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Tee
ParticipantDear LoveMySons,
I am sorry that your youngest son has cut off all communication with you.
I had to look up what parental alienation syndrome is, and it says: “Parental alienation is a strategy whereby one parent intentionally displays to the child unjustified negativity aimed at the other parent. The purpose of this strategy is to damage the child’s relationship with the other parent and to turn the child’s emotions against that other parent.”
Does it mean that your husband has been telling your children stuff against you and made them turn against you, ever since they were 11 and 12 years old? May I ask if you are divorced from your husband?
Their Chinese family had cultural background that said that the children belonged to the āfamilyā aunties as well, and I became the outsider ā¦
Does it mean that the children lived separately from you? I am trying to understand the circumstances…
I am sorry if you were a victim of narcissistic abuse, which also involved alienating you from your children. Please share some more if you’d like to.
Tee
ParticipantHi Adam,
how are things? How have you been doing?
Tee
ParticipantDear Katrine,
Iām not sure. Every time I say something the others reply but not her. Sheās not even making eye contact.
Oh so when you speak in a group setting, she doesn’t even look at you? She’s ignoring you when you’re speaking? And when the others are replying to you, what is she doing? Is she speaking to someone else in the meanwhile? Like having a parallel conversation with someone else in the group?
Well the top manager just sat me down today and said that even though Y is f&b manager it wonāt affect me. The cafĆ© is my area and if she passes the probation and takes over permantly as manager itās not changing my situation, so I was very reliefed to hear that. … But now I feel a lot better. I have worked hard in this job and now itās paying of.
I am glad you received assurances from the top manager and that you’re now more calm about it. It does seem everyone recognizes your hard work and as you say, it is now paying of. Really happy about you, Katrine!
Tee
ParticipantP.S. I now realize that I’ve probably misunderstood this sentence:
She said they worked it out and are good friends now, but it was abig betrayal there.
You probably meant that X and Y worked it out since, not X and the guy who assaulted her, right?
Tee
ParticipantDear Katrine,
I wish you a safe and fun trip to Venice!
As for X, that’s sad that Y and another friend were not supportive after she was assaulted. If I am understanding this correctly, an acquaintance did it, someone she knew? May I ask if alcohol was involved? I am asking because I find it strange that she would later become good friends with him (She said they worked it out and are good friends now) unless they were both drunk and didn’t know what they were doing? It is not my intention to be insensitive, but I just can’t see how else she could forgive him and even be friends with him afterwards?
As for X’s different behavior when she is one-on-one with you, and when you’re in a group, could it be that you’re not very talkative in a group setting, and that’s why she is not paying attention to you? But you interpret it as her being mad at you (I felt she was mad at me and she didnāt really engage in conversations with me). Maybe she is not mad, but she engages more with people who are louder and more talkative?
I am so glad that you are receiving a lot of positive feedback about your work, and that it’s making you happy! Since you were made the cafe supervisor only recently, I see no reason why your job would be in danger. And if they hired 11 new people (and only 3 people left), it means there is a need for new people, i.e. the business is doing good, I’d say. This all tells me that your job is safe.
I mean just last week she started drinking at work before her shift because on of our collegues came back after three months. But she was already feeling the alcohol a bit and the top manager told her she could go join them and get the night off. I thought it looked bad, and the people working were left shorthanded during a very busy time.
That’s strange that the top manager condoned her drinking and gave her the night off. Maybe it was just this once, but it makes me wonder – could it be that she is his protegee, and that’s why she got promoted too?
Tee
ParticipantDear Joyce,
to start a new topic, go to Forums –> All Forums,Ā and then select a category in which you want to post (e.g. Relationships, Tough Times, etc).
In my experience, each post that contains a link automatically goes to moderation. So if you want your post to appear instantly, don’t include any links.
I hope this helps.
Tee
ParticipantDear Katrine,
glad you’ve started talking on the phone with your boyfriend, and that you’re making plans for Portugal. Also good to hear his father is doing better – all great news!
Itās kinda always been like that (kinda like that other guy)
I didn’t know X behaved strangely in the past too. She did seem supportive when you had a crush on the previous guy, but I didn’t know her mood fluctuates and she can sometimes be avoidant too. I guess it has nothing to do with you, but with her own issues.
