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Telling the difference between gut and fear in relationships

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  • #432632
    seaturtle
    Participant

    A Journal Entry

    The past three days I have felt a shift in my energy. I feel sad and helpless. I can manage the feelings because I do see that they sweep over me like waves and eventually fall away. However, they are not fun.

    Last night I needed to journal before going to sleep in order to give my mind a rest. I journaled about how “sometimes I miss him while simultaneously knowing he is wrong for me.” I feel repetitive for saying this, but despite my best efforts to want to just let go completely, it seems it’s like a boomerang, just as I think it is the farthest it has ever been, it comes shooting back. I carry some guilt and wonder over having a conversation before breaking up saying “I need … from you or I need to leave the relationship.” I think this seed of thought was planted when he came over and said things like I gave up on him and that he lost himself for the second half of the relationship. But then, I recall having doubts about trusting him with my emotions earlier than halfway through. Him being late, when I told him it hurt my feelings, him forgetting about me and prioritizing so many things over our relationship while I was left to figure out why I felt like he was not present or very loving. His lack of self awareness made it almost impossible for him to take responsibility, that turned into so much gaslighting of my feelings and thoughts about the state of our relationship. I know leaving the relationship, in the state that it was in, was the right thing to do, and most respectful thing I could do for my self. But I fear that he will improve for someone else, and it was me who wasn’t worth it, that I didn’t do enough in the relationship. My desire is to just fully let go! And I feel like I have.. but then this boomerang came back to me the past 3 days or so.

    The shift in my energy lead to me looking up stages of a breakup/grief, and I wonder if this change in my energy is a temporary new stage I just got to..

    1. Denial – I feel like I sort of glossed over this one since I am the one that ended it.

    2. Shock – I went straight to shock after the breakup, and here did a lot of preventative work, reminding myself every moment of doubt why I did what I did and re-realizing it was the right thing, every time. I feel like I did this stage as healthy as I could.

    3. Anger – I did visit this stage. This was a more obvious stage as anger is an easy emotion for me to detect. This was a short stage though because it fueled my reasons why it was right to leave, so it was actually helpful.

    4- Bargaining – says online it is “imagining ways to have handled the situation differently.” I spent a lot of time here, perhaps one of the hardest stages because I have faced many things that I could have done better in the relationship. But here I reminded myself that I truly exhausted myself trying to mend the relationship, I know I did my best with the emotional resources I had.

    5- Depression and Sadness – When I read this this morning I immediately felt I fell into this category right now and the past 3 days. He has entered my dreams, the things I liked are all bubbling to the surface, the comfort the relationship brought physically and mentally, to have someone to have dinner with, always a Sunday morning friend. All of the good memories we had are playing games in my mind saying I will never have it that good again.. I am pretty sure this is a lie but I am afraid it is right and that my path won’t ever lead me to another partner… After all, who am I to think I deserve that from life? I am looking forward to the next stage to hold me through… but this stage is where I find myself wanting to be the most self destructive… these emotions are uncomfortable and I find myself wanting to escape them with alcohol, weed, tv, even contacting him.. this is the most tempted I have been and that is hard for me to even confess.. quick dopamine activities. But I always feel worse the next day after quick dopamine, but I am finding it hard to be inspired to do the things I usually love like running/yoga or talking with friends. Even when I bring myself to run, or I just tried tai chi (which I loved) on Saturday, the joy is temporary and in a matter of hours I am back to the sadness.

    6- Acceptance – “things will start to feel more positive”

    7- moving on, “true disengagement.”

    I am not sure what I need at the stage I am in right now, all I know is I don’t want to be here, but growing from it is giving me a drop of hope!

    Seaturtle

    #432633
    seaturtle
    Participant

    More on the Denial stage, I think I went through that stage before the relationship actually ended.

    Seaturtle

    #432634
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Helcat,

    I decided to read back the messages on this forum to remind myself of advice I may have forgotten. One of the first things you said to me on page one, october 6th was:

    I’m trying to think how I knew that I wanted to be with my husband.

    I would say that with him I felt loved and accepted for the first time in my life. I felt like I could share everything, not just the good parts of me. He accepted even the parts of me I don’t like about myself.

    This brought me some comfort to re-read because I did not feel this way in my relationship, and to know it is out there is what I think I need to hear right now. Even though I still find myself wondering if I will ever find it. In my relationship I felt I would be judged for certain things based on his previous reactions, so I did not let him see me completely relaxed and flawed. I want to be this way with someone some day and hope I am able to, and that the problem is not just me.

    Seaturtle

    #432640
    Helcat
    Participant

    Hi Seaturtle

    I’m sorry to hear that you are hurting going through the depression and sadness stage. Well done on all of your hard work going through most of the other stages already.

