Dear Robi:

Good to read again from you, as always!

“I guess things are hardly ever the way we expect them to be“- for as long as we keep expecting what is unrealistic to expect, lol.

“I’m now writing from a cafe in the centre of Warsaw”– sounds exotic, I’ve never been there, wanted to.

“I came here on Friday to spend the Easter holidays with my girlfriend. What a fast month this has been.. such contrast being again back here… This is great though! I stepped out of my comfort zone and again realised there isn’t much to be worried about. Actually, there’s nothing to be worried about. The only truly worrying situation was the one I was in – not taking action and not fully trusting myself. Almost sounds like a cliché – a bumper sticker I might one day stick to the bottom of my car“- not a cliche to me. I do wish you copied some of this into a plaque to put on the wall, or if small enough, to carry with you wherever you go.

“I understand why I wouldn’t trust myself… Now in my 30’s I see this version collapsing. Finally!“- C o N g R a T u L a T i O n S,   Robi!

“Now, there are a few issues“- of course, there always are, sooner or later (nice to have breaks from issue though).

“Growing is great! I feel empowered and I seem to deal with my work life a lot better than I did before!…  The thing is.. I don’t really like being an English teacher. I think I like teaching… I just don’t like teaching English… I feel like I’m working for peanuts… I jumped from being so anxious to feeling undervalued… I’m not going to quit my job.. but I’m now thinking of better options. There’s something burning inside of me! There’s a part of me that keeps telling me I can do a lot better and I want to listen to my inner voice… here I am now introspecting and writing it down. I needed this so much. I needed to zoom out but also zoom in. Now I feel like I want to learn more about honouring my authentic self… I feel like I need to expand more… I haven’t yet found my own way of expression – my voice, my fingerprint / the way I show up in the world“- Empowered, you want more of it, more power. The feeling of power-within is intoxicating, isn’t it? And then, from that feeling of personal power, envisioning how much greater life can be. . you underestimate how great it already is. The here-and-now seems inferior when you imagine greater things.

Please do listen and honor your authentic self and keep that something-inside of you burning, but turn the fire down so that you don’t get consumed in it. Don’t get carried away with the feeling of power. Keep yourself grounded in reality. And do look for better paying, less exhausting, more meaningful (for you) options.

“Luckily,  I know a few things… I want to have my own way of doing things… I’ve recently heard someone say: ‘In modern society the opposite of courage isn’t cowardness, but conformity’ – this really resonated with me. I guess I’m that kind of guy.. who doesn’t want to join the masses – I don’t feel like having some meaningless job… I want to be again in tune with my inner child and with the desire and vision I know I once had…“- your inner child is excited, empowered and hopeful, and he needs Robi-the-adult’s guidance. Robi-the-adult needs to pace the child-within, to teach him to have his own way of doing things.. in realistic, reasonable ways.

No adult can get to a place of non-conformity without conforming in some ways. It is not one or the other. Dare to conform where and when needed, dare to not conform when it’s possible! And it is possible for you to not conform in someways, every day. Take advantage of these every day opportunities. No such opportunity is too small to bother with!

“Thank you so much for giving me this space! Sending you a big hug Robi“- you are very welcome, thank you for coming back here, and a big virtual hug back to you! Take care of yourself, be good to your girlfriend and to yourself!

anita

Dear antarkala:

I’ve known about R-OCD for many years, and I occasionally come across it in these forums. I just googled “rocd, tiny buddha forums” and what appeared is a Dec 2017 thread, in which I participated, titled “ROCD“. Original post: “Does anyone else suffer from this. Do you have any tips to try and overcome it?”

My answer (Dec 29, 2017): “My tips: evaluate the relationship rationally. If your boyfriend behaves toward you with empathy and respect, if he is assertive with you, not passive or aggressive, and encourages you to be assertive as well, if it is a good relationship (although not perfect, as it can’t be perfect) and you often enough feel love for him, but you are doubting it repeatedly, for a long time, then quality psychotherapy may be the answer.

In psychotherapy, anxiety, the core issue in ROCD (and in so many, many conditions and symptoms), will need to be attended to, early experiences and relationships  (with your parents, mostly) will need to be explored.

