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anitaParticipant
Dear soma
Dear soma:
I am fine, at home and soon going to bed. I will reply further Fri morning. Have a good Fri in your part of the world, precious soma!
anita
anitaParticipantDear Tee:
Congratulations for doing so well in your career in the banking industry! I hope that you manage to buy the beach house you desire, and that you get in shape and lose the weight you want to lose.
You ended your recent, Sept 27, 2023 short post with: “I don’t have to wear my heart on my sleeve for anybody. Have I turned cold and selfish haha? I am just protecting my heart more and loving me more. If I don’t love myself who will right? Well actually my cats love me regardless I think.”-
– I want to explore the idea of wearing your heart on your sleeve with a man (being in a relationship) vs being cold and selfish (living as a single woman… perhaps as a future cat lady):
Let’s look at the very beginning of your original post back in April 4, 2020 (three years, five months and two weeks ago; the boldface feature is my addition): “So, 8 years ago I came out of a relationship that I thought was perfect and really thought we were going to get married… I focused on myself for the next 4 years and just living my life in solidarity. I enjoyed my life and regret nothing. Then on the 4th year I met a man.. everything seemed to fit and I was content and happy. This year going on our 4th year together I realized something and it felt so sad, painful, and lonely… He is and was perfect when it came to the type of man I wanted in my life. But, this one aspect threw me off this ‘perfect’ relationship. Whenever I talked about something I’m going through in my life regarding my parents and how they made me feel he just doesn’t know how to respond. He either just listens or just gives me one words responses. Sometimes I would talk about things that made me sad or frustrated. I grew up in a house where my parents continuously argued…”-
– (1) Because of the turbulent nature of your childhood home, the arguing, the disorder, the conflict, the ongoing, never to be resolved distress, you found a calm refuge- as a child- in solidarity (“I.. stayed in my own world. I did not have playmates growing up. I did not get to have friends till I was in high school”). Fast forward, as an adult woman, you find refuge in solidarity.
(2) Part of you tried to find refuge in a relationship: you wanted a man to resolve the conflict you grew up in, way before he ever got into your life (an impossible task for any man). When you felt a man was perfect, it was because you put him on a pedestal so that he will be able- from his elevated position- to resolve your childhood experience. Notice that the first problem you mentioned in regard to the 2nd man (your boyfriend at the time), is that he didn’t know how to respond to what you told him regarding your parents.
In my first reply to you, I wrote about your boyfriend at the time: “he can’t change what happened to you. He can’t go back in time and rescue the girl that you were from the war-zone kind of a home where you grew up”, and you replied: “After writing all that and reading it myself I realized those are problems only I can fix and I’m aware of that. I just want to feel I guess warm inside and feel safe somehow around him. Maybe I’m looking for some magical phrase or sentence to make the pain go away”-
– rationally, you realized that he cannot fix the turbulence in your mind (the turbulent leftover from your childhood), but emotionally you expected him to do just that: to turn that turbulence into feeling warm and safe inside. Neither he, nor any man is capable of such magic.
You said it yourself in page 1 or 2 of your thread: “I hope one day I can truly leave this emotional torment behind and be happy…I guess in this relationship I’ve been trying to get everything I didn’t have growing up”.
My input today: What I pointed to above does not mean that your boyfriend at the time was the right man for you, or that he would have become the right man for you (and marry you) if you didn’t have this unrealistic expectation of him. What I pointed to, and with which you agree on a rational level, would make any and every man the wrong man for you. Like you, I too had unrealistic expectations of a man and I learned since what is realistic to expect and what is not.
Again, good to read back from you!
anita
anitaParticipantDear EvFran:
I don’t know if you will be reading this. If you do, I want to tell you how much I appreciate what you wrote in the thread regarding my leaving the forums. I literally cried when I read it. Thank you so much for your kindness and big heart!