    It sounds like part of you is doubting yourself a bit.

    On the one hand, you know that you made the right decision and don’t believe some of the things your ex and your fears suggest. On the other, you are taking to heart the times when your ex blamed you. I don’t think what he said was true. You didn’t give up on him. He gave up long before you did. You tried really hard for a long time and kept asking for him to try too. He refused.

    One person can’t keep a relationship going. Both people need to try. No one is perfect in relationships but as long as both people try things can work out.

    It’s good that you also have good memories of the relationship, not just bad ones. It’s okay to miss those. You will always have the good memories. But the good didn’t outweigh the bad. It didn’t change the fact that you felt terribly unseen in the relationship and he simply wasn’t the right person for you. These things happen unfortunately when dating, it isn’t easy or pleasant. But it doesn’t mean that you did anything wrong. Quite the opposite, it was very mature of you to recognize when someone isn’t right for you. I honestly think you tried to handle it with compassion and gave him every chance to treat you the way you deserve to be treated.
    <p style=”text-align: left;”>You are a beautiful person inside and out, no doubt. I hope that the next person you date appreciates you fully. Realistically, it may take some time to find your person though. I’m glad that you found my old message comforting.</p>
    I think that ultimately, growing is learning to treat yourself with that love and respect too. What do you think you need right now?

    Thank you for your kind message in regards to communication with my partner. We are not perfect but we are trying. It may surprise you but I have been with my partner for a few years. It has only been this past year where he has begun to open up about his feelings. It is difficult for men, they are conditioned by society not to talk about things. Even more surprising perhaps might be that he used to be a therapist. Not my therapist, to be clear. But he was one a few years before he met me.

    I agree, it is reassuring just to hear that someone didn’t mean to hurt you.

    I’m glad to hear that you feel comfortable letting me know if you are ever hurt.

    You mentioned recently that you felt selfish about the decision to break up.

    I would suggest that when you are feeling calmer that you prove to yourself the ways that you aren’t a selfish person. Write down all of the good things that you do to help and care for others. Doing this on a regular basis is a good way to change internal beliefs about yourself that have been taught to you by other people.

    I hope that you feel better soon. Please be gentle with yourself and take extra special care of yourself when you are feeling down.

    Love and best wishes! ❤️🙏

    #432658
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Seaturtle:

    I feel (and I may be wrong) that this post may be the most useful/ potentially most helpful post that I ever submitted to you. Again, this is my feeling, it may not be your feeling. Please have patience with this (one more) long post. Some of it may be distressing for you to read. As always, read if you choose to read, at your chosen pace, allowing yourself to accept or reject.

    Your very first post, July 29, 2023 (I am adding the boldface feature):  “He is supportive, he encourages me to do what I LOVE.. He is truly a stand up man, he is so kind and deeply cares for those around him… But… all he ever says is… blah blah blah all these super un-original things… I don’t feel seen… N doesn’t really laugh at my jokes…I don’t think we are soulmates… is this all just me running away from the most genuine and loving/caring/kind/PATIENT/ would-do-anything-for-me man ?????????????? I really have been having this entire debate in my head for a straight 6-8 months now and I don’t want to waste my time, I want to move on or commit… I don’t want to make the wrong decision and make him the one that got away. I also don’t want to be ungrateful and expect that there’s something better out there for me, that feels like dangerous territory of having too high of standards that I’m single forever… I am exhausted with this decision and thought the answer would have come to me by now“.

    Oct 13, 2023: “My dad felt unseen and would internally accuse me of not seeing his pain and empathizing with him… My dad to this day still very often misinterprets what I do and who I am and it hurts every time, he thinks I am selfish and is probably why I have fears of being selfish or narcissistic. It is scary when someone tells you that you are coming across a certain way that is unbeknownst to you, it makes me self conscious about how I do come across, which if I let myself overthink this I become awkward in social situations…  I find myself wanting to criticize my partner for similar things my dad criticized me for, like ‘not seeing me.’ A mentality like, if I have to be hyper aware of what I am doing, like responding to messages, cleaning up after myself hyper-vigilantly, making sure YOU are seen, then why shouldn’t you have to be too.. Like he will leave a mess at my apartment, something I would be way too self conscious to do at his house and I have to actively stop myself from resenting that he feels the freedom to do those things and I cannot live with it. As if I wish he had the same anxieties as me… I just wish he could at least empathize my internal torment“.

