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  • #314471
    Joe
    Participant

    About 2 months ago we were getting pizza. I ran into get it, she looked through my texts and saw one from a guy friend of mine she didn’t like. He was rude to her a few months back. When I got back in the car she asked me if I’d ever talked to him. I said no because I hadn’t. The last time we had an actual conversation I asked him to apologize to her and he said he wouldn’t. Coincidentally, he had invited me and another friend to his house earlier in the week. Maybe it was an attempt to reach out to me. Maybe he just didn’t consider our last conversation. He’s a very oblivious person which is why he ended up offending her. He says and does things that a person just shouldn’t do at 26. He’s cocky to the point of being arrogant and always thinks he right even though he never is. (I’ve known him since 6th grade and our parents are neighbors.) However, I didn’t go because I was going to be hanging out with my girlfriend. So I replied to the invite saying “maybe, probably going out though.” After that I never really thought about it again because it wasn’t important. I would have told her about it if it was. She never explicitly asked me to not be friends with this kid. I took it upon myself to tell him we weren’t going to be around each other if he didn’t apologize.

    So to make a long story short, she’s mad that I lied to her about speaking to this guy even though it was literally a 2 text exchange between us. As I said I hadn’t talked to him for months out of respect for her because he said he wouldn’t apologize. We fought that night. I tried to apologize and explain that I didn’t lie with any malice in my heart, I just didn’t think it was something worth telling. This was Saturday night.

    I asked her why she went through my phone. I never gave her any reason to not trust me. She said she did it because I said I had nothing to hide. And I didn’t have anything to hide. I didn’t know it was a problem to decline an invitation. She says it’s not that I texted him it’s because I lied when she asked me about it. But again, it was literally an invite in a group message where I declined with one sentence. I didn’t consider that the same thing as talking.

    Sunday morning we spoke over text still arguing then we didn’t speak until Tuesday. She said she would give me another chance. On Thursday night she sent me this nice text saying “I’m sorry for being so distant  but when you lied it crushed me.” She also said she wished we were together laying under the stars. I was very touched and reiterated how much I care for her and how much I regret the argument. Friday afternoon she texted me again and asked me to call her because she needed to talk. She told me how she was thinking we needed to take some time off and just be friends for a while. Which I Saudi said I couldn’t do. I see so much more for us and I want to touch and kiss her. I’d feel like an ass watching other guys come up to her and not being able to do anything about it. She said she needed time to think about what she wants and that she needed to be single.

    You see, she was in a two year relationship before ours. When we started up she had only been out of it for a few months. She once hinted that it had gotten pretty brutal for a while. So it felt like at times she was comparing me to her ex. Who by all account was a real douche. He was about 8 years older and didn’t have an actual job. I won’t say what he did but it wasn’t exactly legal. Let’s just say he fancied himself as a Soprano or Godfather type, when in reality it seems like he was more like Jersey Shore.

    However, it’s worth noting that a few weeks earlier she had told me that she was falling in love with me and how she feels safe with me and how she a future together. And that she trust’s me and knows I would never do things to hurt her. We would text every day and we always told each other how happy we were that we reconnected. We worked at the mall together in college. Ironically, we weren’t really friends. I was actually closer to her sister.

    It’s also worth noting that it was her idea to have sex the first time and become official. The original plan was to wait, establish ourselves and then move on to the physical relationship. I was fine with that. I was okay going as slow as needed. The night it happened I constantly asked her if she was sure she wanted to take that step.

    I’ve tried to reach out a couple times. Admittedly, it was probably too much.

    The first time it was because she had left some stuff at my house and I asked if she wanted it. Also, we had booked a trip together and I wanted to know if I should cancel it. I didn’t want to but she told me I should. Then I tried to explain that I miss her and want to work through the issue. That we don’t have to throw everything away. She responded by saying she didn’t know what I wanted her to say. That she asked me for space and that I only gave it to her for a a few days. And that I was only going to push her away more by being emotional. Then I didn’t contact her for a week.

