Home→Forums→Relationships→What if you are the toxic person?
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January 13, 2019 at 10:49 am #274261LilyParticipant
Dear anita,
the last days were a bit better. I did the things I wrote about above. Just with my art projects, I found it hard to concentrate. During the last week I felt stressed and slept more than usually. But also couldn’t sleep so well at night. But hopefully, next week I will get back to getting more things done.
At the moment, I feel more impatient. Today I felt impatient with my friend. Sometimes I get annoyed over little things. At least I didn’t say or do anything bad. Hopefully, I wasn’t passive aggressive. It is hard for me to spend a lot of time with people…
I also don’t have much patience for my parents at the moment. Today I talked to them on the phone, but would have preferred not to. I think I wasn’t too cheerful there… I just felt stressed during the conversation. I didn’t say so much, maybe I was not so polite.
With my therapist, the last session went well. She said she does want to continue our therapy. When she said I should ask her how she feels, I misunderstood her. She meant that I can ask her about her opinion or impression, when I tell her about my life. I do have a good feeling about her.
We also talked in therapy about my family. Why is my sister more upset at my parents than me, when she was treated a little better? When I told my sister about the things my father said to me, she couldn’t really believe it. Or she didn’t know. Unlike me, she never felt hated by my father. She felt liked by him. She said that she thought he could see himself in her. Apparently my father never said such things to her and usually my parents also didn’t hit her.
That is a little update about the past days… Overall it was o.K.
How are you doing?
January 13, 2019 at 11:41 am #274269AnonymousGuestDear Lily:
Well, my leg is still recovering, the range of motion is not restored yet, and that means I am still limping. I am more mindful of my own anxiety than before. Before my injury I was stuck in a loop of overeating and over-exercising. Not as badly as years before, but still, badly enough to lead to my injury. The injury was such a shock, such an intense experience of fear, that it disabled that loop. But the loop will return if I am not mindful. When I walk again, able again, I don’t want to return to doing things same as I did before.
This is a longer answer to your short question, isn’t it?
That impatience experience, it may be a healthy impatience, that is, being impatient with the people you shouldn’t spend time with. I don’t mean your friend, I mean your parents.
I too need a lot of alone time.
Regarding your sister, my sister too has a very different understanding of my mother. It is often the case with siblings, experiencing childhood very differently. One reason is that of parents who treat different children differently, like in your case. Another reason is that different siblings take different roles within the family. Let’s say one sibling sees the older one being a trouble maker and getting in trouble for it, so she/he decides to be the good one, eager to please, and stay out of trouble.
I am glad you feel good about your therapist. I do hope she will help you as much as my therapist helped me 2011-2013, starting me on my healing process since.
In about half an hour I will be away from the computer until tomorrow, about seventeen hours from now.
anita
January 14, 2019 at 5:22 am #274409LilyParticipantDear anita,
I hope you get better soon. I can relate to what you said about your leg. Sometimes such negative experiences teach us to be more mindful and to change something. In a way, I feel similar about my experience with K. I became more mindful of some problems I need to work on.
What will you do to make the changes?
For me, I think I want to try to be more aware of my own feelings. Not react on impulse, instead take some time before I say yes or no to someting. Also, I want to finally work on becoming more confident. I hope that therapy will be helpful there.
You wrote: “This is a longer answer to your short question, isn’t it?”. I’m not so sure what (or if you wanted to tell me something?) you wanted to tell me there? Can you explain more? Or was it just a phrase and I’m overthinking again?
After thinking a lot about my past with my parents a lot of feelings are resurfacing. Maybe I need some distance from them. they have changed (at least my mother has) and they are now nicer to me, but still… I don’t know if I want to visit them during the semester break. Why do I have the one who always comes for a visit anyways? And I’m also a grown up with my own life now… I think I would rather work on projects for university.
I was wondering, why is my sister more angry than me? In the past it was different. I was very angry at my parents, even before my sister. Maybe it has to do with my failed career and my financial dependence on my parents. It makes me feel very guilty. It gave me the feeling that I don’t have the right to be angry at them. And I felt guilty, like a loser, like a failure. I was in no place to ask for something… That’s how I felt. Feeling this way didn’t help at all. It got me stuck.