    Oct 16, 2023: “He feels he is always consoling me and sometimes does not have the patience to do so… So far the only things that makes me feel better are talking about it and feeling he understands why it bothers me, otherwise I also get an impulse to pull away… it has ruined dates before, where I feel unsettled/triggered the whole time and struggle to move on, and become irritated how quickly he moves on… I feel I am falling out of love with him because of how worn out I feel from being triggered at a faster rate than I can heal… so much of our relationship in the last year has been about me and my triggers… we rarely go a whole day without him triggering me in some way… I recently find myself breaking up with him in my head and how I would explain myself, but I do not want to lose him”.

    May 13, 2024 (you are the one adding the boldface feature here): “Despite my best efforts to want to just let go completely, it seems it’s like a boomerang, just as I think it is the farthest it has ever been, it comes shooting back… I fear that he will improve for someone else, and it was me who wasn’t worth it, that I didn’t do enough in the relationship. My desire is to just fully let go! And I feel like I have.. but then this boomerang came back to me the past 3 days or so… I am afraid it is right and that my path won’t ever lead me to another partner… these emotions are uncomfortable and I find myself wanting to escape them with alcohol, weed, tv, even contacting him”.
    <p id=”mntl-sc-block_1-0″ class=”comp mntl-sc-block mntl-sc-block-html”>Very well health. com: “Relationship OCD (ROCD) is a form of obsessive-compulsive disorder that involves obsessions, preoccupations, doubts, and compulsive behaviors related to a relationship with another person… This article focuses on ROCD in romantic relationships, exploring the causes, symptoms, and ways of managing ROCD.</p>
    “Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD) is a mental health disorder characterized by intrusive and distressing thoughts, impulses (obsessions), and repetitive behaviors (compulsions). ROCD is a form of OCD that is explicitly focused on relationships.

    “Having some degree of worry or doubt in a relationship is typical. Still, for people with relationship OCD, these preoccupations significantly disrupt the relationship and the person’s ability to function as an individual. They constantly analyze themselves, their partner, or their relationship, obsessing over even minor perceived flaws…

    “Obsessive symptoms in ROCD can include: * Extreme fear of making the wrong relationship-related decision (alternating between anxiety over the thought of leaving the relationship and anxiety over being ‘trapped’ in the wrong relationship) * Overwhelming doubts and fears relating to how they feel toward their partner, how they believe their partner feels about them, and whether or not the relationship is ‘right’. * Hyper-focusing on perceived flaws they see in their partner * Fear that they aren’t ‘good enough’ for their partner *…
    <p id=”mntl-sc-block_44-0″ class=”comp mntl-sc-block mntl-sc-block-html”>”People with ROCD may perceive innocuous thoughts and behaviors as ‘signs’ that they don’t really love their partner or that their relationship isn’t viable. These can include:*  Not thinking about their partner all day long * Not completely enjoying a kiss or act of intimacy * Noticing that another person is attractive * Enjoying having time to themselves on occasion * Not always being in the mood for sexual intimacy…</p>
    <p class=”comp mntl-sc-block mntl-sc-block-html”>“Compulsive Behaviors: People with ROCD engage in compulsive behaviors in an attempt to relieve the anxiety caused by their obsessions. Compulsive behaviors common in ROCD include: * Monitoring/checking their feelings * Comparing, such as comparing their partner’s attributes to other potential partners or comparing their relationship to those around them, past relationships, relationships on TV, etc. * Neutralizing, such as picturing themselves and their partner happy together or trying to recall good experiences with their partner * Reassurance-seeking about their partner or relationship by consulting with friends, family, therapists, or even psychic… * Being constantly on a quest for ‘perfect’ love * Creating rules for their partner and questioning the relationship if their partner does not uphold them… Compulsive behaviors may provide temporary relief from obsessive thoughts, but the obsessions always return.</p>
    “The age of onset of ROCD is not known. Still, clinical evidence has shown symptoms often begin to present in early adulthood or when a person is first faced with commitment-related romantic decisions… ROCD symptoms often persist from one relationship to another and can occur when a person is not actively in a relationship (such as having obsessions about past or future relationships)…

    Summary: ROCD is a form of obsessive-compulsive disorder in which a person experiences obsessions and compulsions related to their relationships. It can involve symptoms such as constantly questioning if they really want to be with their partner, being hyper-focused on perceived flaws they see in their partner, and seeking reassurance or proof that their relationship is “right.” ROCD can cause distress to the individual experiencing it and strain their relationship. ROCD is typically treated with therapy, particularly CBT or ERP, but medication may be prescribed if necessary to help with symptom relief.”

    I suggested ROCD to you before, but you didn’t consider it back then. Today, I am amazed by how fitting the description of ROCD is with what you shared throughout your many posts (many, many more and longer than what I quoted above), the fit is huge. Psychotherapy that aims to treat ROCD can be a huge help for you.

