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Struggling with my decision

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  • #231445
    jenna
    Participant

    I have dated my boyfriend for 3 years. As usual, things started out great for the first year or so. Then, things in his personal life started falling apart about a year in, and my health started to significantly decline. All these factors were incredible stress on ourselves and each other.

    Also, I went into this relationship being super insecure and feeling inadequate because I have unresolved self-worth issues from childhood. This guy comes from an upper middle class family, and I lived poverty level my entire life, and still do. So I have never felt good enough for him and his family. He would try to reassure me, but things would always come out about me that he didn’t approve of. At first, it was that I was too negative, and that I wouldn’t let him properly vent about things when he needed it from me. Then, he was bothered that I didn’t have a hand in planning things in our relationship, like little trips or just having any ideas for dates, places to eat, etc. Then, it was that I didn’t drive us around enough and he was bothered that he was the default driver and was tired from driving to work everyday when I had no job. He was also bothered that when my car broke down, I wouldn’t take his suggestion of a car he picked out after months of looking. He said I was ungrateful for rejecting his help. When I spent too much and stressed about concert tickets for us, he snapped at me and told me I have to make everything such a “f*cking big deal” and that I shouldn’t have spent all that money on the tickets (even though it was my money and I didn’t want him to pay me back for his). He was frustrated that I wasn’t budgeting my money because he said my money issues affected him considering I was having trouble getting a car. All of these little instances were monthly occurrences after that first year. It seemed like every few weeks, he was frustrated by the way I handled a decision, or whatever else. I also have to add that we agree on everything, and have every interest in the world in common aside from political beliefs, which really hurts me. His family and him are very conservative in thinking and are pretty critical on others, while I am very open minded and just want peace. Every time we’d disagree, we’d get into a fight and he would never let me have my opinion. We are both sensitive and passionate people and we’d just get SO offended that we both weren’t in the same boat all of a sudden. I’ve tried to tell him we just can’t talk about that stuff, but it still comes back up between him and his mom in front of me, which feels offensive and intentional. All the while, he wants me to not bring up my sister to him that he doesn’t like.

    At the same time – he adored me and cooked me breakfast, opened car doors for me, made me hot chocolate just randomly, always let me choose what we watched on tv, hugged me when I was upset about my health issues, tried his best to help me overall with my issues, and made and bought me the most personalized and thoughtful presents. After three years in, him and my sister got into the nastiest fight in human history over some really awful stuff. My sister is also my best friend. I was very hurt and offended by both of them. It is incredibly important for him to accept my family as I already feel inadequate to him and his family (and I have to do things with HIS family constantly). I understand them not being able to make amends, but it still really affected me. He doesn’t understand why I am letting family issues get in between me and him. But me and him are VERY family involved people.

    My main fear is this: that I have essentially self-sabotaged most of this relationship and every time he came to me with a critique, I was overreacting because I’m already insecure about the issues (my lack of independence, financial issues because of my health, my health and mental issues in general). And that I have projected my own insecurities onto him and have morphed his thinking into convincing him that all these issues I am already very self aware and responsible over are issues to him.

    Also, I’m feeling guilty that I am letting family issues get in between us and my own insecurities, bitterness, and jealousy over his family. I feel like a very immature person. We are currently on a 3 month break but I know I am going to have to make a decision soon. I am in counseling trying to work on my health and he said he needed to work on himself too but…it’s just rough.

    #231497
    Inky
    Participant

    Hi jenna,

    The socio-economic class difference aside, after three years in… ANY couple would run into stressors.

    Three years in, most people are dancing around the idea of “marriage” and “forever”… even if they never verbally express it. It is possible that he is freaking out. He might want relief from this inner (and unspoken outer, even if imaginary) pressure and start picking fights about anything.

    It’s good you are on a break. I think he is unconsciously self-sabotaging himself in the relationship.

    Hang in There!

    Inky

    #231501
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear jenna:

    Will you tell me more about the fight between him and your sister: what was it about, who  started it, what was your participation in it and what is the status now?

    I have thoughts about your post but what I am asking about will make my thinking more concrete, I believe.

    anita

    #231613
    jenna
    Participant

    Hi, inky!

    Me and him are pretty non-traditional and have discussed not wanting to get married. Neither one of us feels it’s something we need. But at one point, he did talk about moving towns and asked if I would come along and officially live with him. At the time, I was open to the idea, but at this point that kind of commitment scares me. I am very intrigued by your perspective of saying HE may be self-sabotaging things because he’s stressed out. I have always thought it was just me ruining everything, and he himself and my counselor have said that I am at fault for that.

