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anita.
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December 5, 2025 at 10:21 am #452617
PeterParticipantThis Topic is intended to be about thoughts on flow, on stepping off the raft, and perhaps discovering heaven beneath our feet.
The raft carries us across the river of striving, but once we reach the shore, we no longer need to cling to it. What matters is not belief in the raft, but the lived crossing and embodiment of arrival. And when we step onto solid ground, we find that heaven is not a distant promise above, but the constancy beneath each step, the stillness of the earth itself. To walk here with awareness is to know that the Tao is already present, not as something to believe, but as something to experience directly.
Lao Tzu’s Tao Te Ching, Chapter 16, as interpreted by Ursula K. Le Guin:
“Become totally empty.
Quiet the restlessness of the mind.
The ten thousand things arise together;
In their arising is their return.
Now they flower,
and flowering,
sink homeward,
returning to the root.The return to the root is peace.
Peace: to accept what must be,
to know what endures.
In that knowledge is wisdom.
Without it, renin, disorder.To know what endures
is to be openhearted,
magnanimous, regal, blessed,
following the Tao,
The way that endures forever.
The body comes to its ending,
but their is nothing to fear.In a world of constant notifications, deadlines, and noise, Lao Tzu’s call to “become totally empty” is more relevant than ever. Mindfulness is not about escaping life but about returning to the root… finding stillness beneath the swirl of activity. When we pause, breathe, and observe without clinging, we see that everything rises and falls naturally.
Constancy, as Le Guin interprets, is the quiet rhythm of life that doesn’t change: the breath, the turning of seasons, the pulse of the present moment. By recognizing this constancy, we cultivate openness. An openness that leads to compassion, and compassion shapes how we act, with dignity, patience, and presence.
Mindfulness, then, is not a trendy practice but a timeless way of living, flowing with the Tao. It teaches us that while our bodies and circumstances shift, the deeper awareness, the Tao—remains. In that awareness, we may find resilience, clarity, and peace.
December 5, 2025 at 10:51 am #452620
James123ParticipantDear Peter,
Great topic.
I would like to add very key point(which i have spent years on it and when i realized ox was domesticated) :
Actually it is not finding stillness, but it is stepping back from that which who tries to find stillness.
The key is action, finding or doing not, but with effortless, non action or just stopping mind or ego activity becomes so obvious.
Peace.
December 5, 2025 at 3:19 pm #452639
AlessaParticipantHi Everyone
Thank you for sharing Peter, as always a lot of interesting thoughts! ❤️
I have been thinking here and there about this. Considering the point Peter made about language earlier too. Always, so busy. 😮💨
I feel like language is used to understand each other. That being said, it is imperfect. But people want to know when they are in danger. They want to understand. They want to feel understood and cared about. They want to be free. They want to know when they are being threatened. They want to understand when they need to protect themselves. And everyone is different, so people make their best guess based on their experiences. Just my impression. ❤️
A baby’s first words are based around expressing autonomy and desire. Getting attention and praise. No. Why. Yes. Food. Body parts. Animals. Colours. Shapes. Building a vocabulary. The frustration at not being understood lessens.
I’m starting to understand the huge amount of work that goes into seemingly basic tasks. So many layers. We commit these things to muscle memory and forget about the huge amounts of training and effort it took to even achieve them. So much for free will, when many things we do have been rehearsed and become habit.
But yes, flow. I guess to me, it means accepting everything. Even challenging emotions or doubt if the moment calls for it.
I don’t think my life would look much different. ❤️
One thing that I did think is to listen to my body more. But even then, sometimes I think I don’t because I’m juggling other things. Priorities. ❤️
Some things are hard to swallow. The memories of my mother living on in me.
December 5, 2025 at 7:11 pm #452644
anitaParticipantDear Peter:
Peter: “It teaches us that while our bodies and circumstances shift, the deeper awareness, the Tao—remains. In that awareness, we may find resilience, clarity, and peace.”-
I read online, “Wu Wei (無為): ‘Non-action’ or effortless action — living in harmony with the Tao by not forcing things.”-
So, as I am sitting here depressed over a loss of a 4-year-long way of life that I grew attached to (I shared about it in my thread), the way of the Tao is non-attachment to what I have lost, no more longing, clinging to what was and will be no more..?
The clinging itself is a source of suffering..?
