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Dear Peace,
now it’s getting clearer to me why you were so unhappy in childhood – your mother was too busy with various chores and was a type of person who didn’t say much. It seems like she didn’t ask you too many questions either, e.g. she didn’t inquire how was school, or what’s up, neither did she notice if you felt disturbed or sad about something. Probably that’s why you never had the urge to go to her to complain or confide in her when you had a problem. You didn’t tell her about your period either, neither did you dare to mention the sexual abuse when it happened to you. You had to carry a very big burden by yourself, and it appears that your mother didn’t show too much interest in you and your feelings. Although she didn’t criticize you, she was actually emotionally distant – it was a sort of emotional neglect.
This probably happens quite frequently in big families like yours, but still, you didn’t get the care, attention and protection (and guidance) a child should get. I can imagine you didn’t feel important enough to even bother your mother (or your father) with your problems, did you? You didn’t feel seen and you didn’t feel worthy to be seen either. And this is why you prayed to God to die, it was so unbearable for you.
To be honest, when you first told about your parents – that they were loving and haven’t criticized you – I didn’t understand how come then you had such a hard time as a child. But now I understand – it wasn’t emotional abuse, but emotional neglect. Perhaps if you had been more demanding, your mother would have paid more attention to you. But you were sensitive, you rather withdrew and suffered in silence, because you believed you don’t have the right to demand attention.
All this explains why you’re longing for attention now – you are longing for someone to see you and “mirror” you, to understand you, to be there for you. You said in one of your earlier posts that you wanted from a man to “take a stand for you” (“i feel like no one will ever accept me as a partner everyone will come to pass their time but none will ever take a stand for me“). Your mother, and it appears your father too, never took a stand for you. Never even asked you how you’re doing and what you’re feeling. Never noticed that you’re hurting. You don’t want to go through the pain alone any more, so you’re looking for a man to be there for you. But until you learn to be there for yourself and soothe yourself, no one will be able to give it from the outside.
I think you should find a counselor to work on the sexual abuse trauma, and also to help you heal emotional neglect. So you can be whole within yourself and be able to soothe yourself, without looking for a man to soothe you (which always ended up badly so far). If I were you, I would focus on my healing, I wouldn’t engage in relationships with men for now, because you always end up hurting afterwards. Try to put aside for now the pressure to get married and the whole issue of being a virgin. You need to first find yourself and own yourself, before you can enter in a healthy relationship with a man.
Once you heal, you’ll be able to attract more balanced and emotionally mature men, who will appreciate you for who you are as a person, in your entirety, and won’t see you as a piece of meat or a piece of hymen, as you said. The process of healing and self-discovery may take a while, even a few years, but it’ll be worth it, because the benefits and consequences will be for a lifetime…
- This reply was modified 3 years, 8 months ago by Tee.
TeeParticipantDear Peace,
Anita might be unto something when she says your mother might have not protected you enough. How did she react when your siblings were teasing you, or when your cousins insulted you? For example, you said one of your cousins told you to stay at home when you were 11 years old. You father had already started showing symptoms of dementia at that time, so I assume he didnât intervene much? What about your mother? How did she react to this cousin harassing you and telling you to stay at home?
Another problem I see is that until you were 9-10 years old, you father was working all day long and didnât participate in your upbringing too much. Later, as you entered puberty, he started getting more and more ill and incapacitated to be there for you. Instead, there were numerous male cousins who sort of started taking the role of your father in âguidingâ you, but actually they insulted you, humiliated you, tried to control you, and showed zero appreciation for you. Where was your brother in this whole picture? Was he old enough to be a positive influence on you, or he joined your cousins in mocking you?
I imagine this is what led you to miss the presence of a healthy, supportive father figure. And if your mother wasnât strong enough, or it wasnât culturally appropriate that she protect you from your male cousins, then of course, you would suffer a lot and long for a man who would love you and protect you. That could be why you got involved with a man much older than you when you were only 15 years old. But he wasnât too interested in you either, he wouldnât even touch your hand when you tried to touch his.