A break or separation may be necessary if your distress is too great and/or if your doubting causes him distress and is harming him.“

Another, a Jan 2018 thread, in which I participated as well, titled “ROCD help me“, original post: “I’ve been struggling with rocd for almost 4 months now and I’ve just become completely exhausted and depressed by the constant overthinking and checking if I still love my bf… I still have that awful weight on my chest that I’m just not in love with him and that breaking up is the right thing to do”.

My response (Jan 8, 2018): “The relief you feel when you think of ending the relationship is about ending the obsession. The obsession is painful. It is a painful way to live, as you well know.

If you are not currently attending psychotherapy and working on this, then you do need to end this obsession somehow. It is better to not be in a relationship with him than it is to be obsessed, I am thinking.“

Here is another, a May 2020 thread titled “ROCD Or do I not love him?” Original post: “..Around the first month of us being together, I was thinking about him in class. While thinking about him, the thought ‘Do I really love him’ Came to mind. Once this came to mind, I started to obsess with the thought. I started comparing our relationship to past relationships and I started searching stuff up online for temporary relief. Fast forward to now, it still happens. I’m constantly observing my feelings and my moods… There’s no reason why I wouldn’t love him. There’s been no red flags or anything…. I was wondering if anyone had advice or any idea of what it is?..”

My response, May 3, 2020, (quotes from the OP are italicized): “‘I was craving him every second. Now, .. I don’t feel like that’– craving someone every second is not sustainable, it is too exhausting to the brain/ body, therefore this craving is time limited.

‘when I get upset with him or want some time alone’– that happens to everyone, in the best relationships. We feel upset once in a while, and upset or not, at times we need to be alone.

All OCD is based on ongoing fear aka anxiety. Your focus on loving him or not is fueled by your anxiety. You wrote that you didn’t experience this obsessing before, with other men. Maybe it is happening to you at this point because of elevated anxiety overall, maybe pandemic related?“

Here’s an Oct 2022 thread titled: “Crippling Relationship Anxiety – Please Help“. Original post: “I have been with my boyfriend for 5 years. We have grown together so much in this time. We are not perfect, but we are strong, and we have a very healthy relationship… We are kind, loving, supportive, and we cherish our relationship. We have lived together for about a year and a half and have built the most beautiful life together in a really beautiful place that feels like home. It has been one of the happiest times in my life. I haven’t ever felt so loved, so close to another human, and just so grateful to be in this life and to be this lucky. I have always suffered from mild anxiety and self esteem issues. … About a month ago, out of the blue, I started having extremely intrusive thoughts about ending our relationship. It causes me to feel the lowest I have ever felt in my life. I have breakdowns, panic attacks, and cannot function properly. It is truly consuming my life and making me feel depressed and hopeless. In my head I picture telling him that I don’t love him anymore (which hurts the most). I picture getting on a plane and leaving my whole life here with him…”.

From one of my replies to the OP (Oct 7, 2022): “... My understanding of what happened, based on your three posts: your childhood experience growing up, particularly your relationships with your parents/ immediate family, occasionally involved severe anxiety for you. Like children do, over time, you repressed as much as possible of that anxiety, pushing it down and away from your awareness. But because emotional repression cannot be done perfectly and there are cracks, some of the anxiety kept seeping through the cracks and to the surface, and therefore, you ‘have always suffered from mild anxiety’.

A month ago, the severe anxiety did not just seep through to the surface (in the form of mild anxiety), it erupted to the surface in its original form: severe anxiety…reads to me like you are still, presently, trying to make your immediate family happy and it is too much pressure for you… It is time for you to really leave your immediate family home behind  (something you’ve wanted to do for a long, long time, isn’t it?), to give up on your old goal in life (to make your immediate family happy), and to form a new, fresh goal…  seeing a medical doctor for possible psychiatric evaluation and medication is an option that may bring you that immediate relief… quality psychotherapy will be best. You may need an immediate relief option (medication and/ or regular, daily mindfulness practices) while attending therapy so that you can benefit from therapy…“.