Have I understood it well that she was raped and got pregnant and had to do an abortion? That’s a horrible trauma! No wonder she is reluctant to talk about her love life. Maybe, just maybe, she is a little jealous of you now that you have a boyfriend and seem to be in a healthy relationship? Because so far you were struggling with relationships, but now this has changed, and she compares herself to you, and in hurts? I don’t know, this is just a thought… In any case, please know that it’s none of your fault if she behaves strangely around you.
Said he wanted to catch up before our girls trip to Venice on Friday.
Are you going with X and Y to Venice?
They made me cafĆ© supervisor when our manager got fired, so Iām in charge of the cafĆ© where I love working.
Congratulations! That’s fantastic!
Iām the only thay have positivly highlighted at every staff meeting saying Iām setting the standards, and now Iām cafĆ© supervisor. People say I deserve it, they all say that the cafĆ© is my domaine and noone does the same amount of work that I do.
Wow, that’s amazing that people recognize your hard work and that everyone supports you. You being the cafe supervisor is well deserved then! And you love working there too, so it’s a perfect match.
So many changes at the moment have had me overwhelmed and I only have two shifts this week not three so trying to calm myself down and not read anything into it.
I don’t think you have anything to worry about. I don’t think your position is in danger, if that’s what you’re afraid of?
She will probably get a lot of complaints because she isnāt ready for this position and it pays more so she has to step up big time.
As the f&b manager, will she be your supervisor as well? The best would be if she steps up and start taking her job seriously… But if not, I hope she won’t last long in that position…
Tee
ParticipantHi SereneWolf,
I have a question. Whatās your absolute favorite thing to do on weekends that isnāt productivity related?
My absolute favorite would be a nature walk with my husband, but since I am suffering with mobility in recent years, this is one thing I had to practically give up, and it’s very hard š
my main concern is I donāt like when people feel discomfort around me or specially because of me. It could be because of my childhood wound as well. You see my fatherās anger was always on the edge so whenever he was around even he was calm I was anxious that at any time heād flip out so I was constantly anxious and worried about his mood swings.
Oh I see… so you are always on the lookout, fearing that somebody (perhaps your boss or an authority figure?) might be displeased with you and lash out at you (verbally)? So you’re afraid of being judged when among people?
You also don’t like people who are constantly critical and try to dominate you (I guess because they remind you of your father?):
I also donāt like being around people who are always projecting negative energy and criticizing others all the time. Or when they trying to be dominant with me for what they want.
You also say you don’t like manipulation:
I donāt like manipulative behaviours, and most of the time I can sense when people are trying to manipulate me or the others.
I wonder if perhaps your mother showed some of the manipulative behavior in the past, e.g. when she would tell you to be “mature” and not react angrily to your father?
But I believe particularly sensitive to the emotions of others, and I kind of struggle with managing my own emotions in response to others.
Could it be that you are sensitive to other people’s anger/frustration/negativity (because it reminds you of your father)? And that you are also sensitive to “weaker” emotions, perhaps worry and sadness, because it reminds you of your mother?
I do think itās kind of a healthy thing since I like things straight forward and itās something that is easier to read from her? In my previous relationships none of them was this much emotionally expressive I had to ask them things so they can let out things you know.. Yet still I wasnāt sure about it. But Now I have this newfound appreciation for this kind of emotional authenticity? (Donāt know if thatās a right word)
I like the word! Good if you can appreciate her honesty and emotional expressiveness. You don’t feel like she is trying to manipulate you with her emotions, right?
But now Iām realizing how much more work that I have to do.. and it feels like a lot
What feels like the biggest work in your current relationship? What’s the hardest?
Yes but finding that kind of a person isnāt easy either. With me, I got really emotionally invested and thought I can work and maintain on these things but yeah itās definitely a two-person job.
Yes, you can’t be the only one “carrying” the relationship. Or as we’ve talked before, if you are trying to change the other person and be their therapist, then of course it feels like hard work. Because you are trying to work against their own self-sabotage and their resistances…
Hmm really? How Iād be able to recognize that?
Well, you’ll see relatively soon that the person has a lot of issues, they can’t be happy, they are addicted, they are self-sabotaging, they are playing hot and cold (one day they are very into you, the next they are rejecting you and being distant) etc etc. So you’ll be able to notice that something’s not right, that they are fighting an internal battle and can’t be really present in the relationship. And then you’ll let them go, instead of trying to “save” them…
Thing that Iām trying to do is that trying to make notes from my past where I took decision and I was right about it so my rational mind donāt always ask me question about it and be little more confident you know..