    I noticed that she had Venmo’d me money. I didn’t know what it was for so I asked, turns out it was half the cancellation fee. After a few messages back and forth I sent this:

    “I’m not sure if this is the right thing to do. But I’ve been thinking about what happened between us and I really regret it. I should have handled it differently. The interaction I had with him was insignificant to me but I should have thought about you. l should have just told you when you asked me about it. There was no malice, I just wasn’t thinking clearly. I should I have told him again that there would be no hanging out until he apologized to you because you’re the one who is important to me. I understand why you feel betrayed. And you’re right, I was less than trustable and I apologize. But I can be better. I pray this isn’t done for forever.”

    She didn’t respond. I let my emotions get the best of me and messaged her a couple more times. I shouldn’t have.

    When she responded about 2 days later, she told me to let it go. However, she also once told me that she likes people who are persistent.

    Literally the night before, she was talking to me about how good we were together and talking about “our wedding” and “our kids” and how she picked out names already.

    I went no contact for about a month and about 2 weeks ago now, I reached out. Just said “Hi. How’s everything? Been thinking about you.” She replied the next day with  “You are starting to scare me how you are acting. First you were blowing me up and then sent me an email, followed me on Instagram then deactivated it, now you deactivate your Facebook.”

    Which I did. She kind of asked me to delete my IG when we started dating because of other girls. I didn’t have a problem with that.  But when we broke up I made an account again. I followed her because she showed up in my suggested friends list. I know it may seem like I was trying to keep tabs on her but I swear that was not the case. If anything, my mind was telling me to rebound and try to reconnect with a girl I used to talk to but turned down a few months prior.

    (I don’t know why it matters that I deactivated my social media. I don’t know how she would even know unless she was actually trying to look at my profiles.)

    I decided that wasn’t at all what I really wanted so I deleted the Instagram account the next day. Then I deactivated my Facebook because I was scared of what I might see and so I wouldn’t contact her there.  Anyways, on Saturday I responded with “I was only trying to give you space like you asked. I deleted Instagram because I don’t like it. And I’ve been afraid of what I might see on Facebook so I deactivated it. I’m certainly not trying to scare you. I care about you. But I’ll stay out of contact if it’s what you want.”

    Last week, she popped up in a dream of mine so when I woke up I sent what I would consider the clean-slate text. I said “Hi, just wanted to apologize for the way I acted. I understand if you don’t want to speak to me. I swear to remain out of contact but I had to apologize one last time.” Then I deleted her number so I can’t text her again.

    I have been trying to work on myself, I joined a gym, interviewing for new jobs, starting praying/going to church when I can even started talking to a therapist.

    I know what I need to change in a relationship. I need to stop being so anxious and needing reassurance. I just feel like I’ve always had bad luck and things are too often too good to be true. This situation hasn’t helped that at all.

    I know for a fact that I treated her better than any man ever has in her life because she, her friends and sister told me as much. And by all accounts she really liked me. After our second date, she told me she felt like we had a connection. Like we were both supposed to be there and she cut contact with some other guys she had been talking to because she only wanted to pursue things with me.

    It’s obvious she has some trust issues. She told me every boyfriend she’s ever had cheated on her and the last on abused her. She told me that her dad even cheated on her mom when she was little and they got divorced. Growing up, she only lived with him because she had to but they have no contact now.

    There have been other instances of her showing trust issues. On our fourth date, she accused me of looking at other girls. I wasn’t.  I just have a tendency to look around the room, especially when I’m out in public or in unfamiliar places. Another time she told me she had a dream that I was only using her to get close to her friend. Which of course wasn’t true as I didn’t even know her friend. The only time I was around her friend was the few times all the couples went to dinner.