In an Oct 18, 2020 reply to the same member, I wrote: “I re-read your posts and it seems to me, based on my personal experience with anxiety,  that the following may be the main source of your anxiety (with or without intrusive thoughts): ‘My mom… has so much unresolved trauma… My brother and I were always affected by this‘ – like I wrote to you before, young children absorb their mothers’ expressed childhood/ early life trauma like sponges, so her trauma becomes her children’s trauma by absorption. This is what happened in my case: my mother expressed her unresolved trauma in my presence many, many times and it affected me terribly, it was as if what happened to  her.. happened to me…“

Same OP started a 2nd thread Dec 2023 thread titled “Does this sound like ROCD or just anxiety? Need some insight/ advice please”. Original post: “…I get these horrible intrusive thoughts about my significant other. We have been together for 7 happy years and these thoughts make me feel depressed, angry, and confused. They always get triggered by some kind of small action that he makes. Things that should just pass by, feel like an explosion of emotions in my head and body. For example, we were leaving the store a couple days ago with just one item. As we finished checking out, he started to walk towards the exit without grabbing the one item, assuming I would grab it (which I did no problem. My hands were not full. It was a small item. I was 100% capable.) However, I immediately felt this overwhelming sensation with negative thoughts like ‘he doesn’t take care of you.’ ‘how can he be so rude to the person he is supposed to love’ ‘he is so inconsiderate’… These thoughts put me in panics. They make me question everything. Every move he makes, I try to analyze…”.

From my reply, Dec 15, 2023: “…– seems to me that when your significant other (I’ll refer to him as S) left the item for you to carry, your suppressed and repressed anger from your childhood erupted. The incident of S leaving the item for you to carry was a small incident, but your childhood pent up anger is HUGE, and your emotional reaction to the incident was proportional to the amount of your pushed-down anger at your parents for guilt tripping you and making their love for you conditional on you submitting to their guilt… it is very difficult for most (if not all) children and adult children to talk negatively about their parents, particularly when heavily guilt tripped as children, but it is necessary to do so when one’s parents’ behaviors were indeed significantly or severely negative, having created an emotional backlog of (understandable, valid) hurt, anger and fear inside you. Quality psychotherapy is the best place to do it, to talk and process these backlogged, pushed down intense feelings, so that their intensity lessens and lessens and you reach a place of peace within yourself.“

These are only a few of the many threads from the tiny buddha forums dealing with ROCD, many (including one currently on the first page of topics) that deal with ROCD, many not having the term in the title (so they don’t come up in the google search). It’s important to remember that not all people suffering from ROCD suffer from it in the exact same ways and intensity.

Also, OCD is an official diagnosis, ROCD is not an official diagnosis. ROCD refers to one of the themes of OCD (other common themes: “fear of contamination, fears about being responsible for harming the self or others” (Wikipedia). I was diagnosed myself with OCD, and my dominant theme was fears of harming others.<sup id=”cite_ref-pmid27148087_4-1″ class=”reference”></sup>

From Wikipedia/ ROCD: “People may continuously doubt whether they love their partner, whether their relationship is the ‘right’ relationship or whether their partner really loves them. <sup id=”cite_ref-DoronA_7-0″ class=”reference”></sup>When they know they love someone or that someone loves them, they constantly check and reassure themselves that it is the right feeling. When they attempt to end the relationship, they are overwhelmed with anxiety. By staying in the relationship, however, they are haunted by continuous doubts regarding the relationship.<sup id=”cite_ref-Doron_2014_169–180_3-2″ class=”reference”></sup>

“Another form of ROCD includes preoccupation, checking, and reassurance-seeking behaviors relating to the partner’s perceived flaws or deficits. These perceived deficits tend to be related to appearance, sociability, intelligence and morality and have been described using the term partner-focused OC symptoms. <sup id=”cite_ref-:1_8-0″ class=”reference”></sup>These symptoms tend to manifest as intrusive thoughts, images, and/or urges related to the relationship. There is often a great deal of distress associated with these symptoms, as they contradict one’s personal values and/or the subjective experience of the relationship. <sup id=”cite_ref-:1_8-1″ class=”reference”></sup>The individual views these symptoms as unacceptable and unwanted, invoking feelings of guilt and shame”.<sup id=”cite_ref-:1_8-2″ class=”reference”></sup>

I know that this is a long, comprehensive post. Please take your time with it.

I will add a shorter post in regard to applying the above to your personal story. Again, take your time with these, stop reading anytime you need a break, and continue at another time. No reason to rush.

anita

Dear Worldofthewaterwheels:

I just wanted to tell you, it’s okay if you don’t want to, or can’t type a post and submit it. It’s okay. I just wanted to let you know that you are not alone and rejected (“loneliness and rejection”) tonight, simply because someone is thinking about you and sending you this message.’

anita

Dear antarkala:

I’ll reply further in the morning, but for now, regarding thoughts like “something is missing” and “Am I settling for less?“, these could be obsessive thoughts, part of what is referred to as R-OCD (Relationship OCD). Are you familiar with the term?

anita

Dear Jessy:

You are very welcome.