How are you and how is your mother?
anita
anitaParticipantDear Tee: good to read back from you! I will reply further in the morning.
anita
anitaParticipantDear Peace:
“How could they be so heartless…?“- I asked a similar question in regard to my mother: how could she have no heart for me? And I too was in denial about it, believing that she did love me, she must have…
It was only this morning that I thought: I should contact her just to tell her that I love her too (I’ve been in no contact with her for 10 years, my choice). But then I said to myself: but she doesn’t love me and no amount of love on my part can make up for her lack of love for me; no amount of reaching out to her with love can bridge the chasm between me (my love for her) and her (lack of love for me).
“.. Why were they so selfish, making me feel utterly worthless and devoid of meaning?“- I no longer ask this question in regard to my mother, I am accepting the very sad but true reality that there is no love for me coming from her. It is a very difficult reality to accept, but moving on to a better reality (at least when it comes to my quality of life in between my ears) depends on accepting this. And not trying once again.. and again.. and again to change the unchangeable.
anita
anitaParticipantDear Peace:
You are welcome. “I believe I’m still in a state of denial“- can you define the state of denial for me, in one short sentence: what is it exactly that you are denying?
anita
anitaParticipantDear Stacy:
“Also, thank you“- you are welcome!
“I have the game plan of what will help make me feel like a capable woman, but shorter term goals need to happen and I need to see value in myself right now… I know I have to feel good with myself while I work towards those long term goals and it just feels impossible to go 30-ish years feeling so insignificant and like a burden to suddenly loving myself. It’s the biggest void I’m trying to fill.“-
– a severe lack of self-worth is a huge void, a vacuum, and a very painful one. Like any vacuum, it quickly gets filled with whatever is around it. In this case, it gets filled with self-doubts, self-judgment, guilt and shame, and you find yourself occupied with these painful negative feelings.
Like other animals, our first, instinctual, most urgent need is to survive, and therefore, we instinctually focus on pain for the purpose of confronting what’s causing it (ex., an injury), healing it and stopping the pain. When an animal is experiencing significant or severe pain, it is not motivated to eat or sleep or mate, pain is the singular focus. Similarly, when a person experiences significant to severe emotional pain, the person’s focus is on the pain and what’s causing it; the person is not able to focus on something positive, such as the goal of becoming a capable woman.
You have a game plan to become a capable woman, having long-term goals that depend on short-term goals.. but these painful negative feelings are in the way: how can you feel like, and become a capable woman, if you are filled with self-doubts, judgment, guilt and shame? (I’ll get to it in a moment).
“you mentioned earlier in one of your posts that even after you moved out and met your external goals, that you still struggled with negative feelings“-
– you are probably referring to my sharing that at the age of 24, I flew across the world by myself- far, far away from my torment-filled relationship with my mother- ending up in New York City during Christmas time (talking about Christmas!), feeling HAPPY perhaps for the first time in my life, positive and hopeful. It was a magical time, a thrilling time. But then.. seeing all the magic, I felt sorry for my poor mother who so often complained about having had a miserable life, never traveling, never seeing the world.. I was filled with empathy for her (I cared too much for her) and guilt, so I arranged for her to fly and stay in NYC. Once she arrived- and even before she arrived- gone was the Magic and back was the Torment.
Imagine that you move out of your loud, chaotic home (as you described it), and find yourself living in a quiet, calm and peaceful home. At first, you enjoy the newness so much, it’s magical! But then, you think to yourself: my poor mother, my poor sister: they are living in a loud, chaotic home.. Oh, how they’d love living where I am now. And so, you invite them to live with you, and.. gone is the newness and back is the same old, same old loudness and chaos.
“If you don’t mind me asking, but did your work in therapy help build your self-worth and self-trust?“- (1) It helped having a person listen to me and talk to me respectfully. What a refreshing experience. (2) It helped having a person being curious about what I think and feel, a person caring about what’s happening in my heart and mind. Invisibility is what I was used to before. (It was like war was happening in my mind and heart day in and day out.. and no one noticed, or cared).