    Notice this quote from very well health: “ROCD symptoms often persist from one relationship to another and can occur when a person is not actively in a relationship (such as having obsessions about past or future relationships)“- you are not actively in a relationship with N- at least not when you posted last- but ROCD symptoms persist in regard to N while not in a relationship with him. In a future relationship with a different man, symptoms are likely to persist. The way I see it: no man can be perfect enough to make you feel seen and content when it is still your father’s unseeing and disapproving eyes that you see.

    Fear is a very powerful emotion, a very powerful energy in-motion. I no longer have these dreams, but I used to: my mother looking at me, saying nothing, just staring at me with undeniable disapproval and condemnation. That’s all. Interpreting this dream using chakra language: her staring at me with condemnation blinded my third eye, created an earthquake in my crown chakra and hit my heart chakra with a dagger, making me bleed to (almost) death.

    Remember you shared that you were watched like a hawk, and I responded with: you were watched, but you were not seen? This is true to my experience and my dream above: she watched me; she didn’t see me. If she saw me, she would have approved of me, which would have made it possible for her to love me (for how can you love someone you disapprove of?)

    A parent’s disapproving/ condemning look hits a child’s heart like a dagger, an emotional dagger. I don’t have that dream anymore, but when I notice someone sigh, I automatically think it’s a disapproving (of me) sigh. When  I notice an unhappy look, I still think it’s a disapproving look. I still see her in other people. (And so, I don’t really see other people when I see her in them).

    You are not a beginner, Seaturtle, you have insight (3rd eye) and a lot more. I learn from you. And/ but.. when a parent’s legacy is a condemning look/ message, it is very difficult to recover from.

    anita

    #432659
    anita
    Participant

    Re-submitted:

    Dear Seaturtle:

    I feel (and I may be wrong) that this post may be the most useful/ potentially most helpful post that I ever submitted to you. Again, this is my feeling, it may not be your feeling. Please have patience with this (one more) long post. Some of it may be distressing for you to read. As always, read if you choose to read, at your chosen pace, allowing yourself to accept or reject.

    Your very first post, July 29, 2023 (I am adding the boldface feature):  “He is supportive, he encourages me to do what I LOVE.. He is truly a stand up man, he is so kind and deeply cares for those around him… But… all he ever says is… blah blah blah all these super un-original things… I don’t feel seen… N doesn’t really laugh at my jokes…I don’t think we are soulmates… is this all just me running away from the most genuine and loving/caring/kind/PATIENT/ would-do-anything-for-me man ?????????????? I really have been having this entire debate in my head for a straight 6-8 months now and I don’t want to waste my time, I want to move on or commit… I don’t want to make the wrong decision and make him the one that got away. I also don’t want to be ungrateful and expect that there’s something better out there for me, that feels like dangerous territory of having too high of standards that I’m single forever… I am exhausted with this decision and thought the answer would have come to me by now“.

    Oct 13, 2023: “My dad felt unseen and would internally accuse me of not seeing his pain and empathizing with him… My dad to this day still very often misinterprets what I do and who I am and it hurts every time, he thinks I am selfish and is probably why I have fears of being selfish or narcissistic. It is scary when someone tells you that you are coming across a certain way that is unbeknownst to you, it makes me self conscious about how I do come across, which if I let myself overthink this I become awkward in social situations…  I find myself wanting to criticize my partner for similar things my dad criticized me for, like ‘not seeing me.’ A mentality like, if I have to be hyper aware of what I am doing, like responding to messages, cleaning up after myself hyper-vigilantly, making sure YOU are seen, then why shouldn’t you have to be too.. Like he will leave a mess at my apartment, something I would be way too self conscious to do at his house and I have to actively stop myself from resenting that he feels the freedom to do those things and I cannot live with it. As if I wish he had the same anxieties as me… I just wish he could at least empathize my internal torment“.

    Oct 16, 2023: “He feels he is always consoling me and sometimes does not have the patience to do so… So far the only things that makes me feel better are talking about it and feeling he understands why it bothers me, otherwise I also get an impulse to pull away… it has ruined dates before, where I feel unsettled/triggered the whole time and struggle to move on, and become irritated how quickly he moves on… I feel I am falling out of love with him because of how worn out I feel from being triggered at a faster rate than I can heal… so much of our relationship in the last year has been about me and my triggers… we rarely go a whole day without him triggering me in some way… I recently find myself breaking up with him in my head and how I would explain myself, but I do not want to lose him”.