Of course I am thankful for my parents helping me. But I need to work on becoming more independent. Often I avoid thinking about my career and the future. It feels impossible to get my life together. Where to start? First I need to finish my degree. While I do that I should think more about my options. Maybe get another job, where I can learn more. Work as an intern. volunteer. Inform myself more. A lot of these things are very scary to me. I feel like I am so far behind other people my age and don’t know how to catch up. But I must try. No I must do it . Somehow.
January 14, 2019 at 6:59 am #274419AnonymousGuestDear Lily:
Regarding my comment “This is a longer answer to your short question, isn’t it?”- in that comment is my discomfort about having shared very personal and current information about my life in the first paragraph, right above the sentence you are wondering about. This discomfort is mine, it is all about me and none about you. I am glad you asked, please continue to ask such questions because I will give you the honest information that you need to clarify unnecessary confusion.
I think that not visiting your parents during the semester break is an excellent choice and I hope you don’t, and instead work on those university projects.
I think that the best plan of action for you is really to finish your degree and get a job where you will be paid enough so that you are financially no longer dependent on your parents. That will free you from feeling the need to associate with them more, and any other distress that gets reactivated in their presence.
Focus on finishing your degree, keep your calm, and aim at a future job that will make you financially independent of them.
Regarding me not getting stuck again in that loop, what you wrote applies to me to: “I want to try to be more aware of my own feelings. Not react on impulse, instead take some time before I say yes or no to something”. I will add to it, that I intend to pay attention to those strong feelings/ impulses before they get too strong and quiet them down. Feelings are powerful forces, so recognize them as they appear, not wait until they grow and grow and become overwhelming.
anita
January 15, 2019 at 3:08 am #274611LilyParticipantDear anita,
I am happy we can communicate so openly and that we can ask each other, if there is a misunderstanding. This is so different from my experience with K. He never said what bothered him, if I asked him something he sometimes ignored it. It made me feel so crazy. But maybe I should also learn how to deal better with such behaviour? I don’t think I want to communicate with people I can’t be open with anymore. Or at least not become closer to them, until I feel more comfortable. Only open up, if they do. And if their reaction to my openness makes me feel uncomfortable, maybe share less personal things. Does this make sense?
You can share personal things about yourself if you want (or not share anything, if you prefer). I wasn’t bothered at all. Sometimes I just don’t have much to say about it. I feel weird giving advice to others, like I am not in a position to give advice at all, as I am so confused myself. Like once, I responded to a girl on this forum. But afterwards I thought: who am I to give advice to others??
My parents are usually more nice to me now. They are not toxic. We don’t talk about our problems or past. Especially my mother tries to be really friendly. She even started to hug me, when we meet. On the phone she started to say: “I love you”, which makes me feel slightly uncomfortable. But I respond back.
My father is still a difficult person, who sees the bad in others but doesn’t want to face his own problems. But he is nicer to me than in the past. He doesn’t say such terrible things to me anymore.
Still, I feel that I need more distance from my parents at the moment. And I also should use my time to finish my degree.
I have such big fears about the future. But this already started when I was very young. I never felt good enough. I felt like I would never amount to anything. It became a self – fulfilling prophecy. Now it is even harder to get out of this. I wish I would have seeked help sooner, but it took me a while to realize how big my problems were.
What do you do after you recognize your feelings? What do you do to quiet them down? It is hard for me to not get overwhelmed and panic at times. And I think this keeps me stuck.
January 15, 2019 at 5:31 am #274625AnonymousGuestDear Lily:
“But maybe I should learn how to deal better with such behavior”, that is with a person like K who communicated poorly with you- I say only if you have to interact with a person like that in the context of a workplace or class in university, but in personal relationships it is crucial that the person communicates well with you. If the person doesn’t, do not be in a relationship with that person, it is simply not healthy for you, to be guessing and ruminating. You have to be with a person who tells you like it is for him or her. So you know. So you don’t guess and ruminate and feel bad!
You wrote that you don’t want to get closer to people “until I feel more comfortable. Only open up, if they do… “- yes, it does make a lot of sense to me. Share a little personal thing with a person you don’t know. See if he shares a bit about himself. Then share a bit more. But also ask a question like you asked me, about what he meant by this or that. See if he answers you clearly, like I did. If not, there is no match.