“Just to be clear are you suggesting he is approaching again just for sexual curiosity now that he is more confident? (btw he did have a sexual experience with me)“- I wouldn’t know if he has been approaching you just for sexual curiosity, but it’s part of it, obviously (the sexual text he sent you). As far as his intents otherwise, I wish I knew. The person to get this information from is.. him. Honest, effective communication with him is the answer!

* Maybe there are clues to his intents in the light conversations he’s been engaging with you lately. I wonder if he shared with you how he is spending his time,  if he has friends, etc.

“also on the questions yes I’m thinking about maybe opening up a conversation again on messenger to get to know his chain of thoughts, life, etc.”– this would be excellent for the purpose of information gathering.

If you need my help with wording  questions for him, when you are ready to ask him questions, let me know.

anita

Dear Bell:

“the past 7 months together have been amazing.. But the past couple of months – or really this year as a whole – has been really hard for us as a couple, he has upset me quite a few times, and we have had more arguments than usual… And then I started to realise I had no interest in sex anymore… And then there it was, I was suddenly not sure about him and I anymore… and overall just didn’t feel in love like I used to“-

– there is a saying, what goes up, must come down. It’s true for all things subject to gravity. In this case, your emotions went up, and then down. It’s normal. Loving/ sexual feelings are not a matter of all or nothing. There are natural, normal changes. Key is not to panic when changes take place.

What happens when you panic is that fear stands in the way of the loving feelings coming back, so it’s a vicious cycle.

Here’s you panicking: “This feeling has been the worst guttural type of feeling I have ever felt before. I told him straight away and It just broke his heart. For a couple days I kept going from I want to be with him, I don’t want to be with him, I’ll be better without him, I will die without him, driving myself insane really… I’ve lost my appetite… I keep getting stuck with bad thoughts, almost intrusive thoughts“.

“I really need someone to tell me what to do… I do believe that I have both avoidant and anxious attachment styles from having an absent father in many ways, I hope that someone will see this and be able to give me some clarity and show me the right pathway”– I think that the right pathway for you is to do what any person panicking needs to do: to relax, to calm down. Only in a relaxed state of mind, can your thoughts be rational. Did you ever see a doctor or a counselor/ therapist in regard to your anxiety? And if you did, what were the results?

anita

Dear YOR:

You are welcome, I am well, thank you. I am glad that you feel safe here!

“About my stuff, I am in a different country in Europe… I am trying to arrange someone to collect my stuff from his apartment, I hope it works out“- your mental health is way more important than stuff. I hope that you do get your stuff back without negative consequences to you.

His expectation or demand that you pray 1- 3 hours every day.. to a god or entity that you don’t believe in is absurd!

“Later, he just became too cold, and oddly rigid over things he knows I cannot do. Like leaving my job, or letting him decide alone what and where I shall work… I tried to adjust as much as I can, but he would still show me angry eyes, you know.. the way someone looks in the eyes.. that gives an uncomfortable feeling“- controlling, angry and absurd!

“The last time we spoke. I was begging him to save our relationship by being a little open minded and he said he cannot promise future but can casually continue dating me. This was too disrespectful to me“- controlling, angry, absurd and disrespectful.

In your first post, you wrote about your ex-boyfriend: “he was super kind, super nice, just absolutely perfect in all ways. We moved in the same home, we were working in Europe at that time”– maybe, once in Europe, away from his family, local friends, etc., he took a break from his country/ his family and from his usual self, from the ways he behaved when in India, a temporary break.

“He has all friends from his nationality… I did not have much to talk to them, because they talked about some podcasts about some sort of witchcraft“- reads like radicalization: “the process by which an individual or a group comes to adopt increasingly radical views in opposition to a political, social, or religious status quo”, Wikipedia.

Maybe it’s both, to one extent or another. Maybe it’s mostly the latter,  some sort of a religious radicalization he went through recently, which changed him from the previously super-kind, super-nice, absolutely-perfect-in-all-ways person that he was.. (for a while) to the opposite: someone super-controlling, super-angry, super-rude, etc.

What do you think?

anita