    Anita, the fight between him and my sister was ridiculous and I don’t know how to condense it to make it make sense. One afternoon, I was supposed to be home to meet my mom and sister and I fell way behind because of some random issues with running into someone outside his apartment. 2 hours passed and my mom and sister decided to just drive over to see if I was okay and where I was. They couldn’t find me, and called my boyfriend to get permission from the apartment office to look in the apartment to see if I had fainted or something considering my health issues. So she got the okay from my boyfriend and she went into the apartment with the manager of the apartments. She couldn’t find me and freaked out because my phone was still in the apartment along with my purse, which made no sense. My mom started freaking out and insisted my sister go back in and check with my 12 year old niece, and by this time – my boyfriend’s super stuck up and judgmental mom drove up. They finally found me as I was around the back of the apartments. Then after things settled and my boyfriend made it back that evening after I left, he sent me a very long heated message telling me that my sister had violated his privacy and that he was not going to stand for it, and that something from under his bed had been moved out (my 12 year old niece did this), and that his mom had called him and told him my sister wore her shoes in his apartment (they are against people wearing shoes in homes), and that she had left all the lights on. Okay, I turned off the lights when they found me so the lights were on maybe a max of 30 minutes. But I tried to defend my sister and he wouldn’t have it. I respected him feeling violated but he was LIVID. He said this was just what my sister would do because he hates her. He hates that she’s on welfare and food stamps, thinks she’s lazy and entitled to handouts, and has a sassy mouth. Also, he said my hystericalness (as with my paranoias and health stuff) must run in my family because of how much my family overreacted that day. That night my sister sent him a horrible message with a screenshot of a newspaper article showing his arrest back about 2 months prior to hitting someone. (He hid this from me, by the way). She told him that he had some room to talk and that his a** should be in jail. Okay, my boyfriend has been through a ton of legal and court drama his entire life because of his grandparents who abused him and his family and always got him accused and arrested. Also, he had an alcoholic ex who got him arrested one night too. And when his first business went under, several of his clients tried to sue him. So he’s VERY sensitive to being accused and he has talked about it in therapy but my sister will never understand the amount of pain she caused him by saying that to him. Me and him fought for weeks over this, and when he had an upcoming court date about his arrest from hitting that person, I attempted to storm out of the apartment because he brought up my sister again in a cussing fit about her after we had made amends and I had asked him to please never bring up my family again. He was so offended that in his moment of need, I took up for my sister yet again. But I try to tell him that what she did hurt me too because I begged her not to send that message. I feel like I can’t win. If I choose him, I betray her and my family. If I choose her, I feel like I’m just doing it to appease her and I betray him. I’m incredibly close to my family but I feel like I’m beginning to see my sister differently and I feel bad for that. I don’t know if these new feelings are influenced by him, or if just being with him has caused me to gain new perspective. Thank you, everyone!

    #231697
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear jenna:

    You wrote: “I have always thought it was just me ruining everything”- no, it is not just you. It is you and him and your sister, and his mother. You are now on a break from him. He is very emotional, accusing you of being hysterical, but so is he, easy to anger, argue and fight. He gets easily angered, and it is a serious problem. Putting aside his fight with your sister (both at fault, reads to me), I think it is better that you extend the break from him indefinitely simply because he gets angry with you easily, quickly.

    You need someone calm  in your life. He needs someone calm. I don’t think he can handle your sister being in your life, that will continue to be a serious problem for him, and for you, if you resumed a relationship. In the future, it is better that you keep your family members away from your relationship and it would be better for him as well, to keep his mother away from his future relationship.

    anita

    #231765
    jenna
    Participant

    Thank you, Anita!

    I think everything you said makes sense. He is very easily annoyed and has a perfectionist personality, and has trouble letting go of control in stressful situations. Unfortunately, that always includes me. When you mentioned that he needs someone more calm, do you mean because my sensitivity and “drama” to him is too much for him? Or is it just about my sister? Honestly, I always tried to keep my family mostly separate from him. I would have to attend to his family weekly, whereas for him, he only ever had to see my family on holidays. I do mention my sister a lot, though. So perhaps he just gets exhausted from hearing about her, knowing how much disdain he has for her. I really don’t know how I can keep my future relationships further away from my family because I already did the best I could to cater to him through this 3 years, and he still blew up about her in the end. Likewise, my sister is easily shaken and emotional and angry like him too, so I feel like I’m stuck in the middle of this mess. My counselor said that due to my unstable childhood, I unhealthily attached myself to my sister (my sister was basically my caregiver when I was little), and so I have lived trying to please her and do things the way she approves of since then. I really am going to have to learn to develop my own personal boundaries.