Later, in Germany, you felt freer and started exploring relationships with men, but they all ended badly. You rushed from one relationship into another, and the reason is probably that you craved manâs love and presence so much, that you felt you couldn’t do without it. Also note that you were attracted to men older than you (all except your current boyfriend). So you crave the love of a mature man. Two of your ex boyfriends actually have children of their own.
This all tells me that the pain and the craving for love is related to a missing father figure. Probably your mother couldnât fill that role, or wasnât even supposed to, due to cultural limitations? You received a very negative message from men in your early life (your male cousins, possibly your brother too) â basically that youâre unlovable and worthless. That makes you long for a man whoâd finally tell you youâre lovable and valuable to them.
How does all this sound to you?
TeeParticipantDear Peace,
thank you for sharing some more or your very interesting story! If I am understanding it well, you actually felt loved and supported by your parents. However, you were very much hurt by the behavior of your siblings and cousins, and your parents’ love couldn’t make up for your feelings of lack. You said earlier that you felt so miserable that at some point you prayed to God to die (“Even though i had not a happy childhood, i felt unloved, wished to be dead because no one shows me affection, appreciation, care, love apart from my mom⌠I was very sensitive⌠I used to cry alone nd used to pray to God for death in childhood⌔).
So it appears that you felt unloved not because your parents didn’t love you, but because your siblings and cousins didn’t love you or show appreciation to you. Your siblings (7 sisters and 1 brother) were mocking you (“criticized me in fun way which hurted me“) and were jealous that your mom loves you so much (“my other siblings were actually jealous because my mom loves me alot”).
Your cousins and aunt insulted you and humiliated you because you were poor. They didn’t want to offer you tea or take you in their car with them. By the way, did they treat your other siblings like that too, or just you?
It could be that the voices of your siblings and cousins, who were many, overpowered the voice of your parents. So you focused on not receiving love, on not being appreciated by them, rather than on receiving love and being appreciated by your parents. You took one part of your childhood experience and made it your whole reality. And you suffered because of it a great deal. This is how we often operate – we focus on the negative, and forget or take for granted the positive experiences.
You say that later your sisters actually helped you and enabled you to go to study abroad. One of them sold her gold, and the other one took a loan so you can go abroad. So although they might have mocked you when you were children, they were generous and supportive of you later, as adults. Or at least they supported you materially. Do you feel they support you in general or they criticize you for how you live your life?
Right now I don’t want to return immediately to the subject of your boyfriend, but for now, perhaps just try to re-frame or take another look at your childhood experience of feeling unloved. Because in reality, you were actually loved by your parents, but you chose to focus on being unloved by your siblings and cousins. You focused on the pain and lack. Try to see that you were loved as well, try to go back to the positive memories and focus on the love you received in your mother’s lap, when she fed you and cared for you, when your father was kind to you, when he told you he wants education for you etc etc…
TeeParticipantDear Peace,
thank your for sharing more about your family. I am sorry your father passed away while you were quite young.
You say: “I felt like an unwanted child or were treated in that way from my siblings,i m sure they loved me alot but in my society ( generally) its easy to criticise than show love /appreciation.”
Does it mean you were criticized by your siblings and it is because of that, that you felt unwanted? Or your parents criticized you too?
You say “mom,she is the most sweetest mom in the world she loved/loves me the most and treated me like a princess to her when i was near her. She made me eat with her hands i would sleep next to her in her arms even when i was 12 years old…”
I don’t quite understand how that looked like – you were sitting in her lap and used her hands to feed yourself? It’s something she made you do?
You say “In my case i was seeking attention, appreciation,(may be) because never got some.”
Whose attention did you crave the most?
Sorry for asking you all these questions, I am trying to better understand your family dynamics and what might have caused you the greatest pain.
