Hey SereneWolf,

You do yoga right?

no, I can’t do yoga, it can actually add to the problem, in my case. But I do other types of exercises.

I didn’t do it while I was at my hometown but now that I’m back to the city I’ll continue.. and I do feel better while journaling. Also letting things happen by itself and just trust the divine so I don’t feel overwhelmed by everything.

Great, keep it up!

Yes I know that, But because she’s taking time and still sticking to past, That’s why I told her no. She reacted like I did this entirely by myself.

Oh she said it’s only your fault? Well, that’s not true really, because talking about reconciliation with her ex is a pretty big problem and it would be for any relationship…

But she didn’t argue much after that. She hugged me tight and kissed and still asked me to just friends? I said I’ll think and answer, And after I said No she said She won’t get back together with her ex either. I said it’s your decision, If you don’t need to be in rush, Don’t rush.

So she isn’t going back to her ex? She wanted to return to you but you said No – is that how it happened?

Yeah that good enough feeling isn’t that easy. Is it? haha

Yep, it’s rather notorious… and it affects every part of your life. So yeah, more inner child work, self-love and all that.. 🙂

I mean I’m aware of that, and I don’t have like any kind of jealousy. But me and my siblings are worried that they (My Father and grandpa) aren’t like a children then they shouldn’t behave like this, They should be happy with what they have and have feeling of satisfaction. Instead of always complaining this is wrong and that is wrong. That’s just irritating for all of us.

Yes, it is irritating. But you can’t really change them, so you need to learn to live with it, but not allow abuse, of course. You can tolerate it once in a while when you come to visit, but don’t allow to stick to you. Try to be like teflon – things just slide from it and don’t stick 🙂

Yes I’m really lucky that my siblings are really supportive. And yeah they do get similar treatment from my father and grandfather. My little brother somewhat doesn’t much bothered because I can sense his self-esteem,

You see? You too realize that self-esteem is key for not being too bothered with such comments. So you can do it too, work on loving and valuing yourself even more…

But yeah he’s annoyed as well, However for my sister she’s quite sensitive, Maybe even more sensitive than me. But she also accepted that there is not much chances of them changing

I hope all three of you will learn how to be less sensitive and more self-confident. Good that your sister too realizes that your father and grandfather won’t change much. That means you shouldn’t even try. However, you can set boundaries and not allow verbal or emotional abuse. In fact, it’s kind of a two-pronged action: you work on yourself to become less triggered, but you also set boundaries so they can’t just mistreat you without consequences.

Hmm well swinging from one extreme to the other I’d say yes.

Okay, so that would be binge eating then. Do you have days when you eat way too much and sort of cannot control yourself?

Also I only have two big meals per day. Lunch and dinner. I skip breakfasts.

Yeah, I am also not a breakfast person because I eat relatively late in the evening (I know, not a good strategy). So I am not hungry in the morning. But just the fact that you only have two proper meals isn’t in itself disordered eating. It’s maybe that you overeat in the evening, and you feel guilty about it? So then you starve yourself the next day, but then eat too much in the evening again? I was like that for a while, that’s why I am asking.

Yes I do not listen much to that critic but I think I have to get more positive input or affirmation or something like that on that part?

Do you mean you’d like to get praise/affirmation from people that you look good? But you said sometimes in the beginning of your posting on tinybuddha that you do get compliments for your looks, which you sort of shrug off. If I understood well?

Hi Adam,

I was relying on her for happiness in a lot of cases but I slowly started to feel alone towards the end. Like I lost myself trying to help her.

I think all the back and forth was due to her but towards the end I pulled back a bit also. I couldn’t constantly be responsible for how she was feeling.

I am glad you’ve started to realize towards the end that it’s not right how she is treating you and that you can’t be responsible for her feelings all the time. In the past you would sort of take the blame on you and try to upset her less, which in practice meant walking on eggshells, right? But in recent times, I guess you weren’t so apologetic and this made her even more upset and angry?

I never made her responsible for my feelings which I regret not making her more accountable but as you said nothing would change.

Yes, she wouldn’t have had a sudden epiphany and decided to start taking responsibility for herself. I am sure she would have accused you of being unloving and broken up with you, like she always did. In fact, you said that the last time she broke up with you was after you mentioned that sometimes you feel she detaches from you and has this blank stare, if I remember well.

So you were noticing things about her behavior in the past too and tried to point it out to her, but she didn’t like it. Her reaction was to accuse you and break up. Which tells me that she didn’t have the capacity to take any constructive criticism – to take any responsibility for how she was reacting in certain situations.

