Dear Katrine Nielsen:

I understand and I apologize for any and all unnecessary distress that I may have caused you. It makes me sad to think that I did. I think that what happened is that I projected to you my past experience growing up and onward, feeling crazy and not trusting my own perceptions about what was happening in my life. I grew up with my mother and she did not present to me life  as it really was. What she presented to me was a series of distorted versions of reality and that confused the h*** out of me. So when I became an adult, I wasn’t able to interpret people and situations correctly. I was pretty lost, confused… and feeling crazy, no being in charge of what was happening to me.

anita

Dear Katrine,

I am glad that our conversation is helping you!

I wanted to understand the behavior of your receptionist colleague/friend a little better, so I went back and went through some of your earlier posts in this thread. And I took a lot of notes, so this will be long 🙂

So if I understood well, it all started in June or July, when your receptionist friend and your other friend, who works with you at the café (the latter used to be your roommate, right?) – invited you to go to a pub with them. At that time they still didn’t know you liked him. I don’t know if I got this right, but it seems you went with them two days in a row, and on the second day, they invited him too:

The first day we all went to a pub together (before they knew i liked him) they invited me to go with them (which made me happy that they asked me) the day after they told the cute guy that we were going to a pub with me and two other boys and if he liked to join which he did. He already had plans that day but joined us and even stayed with us even though he had to be with the others. He looked at me and said that this was very nice and we should definitly do it again which i agreed on. So I really thought we would do that again but didn’t happen.

I haven’t understood if you confided in those 2 girls already at your first night out, and that’s why they invited him the following day? Or you told them only later?

In any case, after you told them, they commented that he was sending you good signals (i.e. they believed you have a chance), and promised to help you out:

They said some months ago that he was sending me good signals and that they would help me out with him because of my anxiety, but they never did.

During July and August, he was showing interest in you: he was inquiring about you at your colleague who works at the café, then he invited you to the pub (that’s when you left without saying goodbye). A while later he invited you to go for a beer after work, then he came to your housewarming party, and in September, you both were at someone else’s housewarming party.

On all those occasions he was showing interest in you, and it seems that the “fallout” at the pub (when you left without saying goodbye) didn’t have a major impact. Eventually, on Sept 19 (if I am counting right), you had the yoga date.

Your receptionist colleague knew about the upcoming date and was asking you about it every day:

The girl who added pressure kept asking me about him everyday, and saying things like if nothing happens on this first date you move on and forget about him. If it doesn’t happen now it never will you are too different.

I am thinking that she was basically rooting for you, but might have had some doubts since nothing had happened between you and the guy up until that point, even though there were quite a few opportunities. Maybe that’s why she said “if nothing happens now, it never will”. She was keen to know what was going on, and was texting you before the date, and this made you even more nervous.

Some time after the date, you met with her, and you talked it over:

I went out for drinks with drinks with a female colleague and she gave me some good pointers as well. She works with him and she has never seen him awkward and anxious with anyone. She said that my text after the date was defensive and that that would make the person on the other end defensive. At the time I thought it sounded good and that it would make him take a step forward. Now not so much. We also talked about the fact that i am too avoident in my flirting (i am basically just shut down and ignore someone) cuz i feel it is so obvious that i am anxious around them because i like them i can’t expect people to read minds. And men also needs to know that if the are putting themselves out there and making advance to a women that it is received well.

And she made a point that we are both indirect people (to protect ourselves) which makes sense with our back ground. But it also means that there are a lot of misunderstandings. She pointed out a lot of examples of his indirect ways of trying to spend time with me, but I didn’t catch on to it because he wasn’t direct enough. So learning to communicate and be authentic and vulnerable is better than to expect people to read minds. Just because i know why i am reacting a certain way doesn’t mean that other people knows why i am acting that way.

I think it’s nice of her that she talked it over with you. Her opinion was that the text you sent him after the date was defensive and that it might have repelled him. She pointed out many occasions when he showed interest in you but you didn’t pick it up. She also gave you some pointers on how to better show that you are interested in someone.

Based on that conversation, conversation with some other friends and the advice you received here on the forum, you decided you want to try it once again: you decided to let him know you like him and to also apologize for your anxious behavior previously.

You sent him a message, but he unfortunately rejected you again. He was kind and polite, but nevertheless he said no.

After that, it could be that your receptionist colleague realized that there is no chance between you and him. Maybe that’s why she didn’t invite you to go to drinks with them, because she knew you were very sad and heartbroken? So perhaps this was her attempt to be considerate?

In the following weeks after the yoga date, it seems she went back to business-as-usual (partying and drinking with him and the gang – which they have been doing for months). It could be that in her view, the story between you and him was just an episode, in which she was interested and even wanted to help you out while it lasted. But since it ended, she isn’t thinking about it any more. She started behaving like before, without considering your feelings too much.

This also shows she isn’t really a close friend, because a close friend would be more considerate and would be checking with you, asking you how you are. It seems she is rather a colleague, with whom you can mostly have a superficial relationship.

I wouldn’t say she is a bad person though, and I don’t think she is insincere as I thought earlier – but simply she has her own life and doesn’t pay much attention to what is going on with you emotionally.

You say that nowadays you feel better when she isn’t around. It’s probably because you feel resentment towards her, you feel that she betrayed you. In reality, I don’t see a huge betrayal on her part. She was at some point interested in the success of your relationship and wanted to help you, but since nothing came out of it, she probably stopped thinking about it.

Anyway, I think it would help if you would re-evaluate her actions, and perhaps try to see things from her perspective. Also, maybe see her not as a close friend, but as a colleague. If you change your expectations towards her, I think things would be easier and you wouldn’t feel so betrayed.