I think so. I might as well release the clinging- wishing and hoping that what already happened.. didn’t happen.
May I have a good, Tao night of sleep and rest tonight. Amen.
Thank you Peter, James and Alessa!
Anita
December 6, 2025 at 7:32 am #452656
Thomas168ParticipantAnita said, “The clinging itself is a source of suffering..?”
Life happens and all things will change over time.
When the first thing to change happens and we feel injured, that is life or the first arrow.
When we hold onto the feelings and thoughts about the injury then that is like a second arrow.
The second arrow is more suffering. Not all of the suffering.
So, trying not to cling to something. Do we just say it and it happens?
Do we will it and it happens?
To me, if it does happen then it has come about thru practice and effort.
Although final release comes from letting go.
I wish you a good nights rest.
When you figure out how to let something go after 4 years then please let me know.
I have held onto something for the past 45 years that I have tried to free myself from.
Thanks in advance.December 6, 2025 at 8:28 am #452658anitaParticipantDear Thomas:
Reading your post this morning is very meaningful to me. The first arrow hit me a few days ago (the loss of a way of life I was attached to), and the second arrow has been hitting me since: the holding on to the thoughts and feelings about the loss; the clinging/ attaching to what was lost.
Reading your post got me thinking for the first time since the loss that it’s POSSIBLE for me to let it go, let the attachment go. I think I can do it “thru practice and effort.” (your words).
Thank you for sharing a bit about your 45 year struggle to let go of something you held onto.
I just felt pain over my loss (after feeling hope as I typed the above. So, now, the practice is to release again, to let go of the attachment at this moment, one moment, one day at a time. I would (!) like to let you know how this progresses for me over time.
Thank you very much, Thomas, for this most helpful message.
🤍 Anita
December 6, 2025 at 11:26 am #452668anitaParticipantDear Peter:
“This Topic is intended to be about thoughts on flow, on stepping off the raft, and perhaps discovering heaven beneath our feet.”-
As I came to understand only 10 minutes ago, in my own thread, Flow is possible for me only if I think highly of myself- not in a grandiose, Narcissistic way, of course- but me approving of myself as a good, helpful, hard-working person. Only then I can step off the raft and feel heaven (“I am okay after all! I am worthy, I am good!”) under my feet.
That’s what’s been missing all along.
Anita
December 7, 2025 at 2:03 pm #452706PeterParticipantHi James
“Not finding stillness, but stepping back from the one who tries to find it” – Yes, And a step further: we say “Tao,” then unsay it. Silence is not a destination, nor a self that finds; it is what remains when finding ceases. The seeker steps off the raft, and the shore is already here.
December 7, 2025 at 2:08 pm #452707PeterParticipantHi Everyone: continued thoughts.
Lao Tzu points past the one who tries to secure stillness. “Return to the root” isn’t something the self accomplishes; it’s what shows itself when its activity softens. This I feel is flow: not forcing stillness or silence, but letting the constancy beneath each step reveal itself, heaven beneath our feet. Then belief in the raft yields to embodiment of arrival. We don’t arrive at a place we already are; we notice it. And from that noticing, action becomes natural, unforced, compassionately precise.
A brief example: When Jesus says he didn’t come to abolish the law but to fulfill it, the fearful self hears “climb the ladder harder. (sadly this is how his words are usually read) But fulfill means embody, the law becomes living breath, ‘on earth as in heaven.’ Not achievement by the self, but life expressed through us when grasping relaxes. In this, Lao Tzu and Jesus point the same way: the path is fulfilled when it disappears into presence.
Avoiding religious language lets think of a musician: scales and technique are real, laws of the craft. But at the moment of performance, trying to “find the music” only tightens the hand. When the seeking relaxes, the song plays itself through the musician. The law isn’t abolished; it’s fulfilled – embodied – so completely it disappears into the music. That’s I experience as flow, and it’s the heart of “returning to the root.”
to simplify… or make more complex 🙂 The raft asks for faith. The shore asks for feet. When the seeker loosens, the ground appears.
December 7, 2025 at 2:21 pm #452708PeterParticipantHi Alessa,
I appreciate your grounded views.
For me, flow doesn’t ask life to look different. Embodied, everything is received differently… the calendar stays, the grip softens, heaven beneath our feet.