TeeParticipantDear Sarasa,
have you ever told him that you like him more than a friend? Have you expressed your feelings for him? From what you’ve written so far, you sort of expected him to do it. You expected that when you wrote him the “goodbye message”, he’ll finally come clean and admit his feelings for you. But he didn’t. But neither have you.
You’re clearly suffering and cannot move on, even if you try to tell yourself you should. But we can’t just move on mentally, if we’re attached to someone emotionally, like you are to this boy. He seems to be attached to you too. You don’t know what he’s really feeling, but neither he does what you‘re feeling. I know it puts you on the spot to express your feelings openly, because what if he rejects you. But that’s the only way you’ll really know.
Because now you’re torturing yourself, instead of just admitting how you’re feeling. If he doesn’t share the same sentiments, then you can start really grieving and moving on. But if he does, it might be the beginning of something really beautiful.
- This reply was modified 3 years, 8 months ago by Tee.
TeeParticipantDear greenshade,
I am sorry things are so hard for you, and that you’re in such a tough spot regarding your father. Based on what you shared about childhood, it’s no wonder that you’re reluctant to visit him and show affection to him, knowing how he treated you and manipulated you in the past.
The staff at the care home is telling you that âhe is not eating he only talks about his daughter he just wants to talk to you”. They are making you feel guilty, probably unintentionally, because they don’t know the truth. And the truth is that he’s been harassing you like that for years, demanding your presence at all times, calling you at work every few hours, complaining “how lonely and sad he was”, telling you how he misses you… in short, making you feel guilty whenever you didn’t spend time with him.
Now he’s doing something similar, trying to coerce you into visiting him, not because he really cares about you and misses you, but because he wants to exert control over you. If he can control you, he can calm down, I guess.
On top of your father’s obsessive control and abuse, you also live in a very controlling and abusive culture. It forces you to live with your parents until you get married, and if you live alone, you’re in danger of being raped. In addition, you’re forced to take care of your parents regardless of how they (mis)treated you, and if you refuse, you’d be labeled as “worst of the worst”.
Just writing this causes anger and righteous indignation in me! No wonder you feel trapped and “don’t know how to escape your life”. But for the sake of your own sanity and your own future, it’d be very important to change your present circumstances, to give yourself a chance at a better life. You owe it to yourself. You’re an intelligent, eloquent woman, educated, with lots of wit, you’ve seen the world and managed to escape the abusive culture for at least 10 months. You can do it again!
You said in June 2019 that you’re planning to go back to your boyfriend in a 2-year time. It would be this summer… How is the situation on that front? Are you still in touch with your boyfriend?
- This reply was modified 3 years, 8 months ago by Tee.
TeeParticipantDear Neverdyed,
And yesterday I kind of remembered a possibly significant reason that has been âpreventingâ me to have fun as usual: the travel ban, since itâs a tradition for me to do so every year, and I usually relax much when being on holiday.
Yes, traveling can be a lot of fun… And it would be wonderful if you could feel good “by yourself”, i.e. feeling good enough and worthy, and not needing someone else to feel good about yourself. I do hope the travel ban will lift by the summer and there’ll be more opportunity to travel.
TeeParticipantDear Peace,
after I’ve read your “Guilty or not?” thread, I agree with Anita that your relationship with men has probably to do with your childhood wound.
There’s been a pattern in your relationships where you feel guilty about leaving: it happened with your first, long-term boyfriend, whom you started dating at the age of 15. You said he never showed you much love, but when you wanted to leave him, he threatened to kill himself. He also was saying he’d burn the first letter of your name on his body, or cut his hand nerves as a “proof” of his love for you. That emotional blackmail made you feel even more guilty for leaving. Your toxic boyfriend also blamed you (and harassed you and made you financially broke) when you wanted to break up with him. This boyfriend might not be blaming you (or not yet) but you’re blaming yourself.