Regarding my sharing with you something personal, I wasn’t looking for advice. If I did look for advice I would have asked you for advice. I think that I felt more comfortable (or less uncomfortable) sharing with you than with anyone else that morning.
It looks like your parents took a Nice Class and are nicer to you now. Unfortunately their un-niceness got registered in your brain during your formative childhood years. Therefore “I need more distance from my parents” reads good to me.
You wrote that you fear the future, that you “get overwhelmed and panic at times”, and you asked: “What do you do to quiet (overwhelming emotions/fear) down?”
My suggestions:
1. Focus on how you Function, not on how you Feel. You have a vicious inner critic, so you are not going to feel good on an ongoing basis for a long, long time. Accept it and focus on how you function. Meaning keep working on a task even though you don’t feel good.
2. Create a daily routine for yourself, nothing like routine to quiet an anxious person.
3. Incorporate a long fast walk into your daily routine. The fast walking will be the aerobic exercise that will and does really, quiet an anxious person.
4. Avoid bad communicators like K because having such people in your personal time robs you of your time, takes your brain for an unnecessary distressing ride and harms you further.
5. Counter the inner critic’s comments with realistic thoughts that are true to reality and will encourage you to function better. And in that struggle between the vicious inner critic and your scared and sad inner child, take the side of that child in you. Do so again and again.
anita
January 16, 2019 at 5:50 am #274885LilyParticipantDear anita,
thank you for your helpful post!
Everything sounds very good. I tried to make a routine of my own:
– Wake up at 7 am (earlier on work days)
– Shower, make breakfast, make bed etc.
– Don’t use the internet in the morning. Ideally only use it in the evening for about 1 h. But not using it in the morning is a good start.
– Go to work / Uni or work for at least one hour (better start small) in the morning
– Cook /Eat
– Go to university or work at least one hour at home
– Go for a walk or exercise
– Clean up for 30 Minutes
– Eat
– Wash face, brush teeth etc.
– Read a book at 9 pm
– Sleep at 10 pm
– Maybe have one day off per week?
I think I will try this and then I can tell you how it went in a few days or weeks… I should also work more on countering my inner critic. When I see my therapist in a few days I will talk to her about it. Maybe I can ask her if I can make some sort of diary for this. Then we can review it together when I see her again.
Thank you a lot! I hope you are well!
January 16, 2019 at 7:18 am #274915AnonymousGuestDear Lily:
You are welcome!
Your routine plan reads good to me as a starting point. As you follow it make changes and adjustment according to your experience with it, improve it over time as you learn more about what serves you well and what doesn’t.
I hope your new therapist will be able to help you with countering your inner critic, maybe she can offer you resources, maybe a workbook for countering the inner critic that I don’t know about. Maybe she knows of one.
anita
January 22, 2019 at 2:11 am #276057LilyParticipantDear anita,
in the last days I tried to stick to my routine, but I am still struggling.
You will be disappointed to hear that K. wrote to me again. It is my goal to not make rushed choices anymore and communicate better, so I want to ask for advice. After he seemed not interested in a final talk, I didn’t respond anymore. In a moment of anger, I deleted him off my facebook friends list. Afterwards I felt bad about it, for not communicating clearly. But in the end, we had ended it, so it was o.K., right? Some guilty feelings stayed though.
He wrote to me again, asking how I was. Because I still had those guilty feelings and also didn’t want to make him feel bad, I responded. I told him that I am o.K. and asked how he was. He said he wasn’t doing well, that it was difficult. When I asked what had happened, he only said that he can only tell me later, because he is in the library now. So I said that he can tell me more, but that I don’t want to bother him now (I regret saying this, I didn’t want to make him feel guilty), because he surely wants to study now. That we can talk later, if he wants to. So we said until later. He also said “thank you” and I asked “thank you for what?” (I regret this, why couldn’t I have just said nothing or thank you??)
Now I feel like this is unfinished. Saying “until later” seems unfinished. I want to draw a final line, to end it. For my own peace of mind, because I have this nagging feeling that I didn’t end it properly, that I am not a good communicator. Or should I just let it be? I still don’t understand why he tells me he isn’t feeling well, but then doesn’t tell me more. If he doesn’t want to talk about it, why bring it up?
