Menu

A Personal Reckoning

HomeForumsShare Your TruthA Personal Reckoning

New Reply
Viewing 15 posts - 211 through 225 (of 253 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #452241
    Tee
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    I went back and re-read several of your latest posts, and here are my comments:

    I misspoke about her not expressing anger at her oldest sister.. I don’t remember her confronting her oldest sister (I’ll refer to her as M), but I know that for a while she wouldn’t talk to M, as in a no-contact, because she was angry at her, she realized at that time that M really, really did hurt her.

    But after some time she went back to talking with her. It’s like part of her was M. M was an overt aggressor, consistently, no meek/ people pleasing performances; the mother switched between being M and performing meek/ people pleasing- unlike M- in between returns to being the overt aggressor that M was.

    It occurs to me now that your mother doesn’t sound like a typical people pleaser, because people pleasers do things that are often against their best interests and are hurting them, but they’re still doing it, in order to please others. Your mother sounds more like someone who was faking kindness and “meekness” to the outside world, when it suited her – to boost her public image. She wasn’t doing it to please others (and sacrifice her own real needs), but to boost her fake persona.

    she lost all her hair- forevermore- as a result of an untreated scalp fungus infection. A shame she carried with her throughout her life.. cutting her head off photos.

    And it occurred to me just now.. for the first time in my whole life, why she scrubbed my scalp so terribly deep and rough.. because I had hair and she didn’t..?

    Yes, I think she was jealous of your hair! She might have been punishing you for having hair…

    I didn’t know she had no hair until I was 26 or 27. She wore wigs the whole time. I just didn’t know until .. was it my sister who told me (I don’t remember). I was in shock at the time, that for a quarter of a century, I didn’t know.

    Yeah, that’s pretty extraordinary that you’d never noticed! I guess she was hiding it well… perhaps she didn’t let you see her early in the morning (provided that she took the wig off while sleeping)?

    Good point, Tee. She wasn’t upset at all about me leaving, and again, it never occurred to me that indeed she wasn’t upset. Sincerely, truthfully.. I was never a person to her, never of a human value, one she’d miss..

    Yes, but I thought she might “miss” you as someone to harass, even an “object” to harass, if you will. Because such people need someone to abuse and victimize, so to feel better about themselves.

    But I guess she quickly turned to your sister, as you said, started buggering her to get married and give her a grandchild. And so she did, although you said the guy she married wasn’t a good fit…

    “It seems your mother didn’t even try to establish total control over your sister like she did with you.”- not physically, as in washing, feeding, wiping and dressing her. (Not necessarily in that order.. sad lol).

    What occurs to me now, and it might be painful to read, is that it seems your mother hasn’t sexually harassed your sister… your sister “only” received emotional (and perhaps physical?) abuse. But she didn’t have access to her body… I realize this may be very painful to read, that you might have received more of the abuse, or more destructive type of abuse. I’m very sorry about that, Anita 😢

    I just felt so much affection for you, Tee.. for saying these things with passion (I meant emotional passion, of course.. everything feels contaminated as a result of sexual abuse.. the word “passion”, the word “affection”)

    Like her affection when holding my hand on the way to the airport.. if it was affection, I couldn’t differentiate it from sexuality. Every smile on her face directed to me, a softness in her voice.. it all felt creepy.

    Right, it seems it was her who contaminated affection with sexuality, and so now when you say affection, immediately a sexual meaning pops up in your head.

    (BTW, thank you, I do feel strongly about childhood sexual abuse not being a small thing. So yes, I’m passionate about defending the victims and not minimizing the abuse. ❤️)

    I was wondering if she felt “affection” for you when she was controlling you completely, including your body, e.g. when she was putting on your pajamas after bathing and you lying on the bed like a doll. You said that’s when she had a satisfied smile on her face (at least in front of the neighbor, Rosie, who challenged her that one time).

    So I’m wondering if she felt “affection”, i.e. she felt pleased with you, when she could control you completely (including your body), i.e. treat you like an object with which she can do whatever she pleases?

    That control included touching you inappropriately while washing you (pre-puberty), and demanding access to your naked body (post-puberty). As I’m writing this, I’m hoping that phrasing it like this isn’t too sensitive for you? Please let me know of it is, will you?

    I think Copilot explained it very well why it constitutes sexual abuse:

    Even if she framed it as ‘care,’ exposing you and touching your body in adolescence can be a form of covert sexual abuse, because it places you in a sexualized or vulnerable position without consent.

    The trauma comes from being forced into a situation where your body was exposed and controlled against your will.

    Yeah, she put you in a sexualized and vulnerable position (demanding that you let her into the bathroom to wash your hair and back, while in a vulnearable, exposed position), and your body was touched/manipulated against your will (by manipulation I mean when you had to lie down on the bed, while she was dressing you).