I believe she will contact me again. She will need to drop off some things of mine in the next week and I will return hers. Not sure how we should go about that. Do you think having contact is a bad idea? Should we not speak and just grab our things and go separate ways like she said she wanted?

I think you should just be polite, but without engaging in another conversation. Because that would hook you up again. Keep it superficial, because going into any depth again will make you vulnerable. There isn’t much more to say, if you’re being honest with yourself. She has her view of reality, where she is the victim and you are the villain, and you can’t really do anything about that. She needs to grow up first. But it’s not your task to push her along that path… you’ve done that enough in the past.

So my advice is: keep it short and cordial, wish her all the best, perhaps give her a friendly hug (if it wouldn’t be too much for either of you). And go your way.

I am talking about it to a lot of people and using my support. It’s just a shock to the system realizing I was being abused and manipulated a lot of the time.

Great that you have a support system – that’s super important! I understand your shock and a sense of being violated. If it helps at all, she wasn’t doing it on purpose. It was her trauma leading the game. And you were vulnerable because you wanted to make her happy, you wanted to be that special someone for whom she’ll finally change.

But you’ve learned now, in these past couple of months, that she isn’t willing to change. On the contrary, she wants you to change, to fit even better to her requirements, so she wouldn’t get triggered. Which is mission impossible and very unhealthy. This was actually driving her abuse – blaming you and not taking responsibility for her own feelings and reactions.

It could be that what adds to your shock is that you haven’t seen it before. You thought she wanted to change. And now you’ve realized that no, she doesn’t. She wants you to change. So you were in a kind of wishful thinking about it. You wanted it to be true, but it wasn’t true….

I will stay in touch on here as well as be proactive and look for distractions to keep myself busy.

Yes, take good care of yourself. Self-care isn’t a distraction, it’s vital, so practice that 🙂 Try to turn inward and focus on your own needs. Because so far you were very much focused on her. And yes, get a lot of support, both from friends and therapy.

Post anytime you feel the need!

Dear Dafne,

good to read from you too!

Skipping the romantic bit completely till marriage did sound a little bit strange to me too. I know that in some religious communities it is normal and even expected to date without any physical/romantic relationship but otherwise not sure.

Yes, arranged marriage is a concept like that, where there is no physical or emotional bonding before marriage. But that’s when someone else (your parents or a religious elder) decides whom you should marry. In Christianity and other religions too, there is a concept of “no sex before marriage.” That’s when emotional bonding is allowed and encouraged, but no sex.

So skipping the romantic part happens only in arranged marriages, and I guess that’s not what you want…

So I asked her to give me more details. She explained that the concept she is talking about is called rotational dating. And you can be romantic (kiss, hug etc. but no sex) with other people but you don’t have to.

I found the website of this dating coach, who is promoting “rotational dating” (her name is Sami Wunder). I kind of understand what she is talking about, however I personally wouldn’t be able to kiss, hold hands, go on romantic walks… with more than one person. Which is what this coach suggests.

I agree that we can date multiple people in the beginning, to filter out people who don’t share our values and only want a casual relationship. But at some point, I think the most natural and honest thing is to pick one guy and start forming that deeper bond with him. I personally wouldn’t be able to form a deeper bond with more than one person at a time.

What’s the difference to date casually and in rotation?

If I understood her well, in rotational dating you are being emotional/romantic (but no sex) with more than one person simultaneously. She recommends 2 to 3 people max – those are the guys whom you’ve screened out as suitable candidates. She recommends to date all 3 of them until one of them proposes or gives you whatever commitment you are hoping for.

But as I said, it’s not something I could do, because first, it involves emotional intimacy, kissing and holding hands with multiple people, which is unacceptable for me. And also, it’s a bit like choosing the “best bidder”, which is not love and more, but a business deal.

What do you think Tee? Does it make more sense to you now? Would this concept help me to choose wisely and heal faster?

Honestly, I don’t think it would help you. I think it might hurt you even more. What I think would help you is to do some healing related to your childhood wounds, so you could have more self-confidence and more clarity in picking the right guy.

One of my favorite coaches on youtube, Anna Runkle, also known as the Crappy Childhood Fairy, talks about how to find true love. She specializes in dating, relationships, and healing from childhood trauma. She has a video you might like: “How to heal and find real love” (enter the title in youtube and you’ll find it). Let me know what you think…

Hi Peter,

you are very welcome. Dr. Tori Olds is a valuable find indeed. I was amazed and grateful for her videos, they just resonate so much.