    May 13, 2024 (you are the one adding the boldface feature here): “Despite my best efforts to want to just let go completely, it seems it’s like a boomerang, just as I think it is the farthest it has ever been, it comes shooting back… I fear that he will improve for someone else, and it was me who wasn’t worth it, that I didn’t do enough in the relationship. My desire is to just fully let go! And I feel like I have.. but then this boomerang came back to me the past 3 days or so… I am afraid it is right and that my path won’t ever lead me to another partner… these emotions are uncomfortable and I find myself wanting to escape them with alcohol, weed, tv, even contacting him”.

    Very well health. com: “Relationship OCD (ROCD) is a form of obsessive-compulsive disorder that involves obsessions, preoccupations, doubts, and compulsive behaviors related to a relationship with another person… This article focuses on ROCD in romantic relationships, exploring the causes, symptoms, and ways of managing ROCD.

    “Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD) is a mental health disorder characterized by intrusive and distressing thoughts, impulses (obsessions), and repetitive behaviors (compulsions). ROCD is a form of OCD that is explicitly focused on relationships.

    “Having some degree of worry or doubt in a relationship is typical. Still, for people with relationship OCD, these preoccupations significantly disrupt the relationship and the person’s ability to function as an individual. They constantly analyze themselves, their partner, or their relationship, obsessing over even minor perceived flaws…

    “Obsessive symptoms in ROCD can include: * Extreme fear of making the wrong relationship-related decision (alternating between anxiety over the thought of leaving the relationship and anxiety over being ‘trapped’ in the wrong relationship) * Overwhelming doubts and fears relating to how they feel toward their partner, how they believe their partner feels about them, and whether or not the relationship is ‘right’. * Hyper-focusing on perceived flaws they see in their partner * Fear that they aren’t ‘good enough’ for their partner …

    ”People with ROCD may perceive innocuous thoughts and behaviors as ‘signs’ that they don’t really love their partner or that their relationship isn’t viable. These can include:*  Not thinking about their partner all day long * Not completely enjoying a kiss or act of intimacy * Noticing that another person is attractive * Enjoying having time to themselves on occasion * Not always being in the mood for sexual intimacy…

    “Compulsive Behaviors: People with ROCD engage in compulsive behaviors in an attempt to relieve the anxiety caused by their obsessions. Compulsive behaviors common in ROCD include: * Monitoring/checking their feelings * Comparing, such as comparing their partner’s attributes to other potential partners or comparing their relationship to those around them, past relationships, relationships on TV, etc. * Neutralizing, such as picturing themselves and their partner happy together or trying to recall good experiences with their partner * Reassurance-seeking about their partner or relationship by consulting with friends, family, therapists, or even psychic… * Being constantly on a quest for ‘perfect’ love * Creating rules for their partner and questioning the relationship if their partner does not uphold them… Compulsive behaviors may provide temporary relief from obsessive thoughts, but the obsessions always return.

    “The age of onset of ROCD is not known. Still, clinical evidence has shown symptoms often begin to present in early adulthood or when a person is first faced with commitment-related romantic decisions… ROCD symptoms often persist from one relationship to another and can occur when a person is not actively in a relationship (such as having obsessions about past or future relationships)…

    “Summary: ROCD is a form of obsessive-compulsive disorder in which a person experiences obsessions and compulsions related to their relationships. It can involve symptoms such as constantly questioning if they really want to be with their partner, being hyper-focused on perceived flaws they see in their partner, and seeking reassurance or proof that their relationship is “right.” ROCD can cause distress to the individual experiencing it and strain their relationship. ROCD is typically treated with therapy, particularly CBT or ERP, but medication may be prescribed if necessary to help with symptom relief.”

    I suggested ROCD to you before, but you didn’t consider it back then. Today, I am amazed by how fitting the description of ROCD is with what you shared throughout your many posts (many, many more and longer than what I quoted above), the fit is huge. Psychotherapy that aims to treat ROCD can be a huge help for you.

    Notice this quote from very well health: “ROCD symptoms often persist from one relationship to another and can occur when a person is not actively in a relationship (such as having obsessions about past or future relationships)“- you are not actively in a relationship with N- at least not when you posted last- but ROCD symptoms persist in regard to N while not in a relationship with him. In a future relationship with a different man, symptoms are likely to persist. The way I see it: no man can be perfect enough to make you feel seen and content when it is still your father’s unseeing and disapproving eyes that you see.

    Fear is a very powerful emotion, a very powerful energy in-motion. I no longer have these dreams, but I used to: my mother looking at me, saying nothing, just staring at me with undeniable disapproval and condemnation. That’s all. Interpreting this dream using chakra language: her staring at me with condemnation blinded my third eye, created an earthquake in my crown chakra and hit my heart chakra with a dagger, making me bleed to (almost) death.

    Remember you shared that you were watched like a hawk, and I responded with: you were watched, but you were not seen? This is true to my experience and my dream above: she watched me; she didn’t see me. If she saw me, she would have approved of me, which would have made it possible for her to love me (for how can you love someone you disapprove of?)