Are you talking about the decisions you took in romantic relationships? Like when you followed your intuition and it turned out to be the right decision?
I also had an appointment with my therapist. She told me Iām doing quite good progress.
Glad about that!
And I talked about CPTSD as well. So listened things carefully and ask me lot of scenario type questions about my childhood. But she said she isnāt sure about and said there is really mild signs about it. But still we can work on it.
Well, I think everyone who was exposed to prolonged emotional abuse suffers from CPTSD. It’s a different name for developmental trauma – it didn’t happen suddenly, like one traumatic event, but over a long time, i.e. while growing up. So I guess you have it, same as me and numerous other children with emotionally abusive/unsupportive parents.
So she asked me What happens if you buy something expensive without asking your parents? How theyād react and how youād feel?
And I said Iād still feel hesitant about it because Iād be worried what theyād think and feel guilty because I havenāt even asked them.
So she asked me questions like that and said I still have fearful emotional pattern that I need to work on. Even though now Iām financially independent now Iām still attached to this kind of unhealthy emotional bondā¦
Right.. so you’re still afraid of their judgment. You still care what they’ll think of you, and I think it’s because a part of you still believes you’re not good enough. So you need their validation and approval.
Fearful emotional patten and self-esteem these two things mainly she gave me homework for⦠Because like we talked, she said because of long term of criticism from every side (even my inner critic) My self-esteem took lot of damage and I have to heal thatā¦
Yes, you were criticized a lot, and you internalized that voice, and so now you don’t only have the voice of your father and grandfather against you, but also your own inner critical voice. So it’s 3 to 1. Three critics to one helpless inner child. Fortunately, you’re developing the positive father voice to counter those critics. But it takes time, it doesn’t happen over night…
She actually suggested me to talk more with my parents about this kind of things so they would be aware that Iām much more grown up than what they might think
What exactly did she suggest you talk to them about? I mean, if you still have an unhealthy emotional bond (which in my opinion is the fear of their judgement, i.e. the need for their approval), only you can release that bond. Only you can set yourself free.
Because as you said, your parents will likely not change. They’ve changed somewhat in the sense that they (specially your father) isn’t that judgmental with you any more. But I guess they’ll never approve of all of your decisions, e.g. they’ll never approve of you getting a tattoo š
What I am saying is that if you want their blessing to live your life as you please, I don’t think you’ll get it. And I don’t think it’s necessary either. There will be always something they will disagree with. And that’s fine.
What you’d rather need is to free yourself from the need to get their approval… It’s you who should set yourself free, not them…
Tee
ParticipantDear faber castell,
you are very welcome!
true things have happened and keep happening. Itās NOT in the past. These people keep being my one and only karma and now Iām without my mom, they one person who I truly loved from that family⦠so wow.
Yes, real abuse – emotional abuse – has happened to you, and it is still happening at the hands of these cruel, narcissistic people, who are unfortunately your family. You are now in the middle of a legal battle (have you sued them?), and are depending on their good-will to give you what belongs to you, but was taken away from you and your mother. And their good-will is zero, it is non-existent, as they have proven many years ago, since the moment you moved in with them.
I hope you won’t mind me saying this, but your story reminds me of the story of Cinderella, only you didn’t suffer at the hands of the evil step-mother and step sisters, but rather, at the hands of evil uncles (and possible their wives and children)? I mean, the way they treated you is abhorrent:
When my father died, since they didnāt like him, they decided never to mention him, or the situation. The day my dad passed, no one spoke to me. No one gave me a hug. Nothing. I was already living in that house and they wouldnāt speak to me, I was 14 years old⦠They even later told my mom they couldnāt avoid being mean to me because I looked too much like my dad. They wouldnāt allow me to use the computer, or answer the phone, theyād come in angry bursts to āpunishā me for things I never didā¦
It was abuse through and through. They didn’t even try to stop themselves from being mean, because in their mind, you deserved it since you resembled your father so much. I am sorry this happened you to, it was so unfair to be exposed to their wickedness. I am glad you did have some strength to resist though, e.g. that you stopped coming for lunch, even if they called you rebellious and disrespectful:
all a horrible systematic dynamic that lasted for the first years until I totally isolated and stopped having lunch with them, etc (which was also a reason to call me a rebel, a disrespectful teen, etc.)