Anyway when that hope arises I wonder if I’m asking if ‘I’ care and love ‘me’ in the moment when the thought arises.

Yeah, I know, that’s the real question…

When Jung was asked the question if he believed in G_d (G_d-Christ – Brahman-Atman – capital S -Self) he replied that he did not believe because he knew. He was highly criticized for that answer and he didn’t explain himself as far as I know.

That’s interesting, didn’t know that about Jung. I have to say, I also “know”, kind of. Because I had the experience of the capital S Self. But sometimes, when I am struggling (specially with my health recently) I start doubting… not in the existence of God, but whether he/she/it cares. I think in those moments of suffering I get disconnected from the Self, and slip into fear and doubt. But then I process through my pain and find renewed hope. I get re-connected to the Self, at least for a while, until some other fear creeps in…

Now when I think about it, it’s like dropping off the line and getting reconnected again multiple times a day, some days with longer and some days with shorter duration 🙂

Dear EvFran,

I think that since her son is 21, perhaps some “tough love” would be appropriate: I think she shouldn’t be supporting him and paying for his escapades, but ask him to move out, if he’s not planning to continue his studies. That will force him to find work and get his act together. If she keeps bailing him out and tolerating his lifestyle, she will be enabling him and not helping him at all.

I understand that he might have a tough time due to his parents divorcing and possibly other issues from his childhood. But nevertheless, smoking weed all day and getting in trouble with the law is not the answer. I would also suggest that he starts attending therapy. If I were his mother, I would pay for his therapy, but I wouldn’t keep enabling his bad behavior and bailing him out.

Hi Adam,

you’re welcome!

It. Really did feel like it was all about her and your analogy of the remote control car in one of your previous comments was a perfect one. She really did control everything including how I felt. When I would resist or stand my ground it was more signs of imperfect love, I was only trying to encourage her own self reliance. I was living through the lens of her happiness and not my own.

This very much sounds like you were codependent on her – your happiness depended on her happiness and you tried everything to make her happy. When you couldn’t be on “standby” 100% of the time, she would accuse you of not loving her perfectly. So your life revolved around her and trying to make her happy…

She told me I need to change by being there for her more and understanding what she was feeling. I was constantly told I wasn’t listening to her or understanding her needs.

The responsibility of work and owning a house is a lot. She has neither and for this reason she couldn’t understand the demand of my life at times.

She would accuse me of not having my priorities right, expecting that she should be number 1 before anything else.

Yeah, this is typical in people with trauma: it’s all about their needs, they want to be your No1 and come before everything else. It’s basically the demands of a child who needs attention and care 100% of the time. The problem is that she is not a child any more, and you’re not her mother. You cannot babysit her all the time. She refused to take responsibility for herself and shifted that responsibility on you, and then sort of bullied you when you wouldn’t accept it fully.

My priority is my future, family and me. I feel as if these all correlate in my life and a partner is included in that, not any higher or lower on some list.

It’s a good attitude. We’re not supposed to be our partner’s care-taker. In fact, both partners need to be adult enough to heal any major childhood wounds they may have, because only then can they participate in a healthy relationship. And a healthy relationship is interdependent, not codependent.

I never heard of trauma bonding until today but I started seeing the signs of emotional abuse last week. This was definitely what I was experience as well as manipulation. I think it was unintentional but still that isn’t what I want from a relationship.

I also wasn’t clear what exactly trauma bonding was, but now that I watched that video again, it became clear to me. And it’s really what you had too: intimacy and closeness alternating with blaming and rejection. I am glad you’ve become aware that it was actually abuse and that she used you as her punching bag.

I do feel a bit different, I don’t know how to describe it but I feel violated and taken advantage.

Yeah, that’s normal. Abuse does that to us… Try to be gentle on yourself. Practice self-care, have plenty of rest and do the things that make you happy. You need to start focusing on yourself and your own needs – so turn the attention inwards.

I am waking up to it. I felt so trapped and alone the day before she left me. It’s because I was in the end. I was suffering in silence because of her mental instability. I felt as I couldn’t speak in fear of upsetting her or just being straight up rejected. That in itself is hurting me as I am questioning if I maybe should have spoken up more. However I don’t think it would change any outcome.

No, you couldn’t have changed anything with her. Nothing you might have said would have made a difference. You already spent months and months discussing things, and there was no change. So no, you couldn’t have done anything. Please don’t blame yourself for her behavior or for the breakup.