My mother used to conduct those Shaming Sessions against me, sessions she said I deserved: she would corner me and facing me, she would say out loud, very loudly, the most shaming words, humiliating me in any and every possible way she could think of. She’d shame me in one way, then figure that there was a better, more effective way to shame me, so she did, and she’d go about it enthusiastically. She was very creative that way, and very motivated. She wouldn’t stop shaming and guilt-tripping me, and hitting me (telling me that the only thing she liked about me was that I silently looked down at the floor when she hit me) until she ran out of words and breath. “Look what you did to me”, she’d say, looking at her hands, “you made my hands hurt” she’d say, referring to having hit me to the point that she felt pain in her hands.
I believed her and proceeded to lived a life that a bad, shameful, guilty person deserves. I was filled with severe self-worth-void, a vacuum filled with shame and guilt. Dissociated much of the time, wishing to die.. and feeling sorry for her, overwhelmed by empathy for her, and none for me. She was still- throughout all this- “the best mother in the world”, her words=> my words. She did buy me things, toys and clothes and my favorite cake, a chocolate marzipan cake.
Back to your question: “Did your work in therapy help build your self-worth and self-trust?“- it helped but it didn’t build my self-worth and self-trust. What helped me most has been better interactions with people in real-life and my daily participation in the forums of tiny buddha May 2015-Feb/March 2023, resumed recently, including my communication with you and this very post that I am about to submit to you, one I’ve been working on for 3-4 hours so far.
What I shared with you, those Shaming Sessions, I never shared about them the way I did with you this very morning. In the past, when I shared about my Torment with my mother, I was detached, dissociated and didn’t quite believe that it really happened and that it was that bad and I didn’t believe that.. she was the one at fault.
It took figuratively giving my mother the badness that belongs to her, so that I don’t carry it anymore within me. Removing that badness that filled the void, made it possible for a measure of self-worth and self-trust to take the space previously occupied by shame and guilt. I still feel empathy for my mother (with whom I had no contact for ten years), but I also feel empathy for myself. My sister contacted me six months ago, suggesting that I reconnect with my mother, telling me that she’s getting old, that she has “a lot of good in her”, and that she and admits having “made mistakes”. No elaboration on “mistakes”. I refused the suggestion.
The pain is still within me this morning, but it is my pain, not her pain. In other words, I now belong to myself and what is mine- is mine, not hers, not my mother’s. My life is not hers and it is not about her, not anymore.
You wrote in your most recent post: “it’s true that my mom and sister are struggling so much with their own issues that they are just incapable of giving me the energy and patience I need. I kind of feel like I’m not able to be a present daughter either right now, I’m struggling with my own issues“- their issues and your issues are not separate issues for as long as you are living with them and for as long as you care about them more than you care about yourself. Choose you over them, be number 1, own your life, make it your own.
anita
anitaParticipantDear Anna:
I was happy to read your post on the day after you posted the above, more than 3 months ago, happy to read that you resolved the issue in your relationship by applying empathy, patience, persistence and wisdom, and the two of you growing together and becoming closer. Thank you for returning to your thread and sharing this!
anita
anitaParticipantDear Kodi:
You are welcome. The following are my thoughts, understandings and impressions, correct or not- it is for you to decide. It may distress you to read or to consider what’s to follow, so please, be prepared, and you are welcome, of course, to read or not to read, to address and reply to any part, or not. My motivation is to help just a bit, I hope.
“My Dad and I were eating lunch one day and he suddenly said ‘Everything that comes out of your mouth is negative‘“-
– I know that it is not true that everything that comes out of your mouth is negative because you’ve been trying hard throughout your threads to state the positives, and you stated positives even without trying. Examples: first, original post, 4th sentence, Sept 2016: “I am happily married with a 5 year old son; we have our own house in a small town and a dog…“; Nov 2017: “My husband is in turn very loving and sensitive to my feelings“; Aug 2021 (addressed to me): “Thank you so much for your kind and supportive response“; July 2023: “ I actually have a pretty good life – happily married, employed, have a house, a wonderful son“; Sept 25, 2023 (your most recent post): “My parents… are having the time of their lives. For the most part, my Mother’s anxiety is a thing of the past, as is my father’s negativity“.