But I am sorry your mother didn’t protect you better. I am sorry that she chose to tolerate their abuse, even after they told her openly that they are mean to you because you remind them of your father! I understand she was in a financially vulnerable situation, but still, that was a big price to pay to stay in that house, and let them abuse you… so she can finance your school and later college. BTW I don’t quite understand: you say she had to pay for your school. Does it mean you went to a private school?
I totally understand why you resented her for staying there, or for at least not standing up for you and protecting you:
But I did resent her a lot for not being more firm with them. For not seeing them for who they actually were, even after proving it once, twice and a million times.
It seems she had low self-esteem and actually believed those accusations by her family:
it was absurd the amount of abuse that she also received from them, making her feel like a failure, like she married someone who was beneath them and his death sort of proved it, she could only feel shame and at least feel grateful that they would take us in.
Instead of standing up to them, she believed them and felt bad about herself. And she let them abuse you, and even take her inheritance…
It’s good you are a different type than her – that you didn’t believe those lies and accusations that her family was saying about you, and that you chose to protect yourself the best you could from their abuse:
BUT, there is something in me thats quite different and I value it a lot, and itās the fact that I might have mistakes, I might be vulnerable in some ways, but I DONāT fall for certain things and it pisses me off that they did that to her. They would have never been able to do that to me,
Good! It’s good you’re stronger and you don’t believe their lies. It’s good that you don’t believe you deserve to be humiliated and abused like that. Unfortunately, you were a child back then and couldn’t really impact her decisions, so the only thing you can do regarding the inheritance is try to reverse your mother’s decision, if possible. If not, you’ll need to let it go.
However, I think it’s much more important for you to heal the emotional wounds inflicted upon you, and in that way receive your “satisfaction”. Even if you don’t receive it in the material form.
In the end, i donāt know who I am anymore, I clearly am a very traumatized person, honestly people sometimes donāt even see it and see me quite functioning, but THE moment I start talking and sharing about this even my closest friends gaslight me. like, yeah but you shouldnāt live in the past, you cannot hold so many grudges, you have to forgive, etc.
You don’t need to forgive. What you need is to stop allowing that their wickedness – past and present – affect you. You need to stop letting them have emotional control over your life.
If you want them to apologize, forget it – they’ll never do it. If you want them to admit they did any wrong – forget it, they are incapable of that. If you want anything from them (emotionally), you’ll be stuck, because you’ll let them emotionally control you.
So you need to let go expecting anything from them (other than possibly your part of the inheritance, but that’s a different topic). Only then can you be free. But first, before you can stop expecting anything, you need to express you anger, not to their faces but to a good therapist, or even just to yourself.
Recently I saw a video where the coach said: don’t look for others (like friends and family) to validate your anger. Don’t wait for them to tell you you have the right to feel angry. Validate your own anger. Know that you have the right to feel angry. And then write it down, write it on a piece of paper – write down everything you are angry about. Don’t show it to the perpetrators. Don’t show it to anybody. It’s for your eyes only. But validate your own anger. It will cause a shift in you, I believe. Because you won’t need your friends to validate it for you, and it will remove the burden from them too.
I also want to say that what your father did when he apologized to you is amazing! It’s really rare and so precious. I can imagine it gave you a lot of healing, because you understood that he actually means well, that he understands you and loves you. He saw your need and responded to it. And then he tried not to hurt you like that any more. That’s really precious and I am happy you had such a healing experience with your father!
Tee
ParticipantDear Lisa,
you’re very welcome. I hope the resources on CPTSD will be of help to you. I also hope you can claim your space under the sun, rather than “live my life as a server and observer, not thinking I am here to live”. Because you totally deserve to live your life and thrive, even if the people around you and the circumstances you were born into tell you differently!
Wishing you all the best, and post if you have any questions regarding CPTSD or anything at all.
P.S. True, anita is no longer on the forums, which is very unfortunate. I hope she will return some day, soon enough.
Tee
Participant* sorry, the title of the video is: Complex PTSD explained.
Tee
ParticipantDear Lisa,
there is another great and completely free resource on CPTSD, which I forgot to mention yesterday, and it is the Crappy Childhood Fairy youtube channel. If you are interested, you can start with this video: Complex CPTSD explained. She explains why we get CPTSD, what are the typical symptoms, and she has plenty of advice on her channel about what to do to help ourselves.
You mentioned a while ago that you suffer from hormonal problems. I don’t know if you’ve received treatment for it, but even that can be a symptom of CPTSD.
Anyway, I hope this information is helpful to you and can give you some relief, and perhaps some hope as to how to proceed.