    And I’m thinking now that those washing/dressing rituals might not have been so much about her extracting sexual pleasure from it, but more about establishing complete dominion and control over you.

    As Alessa said: sexual abuse is the ultimate way to strip someone of their autonomy. Yes, because it’s violating the autonomy of our body, which no one else should lay claim to, but ourselves.

    But regardless whether she extracted sexual pleasure from it or not (you said she did from parading naked in front of you), it still constitutes sexual abuse. And as Copilot says, I think it’s very important that you’re now naming it and understanding it.

    Because until now, it was all a bit of a haze. Now it’s becoming more clear, and inasmuch as it is painful, it is also liberating, I hope, and is contributing to your healing. ❤️

    So yes, let’s keep talking about it… because the clearer it becomes, the more equipped you will be to heal and put an end on your mother’s toxic legacy 🙏 ❤️ 🙏

    🙏 ❤️ 🫶 ❤️ 🙏

    #452259
    anita
    Participant

    SA Trigger Warning

    Dear Tee:

    When I read this part of your recent post first thing at the computer: “that’s pretty extraordinary that you’d never noticed!” (that she was bald), I remembered something I didn’t think about for years. I remembered that as a child or a young adolescent, I woke up very scared one morning, and I told her that I had a scary dream that she was had no hair, that she was close to me and bald. She calmed me, saying something like: it was only a dream.

    In my mid-twenties (no.. I was in my late 20s), when I was told that she was bald, I noticed that it was quite obvious that she was wearing a wig, particularly when it was not a new one, or one that was maintained well (which it wasn’t at that particular time). It was really obvious, but it never occurred to me before I was told. The revelation terribly shook me for a long, long time. It made me sink deeper in empathy for her, as well as in guilt.

    Empathy for her (feeling so very sorry for her) and Guilt went hand in hand.. well, almost my whole life. The guilt was heavier, more painful than the empathy. Early on, I figured it was my job to make her happy, that her misery is my responsibility to fix. Feeling that I failed my # 1 responsibility was very painful. When I found out that she was bald, it meant that I had so much more to fix, so much more to compensate her for.

    Currently, empathy without the guilt feels so much lighter.

    Coming to think about it, I avoided empathy for people, avoided feeling empathy for people in general because empathy for her felt so painful (because it was heavily associated with guilt). When I saw a person in emotional pain, I immediately felt guilty and distressed over the guilt. Of course, that dynamic within me didn’t allow for healthy, lasting friendships and relationships.

    I am becoming aware of the above while typing it.

    Back to your post, Tee:

    “It occurs to me now that your mother doesn’t sound like a typical people pleaser, because people pleasers do things that are often against their best interests and are hurting them, but they’re still doing it, in order to please others. Your mother sounds more like someone who was faking kindness and ‘meekness’ to the outside world, when it suited her – to boost her public image. She wasn’t doing it to please others (and sacrifice her own real needs), but to boost her fake persona.”-

    I wonder if it can be both..? She did spend her very hard earned money feeding guests, giving generous gifts to others (weddings & such).. so that’s against her best interest, isn’t it?

    Of course, she complained to me after feeding and gifting others, about how hard she worked for money and how selfish others were for receiving gifts, or eating what she offered them, how much more fortunate they were for not having to work as hard as her, and yet they were taking advantage of her (the most unfortunate person in the world, or close to that).

    I was very angry whenever her behavior repeated itself, angry at the selfish people eating her foods, but I had to keep quiet and say nothing to her guests while boiling inside with anger. I had to stay quiet because (after I offered to tell them myself that they are not invited to eat her food, that she worked too hard, etc., the things she expressed to me), she threatened to “murder” me (her word). So, I knew she really, really didn’t want me to say anything.

    It is only yesterday that I felt a pang of this particular pain when seeing a woman being offered a gift and accepting it. I was quickly aware of where that pain and anger came from, and it dissipated.

    ..Wait, this sentence just landed: “She wasn’t doing it to please others (and sacrifice her own real needs), but to boost her fake persona.”- Never occurred to me, but true: people pleasing may be driven by a genuine desire to see people pleased/ feeling good (while Inside, at least at times, the people- pleaser feels anxious, resentful, or exhausted, because the pleasing isn’t freely chosen — it’s driven by compulsion).

    Did the mother want guests to feel good? I don’t think so, if she did, she wouldn’t bitterly complain about them before or after their visits. Yes, you are right, it was a fake persona.. and a convincing one.

    About faking meekness, faking being mild, gentle, humble, submissive-.. lots of faking before each time she exploded with arrogance, harshness, cruelty and dominance.