    So you think that with me being very sensitive and insecure, that I couldn’t try harder to just not let things get to me so much? I feel like it’s my fault for letting those things get to me so much and that I’m ruining our shot at a future. I also feel like it’s my fault for letting the family issues get in our way, considering most people I know don’t care what their family says. But the difference with me was that I was hurt by him and my sister equally, and they are tangled in this. He could be more sensitive to my feelings, and not get so angry, but I feel I could also just chill out and try to separate myself from his critiques and opinions of me when he gets frustrated. Always after he cools down from our fights, he comes back to me and basically says “disagreements and hurdles are a part of every relationship.” And, “We all go through things we struggle with, and that’s what a relationship is – dealing with them together.” I’m always left confused with this because he is the instigator of all our fights. He is always the one to voice to me he’s upset with me over something I’ve done. And yet he later comes to me all rational and makes me feel like everything we’re doing is supposed to be normal because he says it’s fine, and I need to stop being so hurt over our disputes. I take everything he says to heart because I have no self-identity outside of his approval of me and I am having trouble ever believing he’s wrong about anything. It feels very dangerous and weird to feel so “in awe” of someone, like he’s my god or something. But I can’t help it.

    Thank you again!

    #231863
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear jenna:

    You are welcome.

    I added that he too needs someone calm in a relationship because everyone does, so that includes him. And almost all of us can be calmer, or should be, aim at it.

    You wrote: “Always after he cools down from our fights, he comes back to me and basically says: ‘disagreements and hurdles are a part of every relationship…”- this is his rational brain awakening after his emotional brain calms down. The key to a healthy relationship is to have both emotional and rational brain work together at the same time. For example, he gets angry and takes time out to calm down before he fights with you. The choice to take time out is a rational choice working at the same time he feels angry.

    He hates your sister, he can’t help feeling this way. It would be rational on your part to not mention her to him unless necessary (“I do mention my sister a lot”) because every time you mention her, his anger gets automatically triggered.

    These two examples, him taking a time out and you not mentioning your sister unless necessary would be the two of you working together, as a team, to help each other.

    You would have way less work if you had a calm partner and a lot more work having an easily triggered partner. This is why it would be way better for you to have a calmer boyfriend.

    If you were to resume a relationship with him, all the work that needs to be done, that team work, would have to be decided upon before hand, and it will be a very difficult endeavor if the two of you agreed on working together as equals, both participating in that huge endeavor.

    anita

    #268805
    jenna
    Participant

    Thank you, Anita!

    I’m sorry this has taken me so long to reply. A lot of life drama has happened. I just want to thank you for your perspective and clarity on this situation. It keeps me in check. We finally talked tonight after 4 months of a break and though we love each other, we still have a lot to work on and now is not the time to get back together. Maybe not ever, if we can’t grow on our own. I’ve learned a lot.

    #268825
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear jenna:

    You are welcome and I  appreciate you coming back to your thread so to thank me. I hope to read more from you, anytime you’d like to post, please do and I will reply.

    anita

    #312009
    jenna
    Participant

    Hi, everyone…again.

    I am back again asking desperately for some perspective. Let me just preface by saying I’m still active in counseling addressing my childhood trauma and codependency, so I feel like I always try to keep myself in check. However, that seems to be consistently my downfall at the same time. My boyfriend I previously spoke of here and I got back together in January of this year, after a 5 month break. Then, as you can guess, we started falling apart over arguments and judgments little by little again until it all came to a head with a huge argument, and about a week later I ended it with him officially in July, blocked him on everything, and went no contact. Last night, he texted me from a NEW phone number, basically saying he had made me a video and said it was there for me to watch, or not. He shared a link to the video too in the text. My heart sank because I have been feeling very weak lately missing him. However, I didn’t click through the link because I knew it would probably work on my heart strings more and also he would be able to see I viewed his video in the view count on Youtube. I then blocked his number.

    No matter how much pain we’ve caused each other, I never wanted to end this (probably codependency speaking). I never felt good about my decision to break up, but I just felt like it was the most mature decision for us to avoid any more bad blood and hurt. (He never would even think of ending it, that’s why I felt like I had to finally do it). I am left now dying to still know what this video entails, and also feeling guilt that I am leaving him hanging. But, I am also feeling annoyed that he thinks he can just disrespect my boundaries and text me from a new number expecting me to feed into his attention again too. But, again…a part of me unfortunately misses him still and wonders if I made a mistake to end it.