Tee
ParticipantDear faber castell,
I’ve just read some parts of your story, and it seems you’ve been gaslighted a lot as a child (and later), and told that you shouldn’t be angry when in fact your anger was justified because your needs haven’t been met. You also said you’ve realized that some members of your family are narcissistic:
I now realize that the pattern of emotional abuse in my family is very complicated and sneaky. Now, after many years, Iāve realized theyāre pathological narcissists, which is the reason why I donāt count on them for any of this. The way they treated me when my mother passed just did it for me and I could finally connect the dots and free myself.
You earlier said that your mother left your emotionally distant father at a certain point, but she took you to an even worse place:
I was never too conscious of the amount of anger I felt towards my mom mostly complaining about this but never quite leaving, and when leaving, taking me to the most violent of places, although, she always gave me the love that others didnāt. IT WAS confusing. I was angry, a lot, and my family, much to their own fitting just reproduced the idea in others that I was a difficult teenager.
Did she take you to her own family, which was “the most violent of places”? Are those the people who are pathological narcissists, who treated you poorly after you mother died, and with whom you are now in a legal dispute (I now have some legal issues with my family cause she did try to leave it all clear for me but my family has legal rights over her stuff)? Are those the same people?
It seems that later, you were involved with some narcissistic people, e.g. that yogini boyfriend of yours, who used you for sex although he knew he wanted to break up with you.
You also had a negative experience with therapists, whom you said denied your reality and retraumatized you:
I totally need therapy but Iām tired of others judging me for whatever blame they always find in my story.
many therapists have also told me, or told me back then, things like ādonāt victimize yourselfā, etc., which only made things worse,Ā whenever I felt the true need to value myself and speak up, which at the same time requiered for me to recognize unfair treatment, I got really discouraged.
It seems you did experience a lot of gaslighting, not only from your family and romantic partners, but even from your therapists. Unfortunately, there are therapists like that, e.g. in a couple’s therapy they often end up being charmed away by the narcissist and start blaming the victim. A famous expert on narcissism, Dr. Ramani, talks about it in her youtube video: Gaslighted by your therapist. I highly recommend it.
As Dr. Ramani suggests, you’d need a therapist who understands narcissism deeply and can see through narcissistic tricks. There are such people out there, so don’t get discouraged.
I think it would be very important that you can finally tell your story to someone – the story of how you were abused and how it was denied and you were blamed for it instead. Your truth needs to be seen and heard – it needs to be validated – so you can start healing and trusting yourself again.
If you’d like to share some more about the abuse that happened in your family, you are very welcome.
Tee
ParticipantDear Lisa,
I haven’t been on the forums when you first started writing, but got some understanding of your story by reading anita’s summary earlier on this thread. I am sorry you’ve been through all that trauma and that it is still affecting you, making you live in the survival mode.
I will never be successful if the people around me do not want to see success.
It seems you’re hoping that people would help you, but the kind of people you’re expecting help from aren’t really good and safe people? Perhaps you need to stop hoping to get anything from them, and start believing that you can make it without them? And instead of them, surround yourself with good, supportive people? Which are out there, no doubt about that.
You have been through a lot as a child and experienced more than one Adverse Childhood Experience (ACE). That’s why you are probably suffering from Complex PTSD (C-PTSD), like many children who have been emotionally abused or neglected (I suffered from it too).
I was thinking if perhaps you would benefit from support programs offered at places such as the CPTSD Foundation (cptsd foundation dot org), where there are programs like Daily recovery support calls, Daily encouraging mails, Healing book club etc – all for survivors of childhood trauma. There is a small fee to pay for those programs, but maybe you can browse through the website, read some articles and see if you want to learn more about C-PTSD and recovery.
Of course, there are numerous other resources on the net about C-PTSD. Let me know if it is something that interests you, and I can give you some more pointers…
April 6, 2023 at 9:37 am in reply to: Married, children and trapped in a basement of hopeless #417097Tee
ParticipantDear Wren,
I am really sorry about your declining health and your poor living conditions!
I am still locked away in a basement, nothing of my own. I shower in a sink. My kids are very taken care of and happy
Does it mean you live alone in the basement, in poor conditions, while your children live separately (maybe in the same house, but upstairs?) and have good living conditions? Where is your husband in the whole story?
I would like to understand more, if you’d like to share…
I do hope your health gets better and you can return to art and also free yourself from the current living arrangements…
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