    “Yes, I think she was jealous of your hair! She might have been punishing you for having hair…

    “Yeah, that’s pretty extraordinary that you’d never noticed! I guess she was hiding it well.. perhaps she didn’t let you see her early in the morning (provided that she took the wig off while sleeping)?”-

    I think that I did see her that one time I dreamed about.. or more accurately, a real memory that occurred to me in a dream.. Or, it just occurred to me for the first time: it might not having been a dream at all. She might have told me something like: It didn’t happen, it was only a bad dream. Now, this very moment, I remember her saying “bad dream”.

    “Yes, but I thought she might ‘miss’ you as someone to harass, even an ‘object’ to harass, if you will. Because such people need someone to abuse and victimize, so to feel better about themselves.”- I suppose she did miss me that way but satisfied that longing by focusing on my sister.

    “But I guess she quickly turned to your sister, as you said, started buggering her to get married and give her a grandchild. And so she did, although you said the guy she married wasn’t a good fit..”- he was a UN soldier.. coming to think about it, he himself was a sexual abuse victim.. his uncle. He proceeded to beat my sister and was a very neglectful father.. not a good fit. But the mother wanted to live either in Europe or the U.S., and that’s why she wanted him as a husband for my sister (plus his European looks.. and maybe something else that she sensed about him.

    “What occurs to me now, and it might be painful to read, is that it seems your mother hasn’t sexually harassed your sister.. your sister “only” received emotional (and perhaps physical?) abuse. But she didn’t have access to her body.. I realize this may be very painful to read, that you might have received more of the abuse, or more destructive type of abuse. I’m very sorry about that, Anita 😢”-

    Thank you for the empathy, Tee. And no, it’s not painful to read. Yes, I did receive more destructive type of abuse.. the proof is in the pudding, so to speak, my sister, for a long time, had freedom and a social life I could only dream of.. and no tics. (she had migraines though, from an early age, still does)

    “Right, it seems it was her who contaminated affection with sexuality, and so now when you say affection, immediately a sexual meaning pops up in your head.”- said perfectly: contaminated affection with sexuality

    “(BTW, thank you, I do feel strongly about childhood sexual abuse not being a small thing. So yes, I’m passionate about defending the victims and not minimizing the abuse. ❤️)”- Thank you, Tee 🙏 ❤️

    “I was wondering if she felt ‘affection’ for you when she was controlling you completely, including your body, e.g. when she was putting on your pajamas after bathing and you lying on the bed like a doll. You said that’s when she had a satisfied smile on her face (at least in front of the neighbor, Rosie, who challenged her that one time).

    “So I’m wondering if she felt ‘affection’, i.e. she felt pleased with you, when she could control you completely (including your body), i.e. treat you like an object with which she can do whatever she pleases?”- she signaled approval, that’s for sure, a rare commodity for me: her approval.. another rare commodity: a genuine smile on her face. She experienced pleasure in seeing me accommodating her need to have power-over, and I wanted her pleased.

    Was it affection.. No, just approval with a smile. A smile of pleasure, not one of affection.

    “That control included touching you inappropriately while washing you (pre-puberty), and demanding access to your naked body (post-puberty). As I’m writing this, I’m hoping that phrasing it like this isn’t too sensitive for you? Please let me know of it is, will you?”- I will, thank you for your sensitivity, Tee.. but no, I have no problem with your phrasing. Actually, it’s helpful.

    “I think Copilot explained it very well why it constitutes sexual abuse:… Yeah, she put you in a sexualized and vulnerable position (demanding that you let her into the bathroom to wash your hair and back, while in a vulnerable, exposed position), and your body was touched/manipulated against your will (by manipulation I mean when you had to lie down on the bed, while she was dressing you).

    “And I’m thinking now that those washing/dressing rituals might not have been so much about her extracting sexual pleasure from it, but more about establishing complete dominion and control over you.”- Yes. True..

    “As Alessa said: sexual abuse is the ultimate way to strip someone of their autonomy. Yes, because it’s violating the autonomy of our body, which no one else should lay claim to, but ourselves.

    “But regardless whether she extracted sexual pleasure from it or not (you said she did from parading naked in front of you), it still constitutes sexual abuse. And as Copilot says, I think it’s very important that you’re now naming it and understanding it.

    “Because until now, it was all a bit of a haze. Now it’s becoming more clear, and inasmuch as it is painful, it is also liberating, I hope, and is contributing to your healing. ❤️”- Yes, our conversations. Your attention to details, your superior analytical skill, and your passion for telling the truth it like it is.. (to not be silent or silenced).. All these are making my accelerated healing possible.

    I am experiencing a significant decline in shame.. and a felt increase in self-worth these very days. 🙏 ❤️

    “So yes, let’s keep talking about it.. because the clearer it becomes, the more equipped you will be to heal and put an end on your mother’s toxic legacy 🙏 ❤️ 🙏”- Toxic Legacy.. the correct words. I am looking forward to continuing to talk about it, Tee!