So, why (I am asking myself) did your father say that everything that comes out of your mouth is negative? The only reason I can think of is that he was angry at you, and therefore, he was- not empathetic- but rude to you.
“When I mentioned to my Mom that that bothered me, she said she agreed“- so both unempathetic toward you. I mean, if your mother was empathetic, she’d ask you (if she didn’t yet know) why you are so negative, or she’d apologize for instilling negativity in you (“they instilled it in me in the first place“, it being negativity).
“I get it, they’re trying to make me aware of how negative I am“- (1) they are not aware that you are already aware? (2) are they not aware that they instilled negativity in you; they think that you were born negative and it has nothing to do with them..?
“but I don’t respond well to ‘tough love’“- like the song says, “what’s love got to do with it?” A child is invested in seeing her parents in the most positive light; often, children (into adulthood) interpret their parents’ expressed anger and even abuse as “tough love”. (I say it’s tough.. but it’s not love).
“There are many reasons for my negativity – not only is it ingrained I’m me, but I’m unhappy at work. Every job I have ends up that way, because I’m easily stressed“- if negativity is ingrained in a person during childhood, it doesn’t disappear in the context of work, or adulthood. Negativity instilled in childhood is far reaching and it contaminates a variety of adult contexts.
“I’ve always had this silly vision of myself as a 50s housewife“- 1950s/ early 60s TV series do depict traditional homes as peaceful homes.
“A few years back I quit my job and took 2 months off. It was the happiest & healthiest I’ve felt since my maternity leave“- I had a happiest and healthiest 2-months off my anxiety and depression when I first left my mother and country and travelled to New York City during Christmas.. Magical. But then I got together with my mother in NYC and the magic turned to anxiety and depression.
“I resent that my parents are so happy & carefree, because I want it so badly for me, too“- happy, carefree, after a lifetime of stress? (I wonder if they are recently retired and are experiencing their own temporary Magic)
Currently, you are 42. In your previous threads you shared: “I.. battled anxiety and depression all my life… I have had severe anxiety and depression since I was a teenager” and in this thread: “I’ve had anxiety and depression all my life“.
Previously: “My Mother-in-law lives in a little cottage by the lake. Visiting her is one of my favorite things to do – she’s very calm and loving and loves to laugh. her sun porch and backyard bring such peace to me, I feel like I’m away from it all. It’s hard to leave. In a way I feel like I’m driving away from heaven, back into hell (the real world)“-
-your life growing up at home, with your parents was very stressful, unloving, no laughter… no peace.. hard to live in.. hell…?
“I don’t blame myself for their anxiety, nor do I blame them” (2023)- but you blame yourself for the anxiety they instilled in you?
“I have good relationships with my parents” (2016)- at what cost?
“Unfortunately, I’m doing the same thing with my son. I’m aware of it and I try to keep it in control, but I fear I’ve instilled it in a him. He has different triggers than I do, and he’s not nearly as anxious as I, but I see it” (July 2023)- is experiencing so much anxiety on your part, for so long, and passing it on to the next generation.. is it the cost/ the price to pay for you having good relationships with your parents, not rocking the boat with them?
“Is it okay to want to be happy?” (the title of this thread): it is okay to blame your parents (“I .. don’t blame them“) for what they are responsible for- for no other reason but so to remove the blame from yourself, to free yourself from guilt that doesn’t belong to you (“I have so much guilt… I feel like a horrible person“, July 10, 2023), .. Free yourself from unearned guilt, and you’ll free yourself from much of the anxiety and depression you’ve suffered from for so long.
Easier said than done, isn’t it?
anita
anitaParticipantDear Luna:
(1) I am all for (in most life circumstances) thinking before acting; planning and executing a plan instead of impulsively reacting. And I am all for thinking accurately and productively. So, never will I suggest to anyone (again, in most life circumstances) to abandon thinking and let emotion take over.