I tried to write a message:
“Hi
We said “until later”, but then we didn’t talk. It feels weird to me, unfinished.
Often I didn’t know what you think or want, or what bothers you. Sadly, I also didn’t have the courage to ask.
If you still want to talk about something, we can do this.
If not, it is also o.K.
Otherwise I just hope that you are doing well.
I really wish the best for you! Good luck with your exams, hopefully it doesn’t get too stressful. I wish you success, health and a good time with your family.
Goodbye.”
What do you think? Or should I just let it be? I am sorry to bring up that topic again, anita. I just feel so unsure. It’s hard for me to communicate with him. And I feel like I have no social competence… But before I do something stupid again, I wanted to ask for advice.
January 22, 2019 at 3:33 am #276063LilyParticipantDear anita,
I am glad that I didn’t send the message. Maybe it is the best to just let it be.
January 22, 2019 at 7:45 am #276089AnonymousGuestDear Lily:
Let’s look at what happened most recently (not exact words): he is in the library, texting you:
He: How are you?
You: Okay, How-are-you?
He: I am not doing well, it is difficult.
You: What-happened?
He: I can’t tell you now, I’m in the library. I will tell you later.
You: You can tell me later, I don’t want to bother you while you are in the library and you want to study. We can talk later if you want to.
He: Okay, later. Thank you.
You: Thank you for what?
He: (don’t know his answer to the above, if any).. Until later.
My input:
1. You wrote to him that you don’t want to bother him while if anyone bothered anyone it is he who bothered you. He texted you, not the other way around. The fact (if true) that he was in the library texting you was his choosing, not yours. You were confused when you told him: “I don’t want to bother you”, he contacted you, not the other way around. It is not that he was sitting in the library studying and you contacted him, then found out he was studying in the library.
2. It is not fair or honest or kind of him to contact you to tell you that something is bothering him, but then to not tell you anything at all about what it is that is bothering him.
Why would he do that, I ask myself. One possibility is that he wants to have sex with you and is preparing the next sexual meeting, where he will be sexually serviced by you. That already happened, you automatically taking responsibility for nothing that you did wrong, for anything and everything, whether he shares with you what it is, or not, willing to service him sexually so to make him feel better, no matter how uncomfortable you are doing so.
In other words, the only motivation that comes to my mind on his part is to-be-sexually-serviced. It makes me sick thinking this way and the idea that you will rush to accommodate him, if you did, makes me sick indeed.
My advice: send him a message to not contact you anymore, to not text you, not call you, nothing. Do not apologize, make it short and assertive. Do not wish him a good life etc. Nothing except: do-not-contact-me again, you are not welcome in my life!
anita
January 22, 2019 at 8:38 am #276115LilyParticipantDear anita,
thank you for your input.
I will tell him to not contact me again. I never intended to meet him again or sexually service him. Really not! It is over for me.I just got confused, I think. But if he had asked me to see him, I would have said no. I am sorry that I made you feel sick.
January 22, 2019 at 8:42 am #276117AnonymousGuestDear Lily:
The idea that you will sexually service him infuriated me. I wasn’t under the impression that you were about to do that, but I know it happened before and the idea that it will happen again, just the idea of it, really got to me. I don’t want this to happen again, not with him, not with anyone else.
You didn’t make me sick, the past behavior I mentioned made me sick. It is not that uncommon of a behavior, Lily. It happens a lot, and it is unfortunate.
Do you want to write here the message you intend to send him?
anita
January 22, 2019 at 9:19 am #276129LilyParticipantDear anita,
I am sorry. I also don’t want this to happen again. And I want to not meet any men and spend more time alone in general.
I will write to him: “Please don’t contact me anymore. It is over and I want to move on with my life. Goodbye.”
January 22, 2019 at 9:22 am #276131AnonymousGuestDear Lily:
Excellent. The “Please” is more politeness that I see necessary, but it is okay to start your sentence with please, I suppose, as long as this is the last politeness that you extend to him. I am impressed by the assertive, short sentence, my goodness, you do have it in you to be assertive!
anita
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