    I am sorry that this is all over the place! I guess I should also say that the big argument that unraveled us was that I went on a trip with friends to a place he had been wanting to take me for years. I didn’t go with him because of my health anxiety, so he felt betrayed and like he couldn’t trust me. I really only went with my friends because I wasn’t going to have to drive the 5 hour trip and handle the planning (things he always wanted me to either take control over or help with). After this, he sent me a novel explaining that I will never make anything of myself and that I deserve my pathetic family and will never be a normal functioning adult, and shame on me for giving up on the one person who tried to help better my life and see that I could have and do more. Also, that I can’t see out of my bubble that my family has brainwashed me into, abusing me to stay to do their bidding and not grow and mature. Also, he said that I might as well get on government assistance like my family, and he told me to never contact him again, calling me a f*cking GD loser. I didn’t reply. The next day, he frantically messaged me and said, “Nevermind. Meet me at this park at this time. We’re going to talk this out in person like it should be done.” I declined, feeling like he was being very reactive and frankly scaring me. He freaked out, and then a few days later, he wrote twice a long novel about how desperately sorry and disgusted with himself he was for saying all those things to me, and admitted to not handling his anger well, to the point that he drinks when he’s raging…and that he was essentially drunk when he exploded on me. He said it wasn’t an excuse, but that he needed to admit he didn’t have healthy coping mechanisms. (Mind you, I have dated this guy for 4 years, seeing him almost every day and i never once saw him drink beyond a little mimosa here or there at a restaurant). So it was so odd. He said he almost threw up and cried at work feeling so horrible about it all, and that he didn’t mean anything he said and I didn’t deserve any of it and that I have been the best, most understanding and gentle and kind person he’s ever met. He said he understood if I never wanted to forgive him. I sat on this message for 7 hours, and I replied with a short paragraph stating that I accepted his apology. It’s because I truly did think he finally felt humility after all these years and was being vulnerable with me. He immediately texted me back so relieved saying thank you for being so forgiving, and then that inch I gave turned into a mile in his head and he essentially thought we were again just on a break to work towards getting back together again. I had to plainly state a week later it was over though because talking just hurt me too much.

    I honestly cannot believe he has reached out to me again like this, with a heartfelt plea of “art.” He is a video/film guy, so it makes sense that he would be dramatic like this and make me a video. I also want to say that my counselor assumes he may could be a narcissist, and I think he could be too. He also has admitted he is a perfectionist from his own therapy, and when he apologized profusely to me, he admitted he always put too many expectations on me and he should have just went and took trips and did adventurous stuff on his own, instead of expecting me to do everything with him. I am just left still so unsure of everything, because I still just feel completely responsible for being too sensitive towards him, and for being careless with his feelings where I didn’t realize I was being. Also, because I really do feel like my health anxiety and issues sabotage things and bring people down. I can’t take up for myself – every time I read or watch a video on narcissistic abuse, I just immediately flip it around to his perspective and can only take up for him, and throw myself under the bus, feeling so guilty for hurting him. And in therapy, I cannot for the life of me see my own hurt. At what point are we supposed to accept ourselves for where we are and how we are, and at what point are we supposed to own up to our toxicity and change ourselves for others? If what others say or do in response to us is none of our business, then how is anyone ever legitimized in being hurt by someone and when do we owe people apologizes, or they owe us changed behavior/apologies? I just feel like I have no right to feel hurt and I can’t defend myself, even after he’s gone! And now that he’s back with that text…I feel even more confused.

    Thank you to anyone if you take the time out and read this. I am HORRIBLE at summarizing.

    #312109
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear jenna:

    Welcome back to your thread. I don’t think of your ex boyfriend, from what you shared, as a narcissist. This term has gone viral a long, long time ago and is often misused. Reads to me that he has suffered a lot in the context of the relationship with you and that you suffered as well. After all this time and suffering, and a five months break followed by about six months or resumed relationship, then another breakup, it is time “to avoid any more bad blood and hurt” on your part and his, just like you suggested yourself.

    Better you don’t watch the video, nothing positive to come out of it except for the great likelihood of yet “more bad blood and hurt”. I hope you are strong enough to continue to stand by “the most mature decision for us” that you have made, the most mature indeed for you and for him.

    anita

     

    #312177
    jenna
    Participant

    Thank you, Anita!