(2) I know that you are educated and very intelligent, therefore I am guessing that a lot of what I may write at any time, if you agree with it, it’s something you .. already know. But there are all kinds of knowing (1+1 is not always 2.. which is something you already know.. right?)
(3) The following are my thoughts, my impressions, not written in stone, and I am fine with you disagreeing and rejecting any or all of them:
“I feel like I wanna… feel the emotion instead of thinking it“-
– Feeling (being aware of) our emotions gives us valuable information for the purpose of accurate, productive thinking and/ or action. Behind every physical sensation and emotion, or a mix of emotions, there is a message: hunger=> I need to eat, I’ll pick up an apple from this tree and eat it, cold=> I need to get warm, I’ll find a sweater in the closet and put it on, anger=> I am facing danger, I need to protect myself, maybe fight, I’ll grab the bear spray, lonely=> I need to socialize, I’ll call a friend, Frustrated (title of your thread)=> I need to find clarity, I’ll start a thread on tiny buddha.
Let’s look at a sentence from your original post: “I find myself thinking a lot that a romantic companionship will be very beneficial to me in terms of my personal growth right now“- you are thinking that you might need a romantic companionship, you are not.. feeling the need for one? It is as if you are an object to yourself, as in thinking: romantic companionship will be beneficial for that person over there (Luna).
“Overall, I think it is a good way to try to understand people on a mental level in parallel with the emotional experience“- parallel lines never meet. Thinking and feeling need to meet. (I have a thing with words, sometimes- and this might be one of these times- I take them too literally).
“First relationships… can be constructive in terms of gaining social experience and a better understanding of people“- first relationships can be constructive to people, including to Luna, the person over there. Not.. I am lonely, or I am longing for love..
“First relationships often end up being a test before one really settles… I think of the first relationships as being a set of errors and trials typically (although there are success stories of those who settle in their first relationship!)“- (1) Many who settle in their first relationship are settled in misery too much of the time, (2) all relationships (first and last) are sets of errors and trials, there’s never a happily-ever-after, trouble-free relationship. (3) learning outside and within relationships is key to thoughtfully and wisely choosing the most compatible partner for a life together. A high level of compatibility is crucial for a relationship that is as free as possible from unnecessary problems and troubles.
I have more thoughts but I’ll wait to find out, if I will, what you are thinking about what I wrote so far, and if you’re interested in more of my thoughts.
anita
anitaParticipantDear Luna: I will read and reply in about 11 hours from now.
anita
anitaParticipantDear Kodi: I will read and reply to you in the morning (in about 11 hours from nw).
anita
anitaParticipantDear Ben:
Having read your recent post, I am back to feeling optimistic. I know that you are a good person, and I think/ feel that he is too, and that being with you will be good for him, that he will mature in the context of a committed relationship with you. I am rooting for the two of you! I am curious to know what’s next…
anita
anitaParticipantI’ll add to the above: I tend to be suspicious of people, quick to look at/ see negatives, real or imagined, so be aware of this tendency of mine, as I am aware of it and trying to not let it cloud my view of the objective reality..
anita
anitaParticipantDear Ben:
“He (love interest) said… ‘I don’t want him (his boyfriend) to do something crazy’…. he (love interest) said ‘I know him (his boyfriend), he wasn’t just making drama’.. He (love interest) said before he had had a girlfriend who threatened suicide after they broke up“-
– what if.. it is your love-interest who is into drama…?
When I read (yesterday) that your plan to support him financially while he studies medicine in Argentina, and then to move to Argentina, has been revived by your love interest (“He seemed to readily revive this plan“), I became concerned. I will try to explain: through your descriptions of your love-interest, I kind-of, sort-of.. fell in love with him a bit myself, but I don’t know him well. On the other hand, I know you way better from direct communication with you. So, I am taking a step back asking myself about his motivations and relationship history and what these could mean to you, if you invested so much in him. What do you think?
anita
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