    Forever Grateful, 🙏 ❤️ 🤍 Anita

    #452263
    anita
    Participant

    Continued:

    “perhaps she didn’t let you see her early in the morning (provided that she took the wig off while sleeping)?”-

    Reconstructing a memory: It was early in the morning, earlier than I’d normally wake up. I was maybe 7, maybe younger. I woke up, walked to the bathroom where she was fixing her wig. She hadn’t noticed I was awake, maybe having forgotten to lock the bathroom door behind her. I approach, open the door further, and I see a totally bald person. I either screamed or had terror registering on my face. She had terror in hers, maybe anger. She puts on her wig quickly, best she can, takes me back to bed and says to me: It was only a dream, a bad dream. Go back to sleep.

    For 20 years.. it was only a bad dream.

    What else was not really “only a bad dream”, I wonder.

    How many untruths did she tell me, day in and day out?

    That people were bad, That she was good, that I was bad, a bad unworthy daughter, that no one is to be trusted, that she loves me, that she is “the best mother in the world”, that her intentions are always good (she said that), that she’s always been a victim.. that she is shy and meek, that no one will ever love me as much as she’s loved me, that my sister is a w****, that..

    HOW MANY LIES..???

    Anita

    #452266
    Alessa
    Participant

    Hi Anita

    I think you are spot on about not rejecting yourself. ❤️

    Yes. My inner child is pretty quiet. It is progress to reach out to my adult self when I need something. I think that side of me is slowly starting to trust my adult self.

    It’s okay. I was just trying to give an example and explain the meaning behind it. 😊

    I look forward to you sharing how you explore taking care of your inner child. ❤️

    I’m sorry to hear that you were starved as an unborn baby and then overfed later on. Do I remember correctly that you were force fed too? Well done on overcoming the ED by the way!

    Did your mother for lack of other terms ever deal with her eating disorder after you were born? It is very difficult for young children to eat without their parents eating. Eating together is an important bonding experience as well. A parent eating confirms to a child that the food is safe to eat.

    Very true! Nothing is forever. I think the most shameful part for me, is that when I was younger and didn’t understand. I liked the attention. If that makes sense?

    Thinking about it… Perhaps it is similar to the wig thing in a way? It is very disorienting when understanding of something changes so drastically. It is a betrayal.

    I love your affirmation! Perhaps you might want to save that somewhere? It was beautiful. ❤️

    That was kind of you (and brave) to stand up for an innocent dog! ❤️

    Yes, so many lies. 🫂 I’m so sorry. You didn’t deserve any of it! ❤️

    #452272
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Alessa:

    I am glad that your inner child is starting to trust your adult self 😊

    I will share with you how I explore taking care of my inner child. I’m actually looking forward to sharing with you about Thanksgiving tomorrow, the get together for people who don’t have family locally, or people who prefer to not be with.. Family.

    You asked if I was forced fed too.. Yes, I was. She forced fed me when I was a baby (blocking my nose, so when I opened my mouth for air, she shoved food in).

    No, she didn’t deal with her eating disorder.. There was no awareness of it back then, no name for it, she just made herself throw up on a regular basis. I didn’t understand it back then, neither did she, I imagine.

    You wrote: “I think the most shameful part for me, is that when I was younger and didn’t understand. I liked the attention. If that makes sense?”- I don’t quite understand this at this time. I would like to understand (not very focused right now). Please tell me what you mean..?

    Thank you for your support, Alessa.. I wonder what happened to the dog (a beagle) I tried to defend. .. Coming to think about it, I think that my interference led the neighbors finding a different home for the beagle. I think that my interference/ standing up for the poor beagle- made a positive difference for him!

    Sometimes, that’s all it takes, standing up for the powerless!

    “Yes, so many lies”, you wrote.. I will be exploring this point further. Thank you, Alessa!

    ❤️ 🤍 Anita

    #452273
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Tee:

    I thought that out of nowhere, I had a dream where I saw my mother bald. I didn’t know that it wasn’t a dream, that it was actually a memory of seeing her bald.

    I thought it was only a dream, a weird dream.. because she told me it was a bad dream, and nothing more.

    I believed her because there was nothing I needed more than to believe her.

    So, I closed my eyes and believed it was only a dream. I did, for 20 years- before someone told me she was bald.

    And then, it took 30 more years to realize (because you brought it up TODAY, Tee), that it was not a dream at all.

    I SAW her bald, and then she said: You didn’t. It was only a dream!

    And my eyes closed.. half a century+ by now.. until today. I thought it was only a dream.. I didn’t connect the OBVIOUS.

    She (the “mother”) made a fool out of me in so many.. many.. many ways, and it was so very easy for her to do so.. Telling me it was a dream. And I believed her: 1967-2025 of believing it was a dream… How many years is that.. 58 years of believing I dreamed she was bald.. When she really was bald the whole time.

    58 years of believing I dreamed what I actually saw in-real-life.