December 7, 2025 at 2:52 pm #452709PeterParticipantHi Anita
Thank you for taking up the challenge.Flow, or wu wei, doesn’t mean forcing yourself to stop caring or to stop feeling. It means not doing anything extra on top of what’s already here: notice the pain, and don’t add the fight with the past. Grief and non‑attachment can coexist… keep the love, release the argument with what cannot be changed.
Self‑approval matters… though I’m wary of tying it to flow as it can slide into striving. Self‑approval can reduce self‑criticism where as Flow notices the feeling with no extra effort, no score.
For tonight: take one slow exhale. Notice one thing you did today that came naturally. Let your body settle.
May you have a good Tao night of sleep and rest. Amen.December 7, 2025 at 7:08 pm #452715anitaParticipantHi Peter:
I just noticed the message you addressed to me a bit more than 4 hours ago, thank you! I will answer Mon morning. I do hope to have a Tao night..
December 8, 2025 at 9:23 am #452735PeterParticipantHi Everyone
As I return to the Tao Te Ching, I offer these reflections as invitations… Knowing the Tao cannot be held in words, confined to the categories of noun or verb. In the same way, the words silence, stillness, and the Eternal are not things to grasp, but gestures pointing toward the mystery.This reflection weaves together a CAC daily meditation ‘Trusting the Unknown Path’ and thoughts on Tao. In a moment of synchronicity, the two converged, opening naturally, I think into a wider conversation on Flow.
The Tao moves unseen, shaping all things without striving. What seems like darkness is not absence, but the fertile womb of becoming a possibility of silent night birth, a choiceless choice. To walk the pathless path is to surrender the need for answers and rest in the mystery that carries us beyond ourselves.
The way of Tao is not to grasp but to release. To not know is the deeper knowing; to not need is the greater freedom. The mystics call this “death,” yet it is only the dissolving of illusion, the transition into compassion. Faith is luminous darkness: the trust that the unseen Way is already guiding us.
Tao works in secret. If we saw the whole unfolding, we would cling or resist. Instead, Tao liberates us quietly, loosening attachments and dissolving compulsions. The “dark night” is not sinister but sacred, the hidden alchemy by which freedom ripens beneath our awareness.
No one willingly oversees the undoing of the false self. As deep calls unto deep. Spirit resonates with spirit, the eternal Yes awakening the Yes within us.
In the poverty of surrender, all that is not Tao dissolves. What remains is the infinite beauty already given, Tao as Tao, Love as Love, Self as Self.
So what dissolves?
Not Tao itself, which is eternal and unchanging. Not phenomena, which continue to arise and pass.
What dissolves is illusion of the false sense of separation, the illusion of a self standing outside the flow.All things arise from Tao, like mist from the mountain, like waves from the sea.
Yet what is not Tao? Only the veil of forgetting, the dream of separation, the shadow of grasping.
The mist dissolves, not the mountain. The wave returns, not the ocean.
Illusion fades, but Tao remains, the unborn, the undying, the pathless path, the eternal Yes.
Everything arises from Tao, but not everything is seen truly. What dissolves is the veil that hides Tao from itself.The Way cannot be possessed, only trusted. It is not a road but a rhythm, not a map but a mystery. To speak of Tao is to trace the outline of what cannot be named. To listen for Tao is to rest in the space before thought. To walk with Tao is to trust the pathless path, where dissolving and arising are one movement, and where all that is hidden reveals itself in its own time.
December 8, 2025 at 9:36 am #452736anitaParticipant* Hi Thomas: I was wondering if you read the message I addressed to you 2 days ago (Dec 6) right above? It may be that you didn’t notice it.
Hi Peter:
In your 2nd message yesterday (the one you addressed to everyone) you expressed (I am paraphrasing and will use the 1st person) that peace and flow don’t come from trying harder. They come when I stop forcing, relax, and let life express itself through me. Then rules and techniques don’t disappear; they become so deeply part of me that my actions flow naturally.
Developing my thoughts: your phrase “heaven beneath our feet” is a poetic way of saying that the sacred/ peace/ ultimate reality isn’t somewhere far away — it’s already present right here, in ordinary life. You’re rejecting the idea that heaven (or peace, or enlightenment) is something you reach later, after effort or achievement. Instead, it’s always underfoot — part of each step, each moment.