    My counselor and I came to that conclusion of him possibly being a narcissist because she had me go through the manual checklist she had. She said of course, she can only assume from a bystander point and he’s not her client. He seems consumed with having praise and acknowledgment, and is bitterly offended when his efforts are ignored or people don’t react the way he would to a situation. He also has no empathy for others, and is VERY critical of anyone with opposing opinions, and revels in when his “enemies” fail. He put down all my friends and family, calling them lazy and bad people who were toxic to me. Maybe at the very least, he has an issue with control. I think I want to pin something concrete on him so I can gain insight into what happened to us from a logical standpoint, and what his faults are. Because I definitely understand my faults come from childhood neglect. I am always searching for validation to my hurt, that if he has a clinical issue or something easily identifiably toxic about him, I’ll feel more legitimized in leaving and abandoning him and us not working out.

    I am trying hard to accept that maybe we were just dysfunctional and when times got rough, we just consistently misunderstood each other and didn’t share each other’s love languages. But why would someone like him who has so many issues with me, and my family, always fight to keep us going? Why after two months of no contact, and ending things with the understanding between us that it just didn’t work out…why is he trying to fight again for us? He’d be outright disgusted with me one day, and the next, he’d always insist I was precious to him and that stuff was trivial. I never could trust how he truly felt about me, and that was another reason for me giving up, I guess. I have a real problem with not being able to understand my wants and needs. If he wants me and needs me, I want him. If he’s done, I am like…okay then I am done and don’t want to be with someone who doesn’t want me. I wish I could just find my own voice. I never was and still am not emotionally able to be done with him, but my physical body couldn’t handle the fights anymore. I felt downright scolded by him each time and I’d have panic attacks and couldn’t eat. Was I just overreacting and leaking out childhood trauma on him when he’d confront me with something I did wrong, or was he just being toxic and judgmental?

    #312245
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear jenna:

    Regarding the Narcissitic  manual checklist that your counselor introduced to you: “He seems consumed with having praise and acknowledgement… bitterly offended when his efforts are ignored.. no empathy for others.. is VERY critical of anyone with opposing opinions”- everyone likes praise and acknowledgment, everyone is offended when their efforts are ignored, no  one feels empathy for others at all times, and everyone is critical of others at times. I suppose the point the manual is regarding individuals on the extreme end of the spectrum of these things, as in someone who hardly ever feels empathy for others.

    But you wrote about this man back in October last year: “he adored me and cooked me breakfast, opened car doors for me, made me hot chocolate just randomly, always let me choose what  we watched on tv, hugged me when I was upset about my heath issues, tried his best to help me  overall with my issues, and made brought me the most personalized and thoughtful presents”- this description kills the diagnosis of Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

    And notice this, you wrote: “things started out great for the first year or so”- for a whole year he behaved well with you- that is too long of a time for a Narcissistic person to fake empathy, isn’t it?

    On the other hand, as I re-read what you shared October last year, I realize that it is a bad idea to resume a relationship with him because of what you shared there: “he had an alcoholic ex who got him arrested one night too.. his arrest from hitting that person… in a cussing fit about her…  Always after he cools down from our fights, he comes back to me..  I’m always left confused with this because he is the instigator of all our fights. He is always the one to voice to me he’s upset with me over something I’ve done. And yet he later comes to me all  rational and makes me feel like everything we’re doing is supposed to be normal because he says it’s fine, and I need to stop being so hurt over our disputes”-

    He has a serious anger management  problem and he presents his anger problem as normal behavior, part of a normal relationship- well, it shouldn’t be!

    In your recent post you wrote: “my physical body couldn’t handle the fights anymore”- and this is the reason why you shouldn’t get back with him!

    “Why after two months of no  contact, nd ending things..  why is he trying to fight again for us?”-

    – maybe he fights for you because he wants to fight against you, yet again. Maybe other people in his life want to get away from him and stay away from him. And he needs someone in his life to stay, or return to him.

    Combining what you wrote in Oct and in your recent post, almost a year later: “He is always the one to voice to me he’s upset with me over something I’ve done. And yet he later comes to me all  rational and makes me feel like everything.. is supposed to be normal.. He’d outright disgusted with me one day, and the next, he’s always insist I was precious to him and that stuff was trivial“-

    – his angry behavior is not normal, or shouldn’t be normal and it is not trivial. It is a serious problem that he has, not you, and therefore it is not rational for you to go back to him and suffer yet again from his anger problem.

    anita

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