You said:
“yesterday in the video call conversation he asked me whats wrong and i couldnt reply .he was hurting i was hurting too..than he asked ,if i m not having feelings for him i said yes ⌠he started crying i was saying :i m really sorry ,i m trying ,i dont know what to do i was saying again n again..i have been trying i started to cry and i couldnt stop in that video call”
When he asked you what’s wrong, you couldn’t tell him the truth that his irresponsible behavior and empty promises turn you off. You couldn’t verbalize that you’re disappointed in him or have issues with his behavior. Instead, you started blaming yourself, like it were your fault that you simply just “turned off” and lost love for him, as if it didn’t have anything to do with his bad behavior.
A pattern I see here is that you get involved with a man, after a while you realize he doesn’t make you happy, you want to break up, but then you blame yourself for wanting to leave. And they blame you too. You start believing the problem is in you, not in them.
The reason for that is most likely in your childhood, because when the child doesn’t receive the love they crave, they blame themselves, not the adult. The child starts believing they are unlovable, and that something’s wrong with them. The same as you’re now believing about yourself…
In your description of your childhood, I noticed you didn’t mention your father, only the male cousins who harassed you. Your issues with men might be related to the absence of a father figure. If you’re comfortable with sharing a bit more about your childhood, I think it would explain a lot of what you’re experiencing in your relationships with men.
TeeParticipantDear Jane,
I am very glad your son rang you. And that he didn’t ask for anything, but just to talk to you. That indeed is a breakthrough and a very promising development!
As Brandy said, by being a stable and trustful person in his life, while at the same time protecting your boundaries, you might have an effect on him in the long run. He might turn around.
It seems his partner isn’t a good influence on him, since she’s not allowing him to meet with you. Although interestingly, she encouraged him to call you… I guess you were right not to want to meet with him in secret. He needs to decide what he wants and clarify things with himself. I do hope he starts coming around, little by little, with your compassionate support from afar.
TeeParticipantDear Peace,
thanks for explaining a bit more. That was truly a traumatic experience, your first bf was definitely a psychopath. Just the fact that he told you that you need to pay him back, when he was actually living at your place almost for free, and you took care of him while he was sick – despicable! I am glad you managed to stand up on your feet again and that you’ve learned a lesson from that experience!
“may be thats what attracts these guys are that i wont be ( burden)dependent on them in any way ,and still they can spend good time without investing much (as i dont expect for beautiful expensive gifts from them)”
Yes unfortunately it does seem like that. And you’re willing to help them and even sacrifice yourself for them, while they hardly contribute anything. It’s almost a free ride for them…
So I guess this could be another lesson for you – not to get involved with men who’d try to use you. One example would be not to date men who want to move in immediately with you, because they don’t have a place to stay. Or not to give them money for their financial troubles. So, create some precautions and boundaries before you get more deeply involved with them.
TeeParticipantDear Peace,
you’re welcome. It’s good to hear that you value yourself and your own happiness more than other people’s expectations. I am sorry you had such a horrible experience with that divorced man (I guess?), father of two sons, who called you names and threatened you. As a result, you were keen to receive a certain guarantee from your previous boyfriend (also divorced, who still had obligations towards his ex wife and child, and was unwilling to marry you).
You said the toxic boyfriend made you financially broke, the next one had financial issues too (had to pay for the house for his ex wife and child), and your current boyfriend has money problems too. I actually see a pattern there – perhaps these men are attracted to you because you’re independent, have a job, a decent salary – in other words, you can help them financially (and are willing to do so, because you feel sorry for them).
I am not saying these three men are the same, because the first sounds pretty scary, while the other two boyfriends seem more normal. But all of them had financial issues and needed your help, and I don’t think it’s a coincidence. What do you think?
- This reply was modified 3 years, 8 months ago by Tee.
TeeParticipantDear Peace,
I’ve read your previous thread, from 7 months ago, and there’s one thing that stood out: that you’re very susceptible to the social/cultural pressure to get married, and also about “what the people will say” (e.g. you felt uncomfortable when your previous boyfriend would stay with you on the weekends, and you weren’t married). So, perhaps the greatest dilemma is – do you want to follow tradition and indeed get married as soon as possible, because that’s what’s expected from you, or you want to give yourself time to meet the right guy – someone whom you really like and respect and feel you can rely on?