    A parent’s disapproving/ condemning look hits a child’s heart like a dagger, an emotional dagger. I don’t have that dream anymore, but when I notice someone sigh, I automatically think it’s a disapproving (of me) sigh. When  I notice an unhappy look, I still think it’s a disapproving look. I still see her in other people. (And so, I don’t really see other people when I see her in them).

    You are not a beginner, Seaturtle, you have insight (3rd eye) and a lot more. I learn from you. And/ but.. when a parent’s legacy is a condemning look/ message, it is very difficult to recover from.

    anita

    #433262
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Helcat,

    Thank you for the support 🙂

    Seaturtle

    #433264
    Helcat
    Participant

    Hi Seaturtle

    You’re welcome, you deserve support! ❤️

    Nice to see you around. How are you doing? 😊

    Love and best wishes! ❤️🙏

    #433269
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    As I thank Helcat for support, I don’t want you to take that as me saying the opposite to you. I also appreciate your support.

    I haven’t come to the forum out of just my own energy detouring me.

    I can see where I show symptoms of ROCD. When you first brought it up I looked into it, and some of it resonated but overall it didn’t feel like the correct diagnosis. Just as someone who parties for one weekend and drinking excess, shows many symptoms of an alcoholic, but is not necessarily one.

    I analyze all the relationships in my life, extensively. Out of wonder of why they aren’t understanding what I am saying. I am realizing lately how true something you once said, is. You said speaking to someone with a closed third eye, challenges your own. On top of that, recently I started Tai Chi and Qigong, and the teacher that I met with has taken me under her wing in a way, helping me attend despite financial challenges, helping me raise money. I bring this up to show her belief in me and that she sees me. After lots of talking with her about my life, she asked me “do you find that you are many peoples first to the spiritual side of things?” This pierced me very deeply, because yes I am. I grew up surrounded, and am now realizing am currently still surrounded by people with closed third eyes, they do not see beyond very basic needs/ perspectives. My friend P thinks Anxiety/ADHD runs her life, says it controls her and when I tell her that she is not her mind, she takes it as an insult.. Just as N could not take responsibility and claimed stuck in Survival mode of maslows pyramid. And just like my roommate, who doesn’t believe that physical ailments can be undone through extensive meditation and energy healing. Also clearly both of my parents.

    I have been around so many people who have challenged my third eye, they literally try to pull me out of my intuition. Bringing closed third eye attributes to try and bring me to their level. Some of these attributes being constant skepticism, and lead by their ego that their issues are not actually their own, or that they don’t have issues at all.

    If I have OCD about anything, it is the fact I want to be as self aware as possible. I fear a lack of it. I also doubt my ability to be self aware so I open up to people who might help me see clearer. I didn’t OCD the Relationship until my intuition started to tell me to leave. I had “OCD” about whether my intuition was right or not, and the relationship was the topic in the spotlight. When you have a parent who treats you with a lack of honesty and respect, you think it is only normal when your love partner treats you the same. So part of my relationship felt normal and comfortable, but that quiet intuition was trying to tell me something I had absolutely no proof of; that I didn’t deserve to be treated that way. This lack of proof, and very quiet voice, drove me to hyper fixate on it, and that turned in to hyper fixating on the relationship. The end of that relationship was my first experience hearing that voice, labeling it intuition and taking a leap of faith. I am working to strengthen this intuition but I am still novice and doubt it, aka doubt it telling me to leave the relationship. I fear it meant to just take a break and I was impulsive to end it. Or that maybe that is all I deserved.

    A breakup is deserving of a lot of feelings/ stages. The Sadness/Depression of a lost friend, and the death of an envisioned future, is where I am right now. When I was trying to make the relationship work, I was reminding myself daily of his good qualities that I could hold onto, and the fact is I miss those, and I lost those. I don’t think it is out of the norm of a breakup, aka deserving of a ROCD diagnosis, that I am feeling those things. I get stuck in them sometimes when I am sad/depressed energy. And that is why I came here that day was to look for some help to pull me out, and that potential diagnosis only made me feel worse.

    Seaturtle

    #433278
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Seaturtle:

    “I am realizing lately how true something you once said, is. You said speaking to someone with a closed third eye, challenges your own… I… am currently still surrounded by people with closed third eyes… My friend P… my roommate.. clearly both of my parents. I have been around so many people who have challenged my third eye, they literally try to pull me out of my intuition… (to) bring me to their level… I don’t think it is out of the norm of a breakup, aka deserving of an ROCD diagnosis, that I am feeling those things. I get stuck in them sometimes when I am sad/depressed energy. And that is why I came here that day was to look for some help to pull me out, and that potential diagnosis only made me feel worse.”