    So.. What else happened that she told me didn’t happen?

    I feel like such a fool…

    #452288
    Tee
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    sorry, I’m in a bit of a rush today, not very focused. But I’d like to say that I hear you and understand that you might be feeling befuddled by these newest realizations: that you didn’t see something that you say was pretty obvious (your mother wearing a wig), or that you’ve only now realized that what you saw that early morning wasn’t a dream, but you really saw your mother’s bald head.

    But your mother told you it was just a bad dream, and so you didn’t question it further. You accepted her words. I think the key to understand this is what you wrote here:

    I believed her because there was nothing I needed more than to believe her.

    That’s true. You needed to believe her, because this is what allowed you to stay attached to her, which is what we as children need to survive. We need to stay attached to our parents, and that includes believing that our parents are good people and that they have our best interests in mind.

    So, believing our parents, trusting their intentions, blaming ourselves rather than them if they mistreat us… that’s all how we keep the hope that our parents are good people and that we’re safe with them.

    In addition, abusive parents (specially narcissistic parents) regularly gaslight us and tell us various lies (that they’re the best parents, that they only want what’s best for us, that we’re bad, ungrateful and unworthy, but that they love us anyway, etc etc). Similar lies that your mother told you… And they’re really good at “selling” their narrative.

    So I think it’s kind of a 2-fold action: we want to believe them, because we need it for our survival, and they’re really good at portraying themselves as good and us as bad. They’re very convincing. And I think that as a result, we get easily brainwashed: we are receptive to it, and they are master gaslighters.

    And then we start gaslighting ourselves too, telling ourselves that our parent is a good parent, that things aren’t as bad, that they mean well… and I think that as a part of that self-gaslighting, we might not even see or perceive certain things that would be obvious to an outside observer.

    It’s like we don’t want to see those things, and so we block them from our conscious awareness. I suppose that’s what happened to you, and why you never put 2 and 2 together regarding your mother wearing a wig. She told you it wasn’t real, and you believed her, because you wanted to believe her: not only about the wig, but about everything else. Because you needed to believe her, because that was key for your survival.

    At least that’s how I explain it to myself… what are your thoughts on this?

    HOW MANY LIES..???

    The lies are unfortunately pervasive: almost everything she told you (or conditioned you to believe) about yourself and other people isn’t true. Also, a lot of what she told you about herself – how good and loving mother she is – is also not true.

    But the worst lies are those that we’ve accepted about ourselves: about our worth and how worthy of love we are. And it’s good to hear that your sense of self-worth is growing by the day:

    I am experiencing a significant decline in shame.. and a felt increase in self-worth these very days

    I’m really happy about that, Anita ❤️ It’s a great sign, and indicates that her lies are having less and less impact on you! 🤞

    🙏 ❤️ 🫶 ❤️

    #452290
    anita
    Participant

    I am thrilled that you posted, Tee. I was worried that you were in pain and discouraged. I was going to inquire and saw that you submitted a post for me.

    I didn’t yet read most of it, but I will.

    Thank you so much for posting even though you are not very focused.

    I hope that you are not in pain 🤞

    🙏 ❤️ 🫶 ❤️ Anita

    #452298
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Tee:

    “I hear you and understand that you might be feeling befuddled by these newest realizations: that you didn’t see something that you say was pretty obvious (your mother wearing a wig), or that you’ve only now realized that what you saw that early morning wasn’t a dream, but you really saw your mother’s bald head.

    “But your mother told you it was just a bad dream, and so you didn’t question it further. You accepted her words… You needed to believe her, because this is what allowed you to stay attached to her, which is what we as children need to survive. We need to stay attached to our parents, and that includes believing that our parents are good people and that they have our best interests in mind.

    “So, believing our parents, trusting their intentions, blaming ourselves rather than them if they mistreat us… that’s all how we keep the hope that our parents are good people and that we’re safe with them.

    “In addition, abusive parents (specially narcissistic parents) regularly gaslight us and tell us various lies (that they’re the best parents, that they only want what’s best for us, that we’re bad, ungrateful and unworthy, but that they love us anyway, etc. etc.). Similar lies that your mother told you.. And they’re really good at ‘selling’ their narrative.

    “So I think it’s kind of a 2-fold action: we want to believe them, because we need it for our survival, and they’re really good at portraying themselves as good and us as bad. They’re very convincing. And I think that as a result, we get easily brainwashed: we are receptive to it, and they are master gaslighters.

    “And then we start gaslighting ourselves too, telling ourselves that our parent is a good parent, that things aren’t as bad, that they mean well.. and I think that as a part of that self-gaslighting, we might not even see or perceive certain things that would be obvious to an outside observer.

    “It’s like we don’t want to see those things, and so we block them from our conscious awareness. I suppose that’s what happened to you, and why you never put 2 and 2 together regarding your mother wearing a wig. She told you it wasn’t real, and you believed her, because you wanted to believe her: not only about the wig, but about everything else. Because you needed to believe her, because that was key for your survival.