I don’t “climb up” to heaven; I simply notice the ground I’m already walking on. It’s like walking in a beautiful garden while worrying about finding paradise somewhere else. The moment I stop searching, I realize paradise is already under my feet — the grass, the earth, the present moment.
When serious problems arise, “heaven beneath our feet” would mean remembering that peace and clarity are already here. By relaxing into that presence, my actions become more natural, less forced, and often more effective. When facing a problem, I need to remind myself: I can’t fix everything today, but I can take one clear step. And I need to pause and rest so to not make big decisions in the heat of panic.
Rushing to fix is like thrashing in quicksand — the harder I flail, the deeper I sink. It’s trying to fix everything at once and making decisions in the heat of panic,, being panic‑driven and reactive while Flow is calm, present, and allows the next right step to emerge naturally, one step at a time.
And now, to your most recent post. Here you’re saying that Flow doesn’t mean shutting down my emotions or pretending I don’t care. It means to feel what’s already here, but not to pile extra struggle on top. For example: If I feel grief, let myself feel it. But don’t add the mental fight like “this shouldn’t have happened” or “I wish I could change the past.”
Non‑attachment= not clinging to what can’t be changed, not fighting reality.
I can still feel sadness, still care deeply, still honor what mattered to me, and at the same time, let go of the argument with reality/ stop the inner fight like “this shouldn’t have happened” or “I must undo it.”/ stop endlessly resisting what already happened and cannot be changed.
You added that self‑approval reduces self‑criticism, and therefore, it’s helpful. But if you tie it too tightly to “flow,” it can become another form of striving — like trying to score points for being good at flowing. Flow is just noticing feelings without effort, without grading myself.
“For tonight: take one slow exhale. Notice one thing you did today that came naturally. Let your body settle.
May you have a good Tao night of sleep and rest. Amen.”- Thank you for and for the 2 messages I processed in this post and for the excellent advice, will do tonight. Actually, will do today. You are a good Flow Instructor, Peter 🙏🙏🙏🤍 Anita
December 8, 2025 at 10:37 am #452740anitaParticipantHi Peter:
I submitted the above before becoming aware that you submitted another post (13 minutes before I submitted mine).
Here you are saying that the Tao (the Way, the underlying reality) can’t be captured in words or concepts. Words like “silence,” “stillness,” or “eternal” are just pointers — they gesture toward a mystery you can only experience, not define.
What feels like “darkness” isn’t emptiness — it’s a fertile space where new life and possibilities are quietly forming.
Walking the “pathless path” means letting go of the need for answers, and resting in trust that the mystery carries me forward.
True wisdom isn’t about knowing everything — it’s about being okay with not knowing.
True freedom isn’t about getting everything I want — it’s about being content without depending on desires being met. Imagine a bird flying in the sky: if it believes freedom means owning every tree, every worm, every nest, it will always feel anxious — because it can’t have them all. But if it realizes freedom is simply the open sky itself, it no longer needs to possess anything. It’s already free, because nothing can take the sky away.
The sky in this example is the Tao (The Way and the ultimate reality in Taoism), the Brahman (Hinduism), Nirvana (Buddhism), and God (Western Traditions).
Back to your message, Peter:
Faith= “luminous darkness”: trusting that even when I can’t see the way, the Tao is guiding me, and so, the “dark night” isn’t something scary — it’s sacred.
What dissolves when a person is truly free is the illusion of separation — the false belief that I am a self standing outside the flow. My past chronic sense of separation, confusion, or grasping has been like mist or waves — decades long appearances (but still temporary) that obscured deeper reality, that of belonging and being part-of the mountain, the ocean, the Tao.
* Grasping (defined): the mental habit of trying to hold onto experiences, possessions, or identities as if they were permanent.
Clouds are real, but they don’t mean the sun disappeared. The illusion is believing that the sun has disappeared; thinking that passing appearances are the whole truth. Tao is the enduring reality beneath them.
“The Way cannot be possessed, only trusted. It is not a road but a rhythm, not a map but a mystery. To speak of Tao is to trace the outline of what cannot be named. To listen for Tao is to rest in the space before thought. To walk with Tao is to trust the pathless path, where dissolving and arising are one movement, and where all that is hidden reveals itself in its own time.”-
Beautifully said, if I may say so. You are a very talented.. Flow Writer.
I would be interested to read more from you Peter about how to trust the Tao, in practical terms.
🤍 Anita
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