    – When I submitted to you my May 14 post, I was excited: I thought/ hoped that my input will motivate you to seek quality psychotherapy (financed by your very rich father. Personally, I can’t see a better use for a very small portion of his money). Having read your post today, 15 days later, I can see that my intended help only made you feel worse.

    It seems like I joined the crowd of closed 3rd-eyed people trying (unintentionally, in my case, at least) to pull you out of your intuition..?

    I am sorry, Seaturtle, that my May 14 post made you feel worse. I feel sad that it did, really sad.

    Recently, I started Tai Chi and Qigong, and the teacher that I met with has taken me under her wing in a way, helping me attend despite financial challenges, helping me raise money. I bring this up to show her belief in me and that she sees me“- congratulations for starting Tai Chi and Qigong. May the teacher’s 3rd eye remain open and pull you out and away from your sad/ depressed energy and toward your intuition.

    May the chapter of “Telling the difference between gut and fear in relationships” come to an end.

    anita

    #433335
    Helcat
    Participant

    Hi Seaturtle

    I’m glad that you expressed yourself and shared your feelings. I’m sorry that you feel hurt. ❤️

    It’s not possible to diagnose someone over the internet by text even for a trained clinical psychologist. I hope that provides a measure of comfort. I’m sure that Anita didn’t mean to hurt you, though I do understand why you were.

    You are a beautiful soul and your mind and your experiences don’t define you. That’s an incredible realisation at such a young age. I’m sorry your friend didn’t understand it and saw it as an insult. I know that you weren’t trying to hurt her. It can be hard when people feel overwhelmed by their thoughts and feelings and learn to identify with them.

    I’m glad to hear that you are practicing Tai Chi and Qi Gong, also that the teacher has taken you under their wing. I found Qi Gong very helpful myself. I hope that you enjoy the beautiful journey that you’re on!

    Love and best wishes! ❤️🙏

     

    #433366
    anita
    Participant

    I am thinking about you, Seaturtle, hoping that you are okay, and wishing you peace of mind, and love in your heart.

    anita

    #433381
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Seaturtle:

    “But what do you love about… me specifically apart from othersI don’t feel seen… I am not sure he sees what makes me specialI often rely on others to see myself… About soulmates, I think this feeling of them turning on a light in a dark room so that I can see myself… My craving to be seen is very intense… I am alone in a dark room… I analyze all the relationships in my life, extensively. Out of wonder of why they aren’t understanding what I am saying…I grew up surrounded, and am now realizing am currently still surrounded by people with closed third eyes, they do not see beyond very basic needs/ perspectives. My friend P… Just as N… And just like my roommate… I have been around so many people who have challenged my third eye… If I have OCD about anything, it is the fact I want to be as self aware as possible. I fear a lack of it. I also doubt my ability to be self aware so I open up to people who might help me see” (July 29, 2023- May 29, 2024)

    I read that sometime during the 2nd year of life, a child (boy or girl), for the first time in her life, recognizes herself in the mirror, and that is the beginning of self-awareness: that’s me in the mirror! (Apart from others!)

    Your self-awareness started a long time ago (you do recognize yourself in the mirror). But when your father demanded that you see him, he significantly disrupted the further and farther development of your self-awareness, and you found yourself in the dark, craving light, and depending on friends, boyfriends, others, to turn on the light for you,  so that you can see you.

    It didn’t work, I believe, because it takes a qualified psychotherapist, within a professional therapeutic context, to help a person whose mental- emotional development was significantly disrupted in childhood (to help long-term, that is, beyond feeling better for just a sort while).

    My mental- emotional development, as far as self-awareness (and others-awareness), was severely disrupted in childhood, causing me lots of mental suffering and dependence on.. strangers to help me, strangers who failed me. I was indeed in the dark, aimless, long-term direction, and often, not even a short-term direction; time and resources diffused and wasted. My first quality psychotherapist of 2011-13 was not perfect, but the best I ever had. It started me turning the light on, again and again, and overall, there’s been a significant, long-term Luminance Enhancement in my life (LE, just felt like coming up with an acronym, so I did just because I felt like it, lol).

    anita

     

    #433619
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Anita!

    I miss you!

    “– When I submitted to you my May 14 post, I was excited: I thought/ hoped that my input will motivate you to seek quality psychotherapy (financed by your very rich father. Personally, I can’t see a better use for a very small portion of his money). Having read your post today, 15 days later, I can see that my intended help only made you feel worse.”