    One night we went to a baseball game and as were walking, I noticed that the couple in front of us was holding hands. I tried to hold her hand and be flirty and affectionate and she got mad because she didn’t like PDA. I didn’t consider holding hands PDA. However, the next night, she got mad at me again because she wanted be to be affectionate in public and I kind of pulled away because of the argument we had the night before. I just didn’t know what she wanted. We fought again that night but then from that point on everything was good because she said I reassured her that I’m a genuine person and that I truly care about her. Which is what prompted her to tell me she was falling in love with me. Because as we were fighting that particular night, I said “I don’t want to lose you but I can’t keep arguing over insignificant things. I’ll leave but it will be on you to reach out to me if you want this.” That’s when she said don’t do that because she’ll never make the first move. And then everything was going very well until about a month later when she looked at my phone and saw that that guy invited me to his house with other friends.

    As I said, within the first two weeks of the breakup I reached out too much. But I was torn between her saying she likes guys who are persistent and trying to give her space.

    I do want to fix things, obviously, but I don’t know if I’m ever going to get that chance. I’ve never been the type to go overboard with a girl. In the past, when things haven’t worked out with someone I’ve talked to, I may have been sad for a few days but I’ve always been able to move on.

    I know there are red flags but I think things can be worked out.

    I felt things for her that I’ve never felt in my life and I really don’t want to see this end permanently because I know there were genuine feelings there but anxiety and immaturity got in the way.

    I feel like I should just let it go because things haven’t improved. Its been about six weeks in all and I feel more helpless and hopeless every day. But at the same time, I feel like it can’t be the end because if she ever truly felt half the way she said she did then this shouldn’t change that, right?

    #314475
    Joe
    Participant

    sorry for the extra characters everyone. not sure where those are from.

    #314481
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Joe:

    If your friend was indeed rude to her and refused to apologize to her, then when he invited you to a party you should not have replied “maybe” but instead, you should have communicated to him that there would be no hanging out until he apologized to her. That was your mistake.

    Problem is, you apologized to her and did an excellent job apologizing: you expressed regret and you were very honest in it. You specified to her your mistake very accurately: “I should have told him again that there would be no hanging out until he apologized to  you”.

    You wrote to her: “I understand why you fee betrayed. And you’re right, I was less than trustable and I apologize. But I can be better”- a perfect apology.

    And yet, she was not touched by it, “She didn’t respond”- this is The Problem: when she is suspicious (as she often is), she is heartless. To not respond and to never acknowledge such a heartful apology for so long is heartless.

    “I do want to fix things”- I don’t think you can fix heartless. I am guessing that a healthy, loving relationship for her is impossible with anyone because she is very likely to get suspicious with everyone, look for evidence.. and find it. If she finally does forgive you for that one mistake you made (and apologized for honestly and perfectly), she will find something else. And then, heartless again, is what I figure.

    anita

    #314491
    Inky
    Participant

    Hi Joe,

    To be honest, this chick seems like she’s the dreaded Too Much and Not Enough. Too much drama over small things, and for what?

    And your guy friend? Is his friendship worth it? Are you going to introduce him to your next girlfriend only for him to piss her off as well? Dump him! He also is Too Much and Not Enough.

    Best,

    Inky

    #314635
    Joe
    Participant

    I did cut contact with him. She was the important one, not him. I didn’t talk to him for two months until he sent the invite and haven’t talked to him since. That was in July, its now the end of September

    There are two reasons I responded “maybe.”

    1) because that’s how everyone in our friend group responds to things. its stupid, i know. but it means “no.”

    2) because i didn’t want to lose touch with my other friends. who, by the way, all agreed with me and said he should apologize.

    but even though i said “maybe” i did not go. nor did i have any intention of going because i went out with her and as i said, she was who i wanted to be with.

    • This reply was modified 5 years, 3 months ago by Joe.
    #314641
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Joe:

    Your mistake was small and you apologized thoroughly, did an excellent job apologizing. On the other hand, she shouldn’t have checked your phone, spying on you.