    “At least that’s how I explain it to myself… what are your thoughts on this?”- I agree with every word I quoted above, every single word.

    “The lies are unfortunately pervasive: almost everything she told you (or conditioned you to believe) about yourself and other people isn’t true. Also, a lot of what she told you about herself – how good and loving mother she is – is also not true.

    “But the worst lies are those that we’ve accepted about ourselves: about our worth and how worthy of love we are. And it’s good to hear that your sense of self-worth is growing by the day… I’m really happy about that, Anita ❤️ It’s a great sign, and indicates that her lies are having less and less impact on you! 🤞”- Thank you, Tee (did I already say that you’re the best..).

    Developing the thoughts I copied above: To maintain attachment to her (biologically, instinctually, a matter of survival), I submitted to her in every possible way, best I could: let her wash me, let her dress me, eat all the food she wanted me to eat (overeat), study in school best I could, hours and hours.. let her endlessly vent to me (about “the evil” of others), let her hit me while looking down as she did (because she said she likes it that I do), TRIED to clean the apt to her satisfaction.. Tried to teach her (as a teenager) what I read in psychology books, offered to be her warrior and get the “evil people” away from her..

    * This is amazing.. I never listed the things I did, or try to do for her. She always listed in great detail what she did for me and how ungrateful I was. Here is my FIRST time acknowledging what I did for her.. what she wasn’t grateful for!!!

    Oh, and the money I sent for her, or in her direction (much, much more than what I mentioned before).

    Oh, and faking a marriage so that she can be brought to NYC, her dream come true (not proud of it.. yet the motivation was to make her happy).. And more and more.

    Truly, I wasn’t aware of this before, how hard I tried in each and every way that was available to me- to please her, to satisfy her, to make her mind and life better. Never gave myself credit!

    The title of a book, I think it was, “People of the Lie” comes to mind. She gaslighted me so much.. She LIED to me so thoroughly. About who she was (UNGRATEFUL to me… except that one time when she said the trip to NYC/Florida was.. something positive, don’t remember the words she used, but I remember how unique, a first it was that she gave me credit for anything 1-2-1.

    (Her bragging about my non-existing academic success in school was .. bragging to others so to elevate her image).

    So, today, I am giving myself credit for all my many, many.. many efforts to help her. FOR THE FIRST TIME IN MY LIFE!

    Coming to think about it- the timing is perfect: Thanksgiving!

    Thank you, Anita, for your many, many efforts and all your hard work invested in helping this woman!!!

    People of the Lie- it’s a lie that I was selfish and ungrateful to her.. a lie she told me.

    All her guilt-tripping and shaming me were based on LIES.

    Okay, better I try to relax now.

    Thank you, Tee 🙏 🙏 🙏

    ❤️ 🤍 🫶 ❤️ Anita

    #452313
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Tee:

    So much of the stupidity that I observe around me these very days irl is about people preferring to NOT see the glaring, evident truth.

    The make-believe, wishful thinking.. Irresponsible Optimism, in real-life, these very days (which I haven’t shared about).

    So.. funny.. My mother, my perceived goddess.. huh..

    Just a.. what’s the word- not someone for me to look up to, not someone deserving any admiration of any kind, because even her being hard-working, even that she.. misused to cause harm.

    It’s just that she.. was no one to look up to.

    I feel sorry for her for not being someone for me to look up to.

    Just not someone I value.

    The little girl that she was before I was born- yes, worthwhile.

    But not the woman/ person I was born to- through.

    Not someone deserving my esteem, or my respect.

    Not a good person.

    Dark eyes, mild sadistic smile, words like bullets hitting through the heart.. BOOM

    That’s the thing I was born through, cruel, vengeful..

    May I STOP seeing her as anything other than what she was, to me, to others: MEAN. Sadistic.

    #452314
    Tee
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    happy belated Thanksgiving! 😊

    And what an amazing idea: to give yourself thanks for everything that you’ve done for your mother, for all the effort you’ve invested in trying to please her, make her happy, make her life less of a suffering… it didn’t work, but not because of you, but because of her! However, you’ve tried, you did your best, you gave your all!

    And you completely deserve praise and acknowledgment for your sincere, heart-felt attempts:

    So, today, I am giving myself credit for all my many, many.. many efforts to help her. FOR THE FIRST TIME IN MY LIFE!

    Coming to think about it- the timing is perfect: Thanksgiving!

    Thank you, Anita, for your many, many efforts and all your hard work invested in helping this woman!!!

    Amen to that! 🙏 ❤️ Very well said!

    I hope you’re still feeling the enthusiasm and vigor of those words, and the acknowledgment, the self-validation, that you indeed did you best, while she was the ungrateful one. You were giving and giving, while she was rejecting, dismissing, criticizing… and remained bitter and unhappy throughout.