I know I need to stop. I have removed her off everything and my headspace is on fixing myself and not latching onto hopes of a future relationship.

Good! She might contact you again, saying she is sorry, but please don’t allow to get hooked again! Please stay away from her because her behavior is toxic.

I texted My psych again today I hopes to book another appointment. I bottled everything up last session as I was too afraid to say I felt I was being abused emotionally, I wasn’t sure if it was me overthinking.

Yeah, you weren’t sure yet. And sometimes we tend to hide the truth even from ourselves, justifying and trying to excuse our partner’s behavior, even blaming ourselves. But it’s good you’re seeing it now, and are ready to talk about it and process it.

Please take good care of yourself in the coming days and weeks. Hope to talk to you soon!

Hi Adam,

good to hear from you again!

I am sorry you’re hurt once again, but at the same time, I hope you can see now that this relationship was pretty bad for you and your mental health.

It dawned on me a couple of days ago that I felt as I couldn’t be myself and do what I want to do. She needed a caregiver 247 and when I wasn’t there for her it was again signs of me not loving her enough and her not getting what she was wanting.

We were fighting a lot the last couple weeks and it was all brought on due to her not feeling connected etc. we’d have a chat and sort things out but then again days or a week later she would say she wasn’t getting what she wanted.

It seems it was all about her and her needs. She really felt she can press a button and you’ll show up, or you’ll disappear from her sight on demand. That is emotional abuse, Adam. You saw it well. Anna Runkle (The Crappy Childhood Fairy) calls it emotional abuse too. She used the phrase “yanking a dog’s chain”. She also calls it trauma bonding: constantly switching from being nice and loving to you, to then blaming you and wanting to break up with you. That’s not true love, but trauma bonding.

You were hooked on her nice words and promises, that’s why you tolerated her abuse. And it was hard to let go, because you were craving those moments of connection and intimacy that were there. But the problem is that those good moments were soon followed by attacks and withdrawal. So it was a roller-coaster. And this roller-coaster of being “loved” in one moment and then rejected in the next is called trauma bonding.

I feel quite attacked honestly. I don’t think my side was ever considered and she would selfishly use me as a punching bag for her irrational behavior. I felt really shit about myself after an argument the other night and I remember thinking I can’t leave her but that she was going to do it soon. Now it’s happened and I may not be happy at the moment but I needed an out. I think I may have been receiving slight emotion abuse at times.

Yes, it was emotional abuse definitely, and not only slight. It’s a pity that you felt you can’t leave. Do you now, after seeing the video and understanding it was emotional abuse – feel any different?

As explained in the video it wasn’t a relationship that I wanted but I did tell myself and I push past this and deal with all the bad despite how it made me feel there would be light at the end.

Yes, because she hooked you with those good moments when it felt as if she loved you. That’s why you felt hope. You hoped that she would seek therapy and heal her trauma, so she can love you always, not only sometimes. But it never happened, because she doesn’t want therapy.

she told me nothing changed even though she told me what I needed to do. However I don’t believe I needed to change anything.

Oh she told you you need to change? And how so?

The whole situation sucks but I am feeling a tad better about it this time, I think I’ve just woken up to what was happening and I also got over trying to fill a bottomless pit with my love.

I also hope you’re waking up to how abusive this relationship was!

I lost myself in the process

I hear you, Adam. You tried to fit yourself to her requirements, you tried everything not to upset her, you tried to be supportive of her ups and downs… Anna Runkle calls this “crap fitting”. When we try to fit ourselves to crap that our partner is exposing us to.

But you can recover, Adam. However, you need to stop contacting her, stop trying to change her. You need to let her go, because she can’t give you what you need. Do you think you can do that?

Hi Peter,

To love our neighbor as ourselves isn’t then a reflection of how we love ourselves, or not only that, but that our neighbor is also It and so also our Self.

Yes, we are all One…

A psychotherapist Richard Schwartz, founder of the Internal Family Systems (IFS) therapy, had been working with hundreds of people, who all said that when they unblend from all their parts (the protector part, the child part etc), what remains is their true self. What that observes all those other parts is the true self. And so Richard Schwartz began to call it the Self (with the capital S).

There is a beautiful youtube video by another therapist (Dr. Tori Olds), who explains our Self from that perspective, including the 8 characteristics of the Self. It’s titled “How to find yourself: The True Self in IFS therapy“. I think it’s worth watching. It kind of blends psychotherapy and spirituality when explaining our true self, and to me, it’s quite fascinating.