    You wrote: “I asked her why she went through my phone. I never gave her any reason to not trust me. She said she did it because I said I had nothing to hide”-

    – she said she did it because you said you had nothing to hide, so she wanted to check and see if you were lying and had something to hide. She didn’t say that she shouldn’t have invaded your privacy, betraying your trust in her (!), she didn’t apologize for that, did she.

    Her behavior means that if you were to resume a relationship with her, you would have to accept that your phone is not your private belonging and that all your communications with other people,  on your phone, are subject to her examination, evaluation and judgments anytime she can.

    Not a good prospect, is it- to live like that- always under suspicion.

    anita

     

    #314643
    Joe
    Participant

    I agree.

    She was wrong to go through my phone. Especially, since like I said, she told me how she trusted me and knew I would never do anything to hurt her.

    I just really, genuinely cared for her and thought she felt the same for me based on things said and done and what people close to her said.

    I wasn’t trying to deceive her in any way. I really just thought I was declining and invitation and that’s it. I could have been more forceful but I didn’t want to put any more energy into trying to get him to apologize. He won’t because he’s selfish.

    I want to have faith that it will resolve and she’ll see how much a care for her but I can’t stop thinking about it. And ironically, I feel like it’s not getting better because of that.

    I don’t what to do in regards to this situation. But I know how hurt I am that it seems to be ending over something that can be worked out. And I know how hurt I’ll be if I see her with another guy.

    #314645
    Valora
    Participant

    Hi Joe,

    I think your girlfriend has VERY unreasonable expectations. I think it’s reasonable to assume you wouldn’t even remember that short conversation with your friend and it should be understandable that you saying you hadn’t talked to him WASN’T an intentional lie and that you just didn’t remember that time he’d asked you to a party. Also, why is this even an issue with her when you hadn’t promised her you’d stop talking to him in the first place?

    I also think she should not have been going through your phone as that’s crossing a privacy boundary, especially if she has no reason to suspect that you’re being unfaithful. She shouldn’t have to verify your faithfulness. How would she feel if you just randomly went through her phone?

    I don’t think you’re the one that made a mistake here. If it were me, I would be mad at HER, as I would if I had a boyfriend that did something similar to me. It’s not acceptable behavior. I totally think she’s the one that needs to give the apology, too, and she should change that behavior if she, herself, wants to remain trustworthy (You cannot trust her around your phone at this point).

    I do think it was good of you to distance yourself from the rude friend when he upset your girlfriend because it showed that you were on your girlfriend’s side and supportive of her feelings, but what was it that your friend did? Was she overreacting with that, too?

    It sounds like she has some very serious trust and control issues that I would ask her to work on if SHE wants to continue a relationship with YOU. Otherwise, I’d go find yourself someone who shows you the trust you deserve, as long as you are being worthy of it, and who also doesn’t try to control you.

    • This reply was modified 5 years, 3 months ago by Valora.
    #314655
    Joe
    Participant

    Here’s what the friend did:

    we were out at a bar. it was her idea to invite my friends because she had invited hers.

    She and I were dancing. My friend, who by the way is no longer my friend, ended up meeting up with a girl he had been dating.

    My girl asked them to come out and dance with us. My “friend” gave her the finger. My back was turned to him so I didn’t see it.

    But when I found out, I told him to apologize or leave. He chose to leave.

    He probably thought he was being funny. But he shouldn’t have done that to someone he just met.

    Also, she says she saw my eyes wonder over to her phone a few times while she was texting when we were in the car.

    She had told me that an ex boyfriend of hers occasionally texted her. I wasn’t cool with that but I never said “you can’t talk to him.” I’m just not like that. But I never picked up her phone and looked through the messages.

    Is that unreasonable?