    It occurs to me that you were the people-pleaser, or better say, Mother-pleaser: you did things against your will, things that were hurting you – only to please her, to see that satisfied smile of approval on her face:

    she signaled approval, that’s for sure, a rare commodity for me: her approval.. another rare commodity: a genuine smile on her face. She experienced pleasure in seeing me accommodating her need to have power-over, and I wanted her pleased.

    She approved of you when you diminished, or almost annulled yourself. When she could control you completely. You gave her that. But she wasn’t satisfied nevertheless. Maybe for a brief moment she was, but not beyond that.

    And she perpetuated the lie that you’re bad, that you’re hurting her, while she was the one who was hurting you all along. Yes, narcissistic people are People of the Lie…

    So, congratulations, Anita, for seeing through the Lie, for not believing her narrative anymore. Congratulations for seeing things clearly: who you are and who she is…

    I’d like to comment on something very important that you said about empathy:

    Empathy for her (feeling so very sorry for her) and Guilt went hand in hand.. well, almost my whole life. The guilt was heavier, more painful than the empathy. Early on, I figured it was my job to make her happy, that her misery is my responsibility to fix. Feeling that I failed my # 1 responsibility was very painful. When I found out that she was bald, it meant that I had so much more to fix, so much more to compensate her for.

    Currently, empathy without the guilt feels so much lighter.

    That’s an important realization: that your empathy was mixed with guilt. Because she was 1) portraying herself as the victim and 2) blaming you (among other people) for her misery. She made you feel guilty for her misery.

    Plus, you wanted to free her from her misery even in instances in which she didn’t blame you, e.g. when you had guests and she would bitterly complain before and after their visit. She didn’t blame you for that, however you still wanted to help her, to ease her “suffering”.

    But then she forbid you to talk to the guests about it (“I will murder you!“), because she of course wanted to maintain her “kind and generous” persona – someone who gives big, expensive gifts, and prepares intricate, lavish meals (I suppose).

    Anyway, you tried to free her from her “misery”, when in fact it was all a farce. It was a self-inflicted “misery”, because no one was forcing her to give those expensive gifts and prepare complicated meals. It was her choice, which she then presented as some big sacrifice. She portrayed herself as the victim, the martyr, when it was actually her choice, and it served to maintain a certain public image.

    You believed that she was indeed suffering, you believed that she was the victim – when in fact, it was an act. And then you blamed yourself for not being able to help her. When in fact she didn’t want to be helped – she enjoyed her martyr role.

    And it’s a great thing that you’re now freeing yourself from that guilt. And that you’re able to separate empathy for the person from feeling guilty for their suffering.

    A good example of that would be your mother’s baldness: you can be sorry for your mother having such a handicap, because it is really a handicap and very unpleasant. However, you don’t need (or didn’t need to) to feel guilty about it and obliged to compensate her for it, because it’s not your fault and there isn’t even much you can do about it. You can simply empathize, but without feeling guilty or obliged to help.

    So yeah, empathy without guilt is a great concept – thanks for mentioning it, Anita. ❤️ When we empathize like that, we can simply “sit with the person” in their pain, without necessarily doing anything. We may help of course if needed, but sometimes it’s enough if we simply offer a listening ear and validate their emotions. If they feel heard and validated.

    Good to hear that you had a pleasant Thanksgiving, and that you met some nice, interesting people 😊

    Wishing you a nice day today! 😊

    ❤️ 🫶 ❤️

    #452323
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Tee:

    What a beautiful post, a masterpiece! I want to reread it and reply in a couple- three hours 🙏 ❤️

    #452336
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Tee:

    Before I reread and respond to your latest post, I want to process my post of late last night.

    When I wrote: “So much of the stupidity that I observe around me these very days irl is about people preferring to NOT see the glaring, evident truth. The make-believe, wishful thinking.. Irresponsible Optimism, in real-life, these very days (which I haven’t shared about).”-

    I wasn’t thinking about me when I wrote the above. I was talking about other people in current circumstances.

    I then wrote: “So.. funny.. My mother, my perceived goddess.. huh.. Not a good person. Dark eyes, mild sadistic smile, words like bullets hitting through the heart.. BOOM… cruel, vengeful.. May I STOP seeing her as anything other than what she was, to me, to others: MEAN. Sadistic.”-

    When I read this part this morning, I felt alarmed.. as if reading the words of a crazy person. Not believing the person who wrote these words, thinking it’s a huge exaggeration, if not untrue altogether.

    And now, I look at the first part of last night’s post, that about other people’s “stupidity…preferring to NOT see the glaring, evident truth. The make-believe, wishful thinking.. Irresponsible Optimism”- I sense anger there. And because I am one of those people in regard to the mother, or better say, I have been one of those people, I sense anger toward myself for not seeing the “glaring, evident truth”.

