Hi canary

You feelings about being hurt will not disappear just because you forgave the perpetrator. Your feelings are telling you to pay attention to something – I am not sure what cope means exactly, but is it to resign to the fact that these feelings will persist and you want to move ahead with life? I do not recommend coping. I recommend sitting with those feelings and looking at what angered and made you sad. One thing that helps me, is to know that the other person caused this anger or sadness and taking responsibility only for my well being as I move forward. But the responsibility of causing this has to go to the person that hurt you.

Are you still around this person? Have they moved on? Were you compensated emotionally and mentally for being hurt? You hurt is asking for attention, please give it that.

There is nothing wrong with your anger. Aim for not letting it consume you. And for it to not consume you, you need to pacify it, console it, take its side and acknowledge the hurt. Dedicate some time of the day for this. You will get better as time goes on, at focussing on yourself.

• This reply was modified 2 years, 9 months ago by samy.

Hi Canary

My experience of forgiveness is that it isn’t something we do once and then as if by magic all the hurt memory’s and feelings are gone. Forgiveness is a skill and process that requires practice – perhaps better to say Forgiveness is a practice like… meditation. If you ever tried meditation you might have notice that some attempts go better then others and that ok, there will always be more opportunities to practice 🙂

I found it helpful to note that forgiveness does not mean a person is no longer responsible or accountable for thier actions. It means we can hold them accountable without having to attach to our anger and hurt. We experience hurt and anger vice ‘I am’ hurt…

Forgiveness is more of practice of “forgetting” as in not dwelling on the memory. When we notice we are dwelling we practice  acknowledging the feelings and letting them go/flow.
Forgiveness is a practice of forgoing as in letting go the desire to ‘hurt back’ and or the imagining of ‘if only’, a attempt to change the past and force it to comply to your will your control (almost always ego) . The next time you are experiencing these painful memories and emotions ask yourself if a part of you could be doing so with the subconscious hope that by holding on to your pain you are punishing the one you hurt? (I can tell you that does not work but I still fall for that trap)

It might also be helpful to remind yourself that when you find yourself in the moments when the memory arise that it is the memory that is recreating the emotions, not the specific event that happened in the specific space and time. And memory my friend is a trickster. When a experience moves to memory it is no longer the experience as it was, as we have likely projected a lot of our shadow onto it.

I agree with Anita that quality therapy could help you identify your ‘old feelings’. These feelings will likely still arise from time to time, but with help, the amount of time hold onto them will lesson until the day you will just notice – hello old friends, I see you,  I do not wish to dwell today. I have memories I am not my memories, I have emotions, I am not my emotions….  Oh look I see what in the present has triggered the memory… I also see that this present is not that experience in the past… I have taken what I have learned from the past and better able to deal with what is happening now…

Dear canary:

You wrote: “To me, forgiveness meant that I have no resentment towards the person, meaning, I’m not holding a grudge or looking for “payback”. But I believe that the feeling of sadness/anger can still remain even after forgiving a person” –

– you can look up the definitions of both of the words you used: resentment and grudge, you will see that they both include a strong element of anger. So, on one hand, you say that you feel no anger toward him (no resentment and no grudge), but on the other hand, you say that do feel anger toward him.

The relationship we are talking about started in August 2019, lasted 7 months, followed by periods of friendly talks and periods of no contact. There was a hook up or hook ups in the summer of 2020, and no talking between the two of you since July 2021.

You wrote yesterday: “I think that my feelings are telling me to pay attention to the hurt that I felt when the person felt no remorse for their actions…I am allowed to hurt by someone’s actions” -I went back to your July 2021 thread looking for what actions he committed against you.

I found the answer in TeaK’s reply to you on July 23, 2021. After reading her reply, on the same day, you wholeheartedly agreed with what she wrote, stating: “Hi TeaK, You’ve blown me away by putting everything into words perfectly! I can’t explain how much sense this all makes to me when I read it“.

Let’s look at the post that you agreed with perfectly. In her post she quoted the following from what you shared (not necessarily in the order you shared them): “he was showing me love and empathy during the beginning of my relationship… but as soon as my mental state deteriorates, he’s not able to be there for me… I would get lots of anxiety and need reassurance that he loves me. He would try his best to reassure me and make me feel better… I admit I was very codependent on him because I wouldn’t take care of myself… He told me I was sensitive and emotional but in a bad way. I don’t understand what I was doing that made him feel that way… “.

This is what TeaK wrote to you: “Your needs are totally legitimate, including the need for empathy and understanding, but the truth is that if we have a childhood wound, where those needs weren’t met when they were supposed to – then no one will be able to give us enough, unless we first heal that wound… you relied only on him to take care of you… That’s all a big burden for a person. He was doing it for a while, but then got tired. It was too much for him to handle, especially when you would go through an episode… it was too much for him, but he never dared to say anything openly. He rather accepted (or appeared to have accepted) your characterization – that he lacks empathy and that he should change. But he said he can’t change, because he allegedly suffers from the antisocial personality disorder. Frankly, this might not even be true, perhaps he’s just told you this as an excuse, because he didn’t want to argue with you anymore… There may be many reasons why you love him and care for him. Maybe one is that you feel that deep down he isn’t selfish and inconsiderate, but just couldn’t give you what you wanted”.