     

    • This reply was modified 5 years, 3 months ago by Joe.
    • This reply was modified 5 years, 3 months ago by Joe.
    #314689
    Valora
    Participant

    Yeah, your friend does owe her an apology and shouldn’t have done that to someone he first met, but if he’s like that with everyone, it’s also likely he didn’t mean it as an insult and it would be helpful for her if she just learned to let stuff like that roll off her shoulders instead of letting it affect her, but you did the right thing by supporting her and he does owe her an apology.  I don’t think she’s in the right for yelling at you or even getting upset with you.

    And eyes wandering to a phone while someone is texting, if you even did do that (as she’s accused you but you didn’t say you actually were) is still a lot different than her picking up your phone when you were not around and actively searching the contents. That’s just not even close to the same thing.

    So I still think she is the one being unreasonable here and it just seems like really controlling behavior on her part.

    #314701
    Joe
    Participant

    the funny thing is, even when were breaking up, she told me she knows that I’m good for her and she sees us ending up together.

    and i know for a fact that i treated her better than anyone ever has. she says every guy she ever dated cheated on her. and the last one may have been abusive.

    i just don’t understand how feelings do a complete 180 in 24 hours.

    it safe to say i just feel bad about the whole thing and i can’t seem to shake it.

    #314709
    Valora
    Participant

    Well that explains her trust issues, but that is something she needs to work on for herself and to not take out on you. It’s very, very important that you are assertive with her if you do get back together so that she understands that you are not them and that treating you like you are not worthy of trust because they weren’t isn’t okay. You should not have to be punished for what other people have done to her, and her snooping and acting like you are untrustworthy is basically a punishment.  So be assertive with her on that… that’s something she needs to fix to have a healthy relationship with anyone, especially someone who IS trustworthy, or your relationship is bound to fail later on anyway if she keeps that up.

    We can’t help how we feel, but just try not to feel too bad because you really didn’t do anything wrong and I don’t really know what you could’ve done differently. I’m sure, when she’d asked, if you’d remembered talking to him that one time during the 2-month separation from your friend, you would’ve said that, right? If so, that was an innocent mistake on your part and it’s important that SHE be more understanding, too. And it’s honestly a petty thing to get mad about anyway and she should NOT have been snooping through your phone.

    Just give her time though… hopefully she’ll realize (or one of her friends will and will point it out to her) that she is in the wrong here… but again, it’s important that she fixes her trust issues if you guys are going to have a successful healthy relationship.

    #314727
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Joe:

    It is possible that she likes tough guys, like her ex boyfriend who “fancied himself as a Soprano or Godfather type”-  man who will not hold her hand in public, like you  did (and she got angry at you for PDA).

    When she told you that she “likes people who are persistent”, maybe she meant that she likes men who are aggressively persistent, like a Godfather type. When you reached out to her in a loving-and-gently persistent way, she didn’t like  it.

    What I am saying is that it’s a possibility that she is attracted to tough, insensitive, rude guys and not to the affectionate, kind and decent man that you appear to be.

    anita

    #314747
    Joe
    Participant

    I try to be that way. Like I said, I genuinely care/cared about her. Idk what to feel. It’s been two months and I honestly thought we would have resolved things by now. Again, I’ve been doing things to try to better myself. It just hurts that something so small turned into all this. It’s really my first heart break I guess.

    By the way, I have posed my question on other advice boards and you folks are way nicer and more understanding. Just wanted to say that.

    #314749
    Valora
    Participant

    Hi Joe,

    Anita brought up a REALLY good point. If this is the case, you two probably aren’t a good match for each other and it might be better for you in the long run to find a woman who appreciates you just as you are and for the things that you do and who will trust you and not try to tell you what to do (because they will know you’re trustworthy). There are plenty of women out there like that and you would likely have a much better relationship with them rather than being in a relationship with someone who is sort of expecting you to be someone you’re not.

    And also thank you for the compliment towards the members of this board!  I really like reading the responses people give here, too, for that reason. Everyone is really helpful.

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