It seems you feel pressured to decide ASAP, and that’s why are now pressuring your current boyfriend to come up with a marriage proposal, which he’s reluctant to (“I told my bf abt proposal he got very upset.. I asked him to talk to his mom about our proposal he said he will do in 2-3 days.. And till today i got 0 update about this..“) It’s good he’s reluctant, because he doesn’t seem like someone you could rely on, and he would probably cause you great pain and frustration in a marriage.
However, an even bigger problem, in my opinion, is the need to rush things and then get completely lost and don’t know what you really want for yourself. You seem to be an intelligent, independent woman, who can take care of herself very well financially. You’re also a very kind person, willing to help others. You don’t need to rush to marry someone just because it’s expected from you. You need time to get to know the person and see if you like them, and even see how they behave in various life situations.
So my advice is think about what you really want for yourself, and if expectations and other people’s opinions are more important than your own long-term happiness.
TeeParticipantDear patelh,
It seems to me that your husband has low self-esteem, and that’s why it’s important for him to be accepted and not judged by his family. When they criticize you, for him it might be as if they are criticizing him – that his choice of wife wasn’t good, that he was wrong, that he’s not good enough, he’s not meeting their expectations… So probably he feels not good enough, but then immediately blames you for that – he believes it’s your fault that he feels bad about himself. If you would only change, he would feel better about himself. At least that was what my cousin’s husband was claiming…
If you want to make things work with your husband, I think he would need to realize that his biggest enemy is himself: his lack of self-confidence and his need to get his family’s approval. If he could work on himself, he’d almost certainly become less judgemental and more respectful of you.
TeeParticipantDear patelh,
your situation reminds me of my cousin. Her in-laws never accepted her, were telling she’s not good enough for their son, because she’s a few years older, hasn’t graduated from college, and that she’s messy and doesn’t keep order at home. Well, that may be true, but she’s a good person otherwise and was a good match for her husband. They did well and had 2 beautiful daughters together. The husband was loving in the beginning, but then started to criticize her more and more, falling under the influence of his parents. Eventually he filed for divorce, and they did get a divorce. She was devastated but she’s survived, and probably she’s better off now without the constant criticism and put-downs by her husband and in-laws.
The problem is that he was a weak man, insecure in himself, and didn’t have the guts to confront his parents and defend her. She had low self-esteem issues, and so she tolerated his criticism, and partly thought she deserved it. He was the superior one, she was inferior. She believed it.
I see a lot of similarities with your situation, because as you say, your husband doesn’t respect you and agrees with his parents and family that you’re inferior. It could be that he’s specially rude and impatient with you nowadays because you’re not working and decided not to look for a job at the moment. My cousin’s husband was similar – he didn’t like that she stayed more than one year at home after the birth of their 2nd daughter. He thought she was lazy.
My advice is to separate from your husband because it probably won’t get better. It could in theory, if you move somewhere else, where he’s further away from his family. But it’s not a guarantee because they can still influence him – and he seems very susceptible to their opinion. If he doesn’t respect you, that’s a huge and No1 problem. Another problem is if you don’t respect yourself…. You’d need to work on your self-esteem and decide that you’re good enough, there’s nothing wrong with you, and that you don’t want to tolerate this kind of attitude.
I guess if you’d like to separate, you would need to find a job, so it’s not the best timing for you now. But this situation with your husband isn’t really sustainable and will only make you miserable.
- This reply was modified 3 years, 8 months ago by Tee.
TeeParticipantDear Jane,
“He now has the chance to put his life back together without any interference.”
Is he open to getting help, such as attending AA meetings, or he refuses everything? If he doesn’t even want to try to help himself, you can’t really do much but to keep him in your thoughts and prayers, and hope that he will turn around some day.
You said his partner is a toxic person too – is she also a drug addict or alcoholic? Because if so, their child might be in danger and might need help of the social services?
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