Your response to the above was: “You’ve blown me away by putting everything into words perfectly! I can’t explain how much sense this all makes to me when I read it“.

In your very first post on tb, December 22, 2020,  7 months before your wholehearted agreement above, you expressed just what you agreed with seven months later: “The reason for our breakup: – I was suffering from severe depression & anxiety, and it made me difficult to deal with which caused me to think that he did not truly love me – Because of those anxious thoughts I was becoming very difficult to be around which caused him to back away from me and the distance between us made me even more anxious – Although he tried to be there for me, there wasn’t a lot he could do“.

My closing thoughts: your significant anxiety and mental suffering started years before your ex-boyfriend entered your life. He didn’t cause your anxiety. It wasn’t his fault. He didn’t do this to you. You mentioned no abuse on his part. His “crime” was that he wasn’t able to heal you. But then, the counselors you saw in high school didn’t help you, the therapist or therapists you saw didn’t help you, the psychiatrist/s who prescribed you with medications didn’t help you… and the members who replied to you on your various threads didn’t help you. At times, like I detailed above, you wholeheartedly agreed with a member, only to later forget that you did, posting again as if there was no prior communication. It’s like nothing sticks. I am guessing that if you respond to this very post, you will… disagree with your own words, and/ or agree and disagree in the same sentence. Maybe these are symptoms of your anxiety. Maybe it’s gaslighting. I don’t know.

Your last sentence to me yesterday: “I am still looking for a psychotherapist, but once I find one, I will address this with them. Thank you” – you are welcome. I hope that you do find a quality psychotherapist and that you will be intellectually and emotionally honest with the therapist.

anita

• This reply was modified 2 years, 9 months ago by .

To canary:

“I usually write in these threads like a big brain dump” – your writing is generally exceptionally organized, from your very first thread and onward (I pointed this to you earlier): it does not appear at all to be a brain dump.

When you are confronted with contradictions, you make up distinctions on the spot, so to explain away the contradictions. The distinctions did not exist in your mind before being confronted. For example, in your first thread, you described your ex-boyfriend as your soulmate, and a very kind and empathetic man. In your second thread, you described him as fitting the Asocial Personality Disorder diagnosis. When I confronted you with this contradiction, you came up with the following distinction (a lie): he is Asocial with other people, BUT he is very kind and empathetic with his loved ones (and you were one of his loved ones).

In your current, 4th thread, you presented this contradiction: “I’ve forgiven them completely… I get very angry at this person“. The contradiction is in the word “completely” (I understand that the process of forgiveness is complicated). When I confronted you with this contradiction, you came up with the following distinction: you do get angry at him, BUT you don’t consciously have the urge to seek revenge against him.

In my recent post to you I confronted you with another contradiction: you were very anxious before your ex-boyfriend came into your life, and yet you are angry at your ex-boyfriend for having caused your anxiety. Having been confronted, you made up the following distinction: “I’m not angry at him for not being able to give me what I needed during our relationship, the anger is from after the breakup. Which he insulted me, disrespected me, and treated me very poorly” –

In your 4 threads, you didn’t share a single detail of an insult, or another disrespectful behavior on his part. You came up with this lie today. I don’t believe anything you say, canary.

You asked me: “are you recommending me a psychotherapist that is different from a therapist?” – in the context of mental health, the words therapist and psychotherapist are synonymous.

I am recommending for you to try really hard to stop making stuff up so to explain away old stuff. Every time you do that, it’s like you are trying to clear away old garbage by (neatly) adding new garbage on top of it. The result is more garbage, not less! If you want therapy to work for you, you have to be honest, to be… intellectually congruent and consistent about what you do know to be true. You can’t lie to a therapist and expect to be helped.

The above is my understanding following communicating with you, re-reading and studying your 4 threads over the span of more than a year. I will no longer post on any of your threads, past, current or future. I hope that you continue to communicate with other members, and that in your communication with them, that you will be honest and intellectually congruent and consistent about what you know to be true.

anita

• This reply was modified 2 years, 9 months ago by .

Dear canary:

“I am trying my best” – and I wish you the best, I really do. This is why I posted the last post, hoping that it will motivate you to work on your obvious difficulty with communicating honestly, that is, in a way that is congruent with the truth and consistent. I am hoping that you can work on this in therapy. I wasn’t trying to hurt your feelings. I was trying to help you. There is no point in me posting to you any longer because I have no intention arguing with you. And so, like I said, you are welcome to keep posting here or in a new thread and communicate with other members. It can be an opportunity for you to communicate honestly, maybe.

Goodbye canary, best to you!

anita