What do you say?

Dear Katrine Nielsen:

Thank you very much, Katrine. What a pleasant surprise to get your message. I thought you were (rightfully) angry at me and that you wouldn’t respond to my latest post.  Yes, I had a very hard time growing up, it was a mental torture, really.. I can hardly believe I survived it.

anita

Dear Katrine,

thank you for clarifying!

So it was another colleague who you talked with after the yoga date, not X.

And when all of you went to the pub in July, it was only one evening, not two evenings in a row. X and Y found out that you liked him only later. So they didn’t help you get together with him, however they seem to have been supportive. They knew about your date with him at the pub, and they seem to have rooted for you. Later X invited both of you to her housewarming party, but he couldn’t come, right?

I don’t think they could have or should have done more in terms of helping you get together with him, since he was in fact showing initiative towards you. There was no need for their “nudging”…

So when you say that they promised to help you out, but haven’t done anything – well, there was no need to help you out since you and the guy were already in direct contact, and there was no need for a “matchmaker”, so to speak…

 

I was too fast to react to not being invited out for drinks that day (they have asked me to join for drinks after work but I have been so exhausted after work that I said no a couple of times.

It’s good that you’re realizing that they didn’t want to exclude you intentionally, but that several times you actually refused to go because you were tired after work. And when you did go to a club (which you don’t like due to partying, heavy drinking and loud music), you left early, after only one or two hours. So I guess they figured you’re not a party animal like them 🙂

But that doesn’t mean they think less of you, or don’t like you, as you previously concluded. I think they simply respect that you are a different type, you prefer pubs and a calmer atmosphere, where you can actually talk to people and not get drunk. Based on what you’ve shared, I don’t think there is any evidence that they don’t like you or think less of you. They actually seem kind, they asked for your Instagram and complimented on your hair… and later they rooted for you to get together with him. I don’t see any ill will on their part.

I felt very hurt by not being asked and that feeling just stayed for me for a long time. I really didn’t feel included

Yes I can imagine, because your childhood wound got triggered. When there is a wound like that, it distorts our perception and all we can see is rejection, although in reality, there is no rejection. These girls don’t look down on you, they don’t think you are less worthy… but you still concluded that, because your childhood experiences made you believe that you are unworthy. That’s one of your core false beliefs, i.e. false conclusions about yourself.

Regarding the guy, he is certainly an enigma and I can see how his behavior drove you crazy… because he is like hot and cold, giving you mixed signals, and he seems to be still doing that (e.g. by standing next to you, not saying anything).  Really frustrating!

I just wonder – you said you didn’t reply to his messages after he started talking about his anxiety. Is it because you felt rejected, and so you felt there is no point in continuing the conversation?

Dear Katrine Nielsen:

Thank you once again. I hardly ever encounter empathy expressed for me in such a simple, sincere way. I appreciate it. You are right: the trauma did follow me. Not only did it follow me but it (the trauma) grew when people I came across as an adult took advantage of my weakness and confusion (the weakness and confusion that were the results of my childhood trauma).

anita

Dear Katrine,

He couldn’t come to the first housewarming (he had the late shift) but came to the second one, she did two so the ones that worked the first one could come as well.

That’s nice of her! It does show she is a kind person. Perhaps she even did it partly for you, to help you and the guy get together? Because she even told you (twice) to go together with your guy and another guy she invited. It seems to me she was doing her best to give you as much chance as possible to interact…

It’s good to hear you say that you don’t think that they think any less of me. I have been known for doing the Irish goodbye so I can see it makes sense to stop inviting someone to something they don’t like and always say no.

Yes I am quite certain, after everything you shared, that those girls don’t think any less of you, and that in fact they were rooting for you, and X even tried to help. It’s good that you’re seeing that you also rejected their invitation several times, or sneaked out early from a party… So they must have figured it out that it’s not your cup of tea 🙂

I react quite strongly to rejection or even perceived rejection.I really feel like people only ask me because they are trying to be polite, and not because they genuinely want to spend time with me. It has happened a lot, like there’s a part of me that want to hear them fight for me but I never believe them when they do.

Yes, you said that you don’t even like celebrating your birthday because you believe people come out of obligation/politeness, not because they really want to. That’s all a part of your rejection wound, and feeling less worthy than others. When in fact, people do appreciate you and want to be at your birthday party!

there’s a part of me that want to hear them fight for me but I never believe them when they do.

Yes, there is a child part in you who want to be so loved and desired that people fight for her! Because that’s how she would finally know that they love her and that she’s important to them…

He is still acting awkward around me the same way he did before, and at times it even made me a bit mad. Like you don’t have the right to be awkward around me if you only see me as a friend (or just a collegue), if that’s the case then you should treat me the same way you treat the other female collegues.

Exactly! That’s what I too said a few posts back – that his behavior is frustrating and how dares he stand next to you, not saying anything, when he rejected you?! Is he provoking you or what? But I hope he isn’t… He is probably genuinely confused and doesn’t know what he wants. Or he’s super afraid of intimacy.

I didn’t reply It took me some days before I even read it, and I thought that if I replied then I would make a fool of myself.

I understand… I think it’s probably for the best. Because if he wants to talk to you, he can… e.g. while standing next to you 😉 So yeah, probably replying wouldn’t really make a difference, like unfortunately your 2 message didn’t either. But please don’t feel bad about his rejection because he obviously doesn’t have it all together…

Dear Katrine,

I am thinking of you, but unfortunately didn’t have time to respond in the last couple of days. I’ll try to write a reply as soon as possible, hopefully this evening.