blah.. One thing I learned from my mother is always try to look the side where youâre able to do positive action without conflict. (Because of the Family) And as I said before here people just respect their father more so the wife their husbands, And she just didnât wanted to make things worse between us. There was a time when I was talking rarely to my father (On the phone – Because Itâs been years Iâm living by myself) So she would just call me a tell me to talk to my father. Because my father had his own ego heâd be telling my mom that he misses me but he wouldnât directly call me.
So my mom to me is like âone of you have be the understanding one, Now you decideâ
Sheâs just trying our family to hold together,
And I have to respect the woman who put all things aside in her life just for a family.Itâs a false way to protect your heart, which results in you being insincere and cynical. A better way would be to say something like âWhat you just said hurt me. Please donât use that tone with me in the future.â So you express your vulnerability, but also your willingness to protect yourself and to set boundaries so people canât hurt you so easily. Perhaps it can be called the way of a gentle warriorâŚÂ
Hmm.. Not an easy thing to do.. But I can try and I can start by setting the boundaries which I never did before. So Iâll have to look into boundaries topic and be a Gentle warrior đ
You can tell me more about it if you wantSereneWolfParticipantDear Roberta.
She finished her task yesterday.
But before that I did ask if she’s able to do it within the deadline, She said yes, yet still I had to give her reminder the way I did, I know now it wasn’t the right waySereneWolfParticipantDear Anita:
Okay thanks next time I’ll try that. I want to be a good leader so feedback like this would definitely help me.SereneWolfParticipantDear Anita,
but itâs abuse nonetheless and it is not beneficial to the productivity of the company (she didnât yet complete the task). Plus, it doesnât make you look like a strong manager because your subordinate ⌠didnât complete the task yet.
Okay so what would you do if you’d be at my place as someone who’s managing the team?
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