    – I am currently very interested in CBT, I know I have some generational trauma that my parents passed down to me in times of low consciousness. Instead of ignore them and let life happen to me I want to use life to become aware of my shadows and overcome them. Currently, and recently I have been made aware of these shadows, aka false selves, and they are overwhelming when stacked together. I feel like CBT will help me but I am struggling to find a therapist. I am afraid someone will lead me astray and in my vulnerability I will be so impressionable..

    “I am sorry, Seaturtle, that my May 14 post made you feel worse. I feel sad that it did, really sad.”

    – I really appreciate this (heart emoji). I know your intentions were not to make me feel badly, and I appreciate you being honest about your thoughts. Like you said humans are so complex so I know that someone else’s diagnosis of me can only be so accurate because you are not directly in my shoes. I see how you came to your conclusion I just felt at such a low energy that I didn’t have it in me to fuel my defensiveness, or too think too much about it, at the time.

    “May the teacher’s 3rd eye remain open and pull you out and away from your sad/ depressed energy and toward your intuition.”

    – I have found a lot of healing energy inside the entire organization. It is called Brain and Body yoga, and the teachings and exercises/movements have really helped me uncover some joy inside of me that I lost. There is so much laughter there and everyone seems to be very in tuned with their child like spirits, and I miss that about myself. I lost that little girl for a while because, as you know, I had to quiet her to stay in that relationship.

    “May the chapter of “Telling the difference between gut and fear in relationships” come to an end.”

    – This is my overall journey. However I have hit a major checkpoint within the last week. I have heard and seen N in the last week, he gave my things back, although much thrown away. I witnessed myself again let my ego take over and try to explain myself to the closed third eye. Although I felt my heart was very sad that night when I got home, something was happening inside of me. Instead of ignore my heart, I did what I had just learned from a book and tried to instead appreciate the low frequency harmony/music, my heart was playing. I heard it as a violin. When I would be tempted to go to my mind and make up images and stories to make myself feel better I would eventually pull myself back to my heart and just let myself hear it. It was very sad and hard for me to sleep but then the next day I spent nearly the whole day at the Brain and Body yoga center, they asked me to help them with videos for their new website and I was so honored they wanted me on their page! It will be up in a couple months and I will let you know where 😉 Being there completely raised my vibrations and last night, for the first time I realized that I would never go back to N. Something that may seem like I should have realized earlier but I really still had a small sliver of hope I didn’t know how to release. Last night I deleted our photo album, and then I had a great sleep and woke up better than I went to sleep. I felt so proud of myself, I woke up in a high state! I felt this overwhelming trust for my sleeping self haha. Today I am throwing away memorabilia from our relationship, things that sliver of me was saving just in case I wanted the memories later on. I feel a sense of closure, I finally know I never have to see him again, not for my things and certainly never to try and explain myself to him ever again. A book is closing, a stick is breaking and I feel free.

    I hope this is not a fleeting sensation, I hope I am strong enough not to give attention to the things he said about me. I have always had this overwhelming feeling to be better, and sometimes that feeds in to caring what others think of me because I wonder, maybe they see something in me that I don’t. My teacher at Brain and Body is helping me to overcome this but I have not fully grasped this concept yet.

     

    “I am thinking about you, Seaturtle, hoping that you are okay, and wishing you peace of mind, and love in your heart.”

    – 💜

    June 2nd post:

    I read that sometime during the 2nd year of life, a child (boy or girl), for the first time in her life, recognizes herself in the mirror, and that is the beginning of self-awareness: that’s me in the mirror! (Apart from others!)”

    – what do you mean by “2nd year of life.”

    “My mental- emotional development, as far as self-awareness (and others-awareness), was severely disrupted in childhood, causing me lots of mental suffering and dependence on.. strangers to help me, strangers who failed me.”

    “dependence on strangers” – that sentence hit me deeply. Isn’t it so fickle and painful to do!? That feeling of not being seen my strangers is so hurtful but so likely. I do know I have gotten better with this, if strangers don’t see me I am not not bothered. But I am still bothered when it is someone that is closer to me than a stranger. I wonder how much I should expect people near me often, to see me?

    Seaturtle

    #433620
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Helcat 🙂

    I Appreciate you so much and your validating comments. I’ve had both my own dad and now an ex boyfriend pretty much say “you think you’re special??” I am working my hardest to get to a place where I am able to be unbothered by these comments. But I do think hearing the opposite by people I respect, like you, helps me rebuild my self esteem. 🧡

    ” I found Qi Gong very helpful myself. I hope that you enjoy the beautiful journey that you’re on!”

    – I am so happy that I found myself to it as well, I love the practice and the type of people that are drawn to it. I feel like I have found a very safe space for myself. I am remembering to enjoy it more and more often 🙂

    Seaturtle

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