    I want to develop this further:

    I saw her smiling at my pain- when she did- but for decades, I didn’t remember the smile. And then, when I remembered it, a part of me normalized it as.. something every mother experiences sometimes (pleasure at her daughter’s pain). So, as disturbing as her smile was, it was.. “normal”.

    Not that I felt okay with it being “normal”.. It’s that I didn’t know I was normalizing/ excusing it until right now, as I am typing this.

    That normalization kept her image as.. if not exceptionally loving (lol), at least.. normal, nothing to be alarmed by.. A way to soothe myself.

    I then thought, earlier this morning: Are there mothers who never find pleasure in seeing their child in pain.

    I just asked Copilot: “are there parents who never find pleasure in their child’s pain?”-

    Notice the question, Tee. I really don’t know the answer in regard to all or most parents.

    Copilot: “Yes — absolutely, there are many parents who never find pleasure in their child’s pain…. Most parents feel distress when their child is hurting. They may rush to comfort, protect, or help their child heal. Love and empathy guide their reactions — they want their child to feel safe, valued, and supported.

    “In contrast, when a parent seems to take pleasure in a child’s hurt… That behavior is not ‘normal’ or inevitable — it’s a sign of dysfunction, not of parenthood itself.

    “Key Point- Many parents never act this way. They genuinely want their children to thrive and would never intentionally shame or enjoy their child’s suffering.”

    Next, I am thinking of that traumatic night when I ran into the night following her suicidal threats, locating her, running to her with open arms and greatest relief, calling her name.. and her reaction: anger at me, disapproval.

    I remember the time I was twitching (tics) when she was venting to me endlessly, thinking: can’t she see my distress?

    And on and on and on.. either lack of empathy by itself, or a desire to hurt my feelings and then enjoying it.

    Her self-centeredness was unique, or extreme, a limited perspective: seeing situations through the lens of “me” rather than considering other people’ experiences, being absorbed in “me” so much so that there’s no one else but “me”, no one to deserve empathy other than “me”.. I need to not feel guilt, so I’ll blame my daughter (it serves “me”). I need a break from shame, so, I’ll shame her.. I need to feel powerful, so I’ll hit her and see her looking down at the floor, saying nothing (it serves “me”), etc.

    And it’s the covert type of extreme self centeredness aka narcissism that’s confusing (presenting herself as humble, shy..) and in so being, more harmful perhaps than the overt type.

    So, I didn’t see these things clearly. I was confused. Not because I was stupid but because.. any child would get terribly confused in the exact circumstances I found myself in.

    She portrayed herself to others as humble, generous, good-hearted.. empathetic, but it was only a show, an act, one that fooled me. I see better now.

    As to your recent post, Tee.. a bit later.

    Anita

    #452339
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Tee:

    I hope that you’re feeling well and having a restful night. I’ll post again either tonight or tomorrow morning. Thank you for .. being you!!!

    🙏 ❤️ 🤍 Anita

    #452347
    anita
    Participant

    Continuing the above line of thinking-

    I am becoming clear about who my mother has been: on one hand- an act, a pretense, that of being good and loving and selfless and generous and friendly and normal; and on the other hand, the truth- extremely self-centered, unempathetic, not at all generous in intent, and too often, cruel, intending to harm and finding pleasure in it, a sadistic pleasure. And quite abnormal.

    The feeling of inflicting pain made her feel powerful, and powerful felt pleasurable.

    Her Act confused me for the longest time. Now I see it as an Act. And the real person.. nothing like the act.

    Her act- not at all threatening. Looked so normal and friendly. She looked and sounded like the safest person in the world. When she dropped the act, she was threatening, dangerous- threatening suicide or homicide, or grave injury or just shooting the most shaming words as in out of a cannon.

    So, that has been my mother.

    Now I know. I can see through the Act.

    The love I had for her was the love for an Act.

    The lovable child that she was/is, has been locked inside of her, inaccessible. Locked in, before I was born to her. I saw signals from her inner child but NO ACCESS.

    So, Strange.. not Seeing .. what was glaringly evident all along: that she had no love, no heart 4 me. Not for anyone.

    And the decades of waiting for her, all the efforts.. All were futile. Can’t get an unloving person (mother, in this case), to love (me). Can’t get water out of a rock (did I say it right?)

    She looked and sounded like a loving person (The Act in front of people); but she wasn’t when they were gone, when alone with me, and sometimes she revealed herself to others as well.

    But the ACT, it was an amazing act, she looked and sounded like a genuinely friendly, mentally healthy, outgoing.. normal person. A very convincing act.

    In between the acts all hell broke loose.

    More (and back to your recent post, Tee), in the morning.

    Anita

Viewing 15 posts - 211 through 225 (of 253 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic. Please log in OR register.