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Cutting ties with a toxic parent

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  • #274859
    Alexa
    Participant

    Hello,

    This forum seemed such a nice place to ask for an advice and to share a little bit of my problem. People here seemed genuine to me so I just thought I’ll give it a try.

    I don’t really know where to start from, because this is a problem as old as me, but in the last three months some things happened that made me analyse everything over again. I’ll try not to take to much of your time.

    Starting with a little bit of background, I have to mention that I suffered of depression in the past 8 years, maybe more if I count the years before I was given the diagnosis. I was suicidal and I also suffer from agoraphobia, social anxiety and an avoidant personality disorder.

    So, my issue is with my father. My parents are divorced and although they’ve been married I’ve never saw them together as a family. I know for a fact my father did not wanted me and I was that “thing” that he never wished for. After they had me, my parents were kind of forced to get married by their parents, so it wasn’t a marriage out of love, which ended up with a lot of cheating coming from my father’s part, a lot of blaming (on me mostly), a lot of anger from both parts directed straight to me and a lot of abandoning throughout the years (from both of my parents, who seemed to play ping pong with me, sending me back and forth from my mother to my grandparents, whenever my mom didn’t want to take care of me, and from them back to my mother). Me and my mother went through a lot because of my father because he is manipulative, emotionally abusive and he lyes a lot. For him, lying is more like a disease, because he just can’t say two words without one of them being a lie. The emotional abuse is just what he does as an after effect of his lying, blaming others for his behaviour, turning things around to suit him even if that means that he will degrade you as a person in front of other people, starting fights on the street because he knows it’s the only way he will win the fight because you’ll just feel to embarrassed to say anything when hundreds of eyes are watching you etc.

    Throughout my life I’ve been constantly lied by him, even in matters that he knew were important to me and I have also suffered tremendously as a result of his lies and actions. I was judged, critiqued, called names, looked at like I was at fault, almost kidnapped and abused by two teachers (if you can call kidnapping the fact that they’ve forced me into their car and they didn’t want to let me go, but physical and verbal abuse did take place during the time they kept me). The thing is, since I was fifteen he supported me financially from time to time and for him that seems to be equal to me not having the right to speak for myself in front of him. He told me multiple times, whenever I tried to say anything regarding his lies and the impact they had on me, that I am never allowed or that I don’t have any right to answer him back, even if he insults me, yells at me and puts me in difficult situations. He is disrespectful with me in ways I can’t even comprehend, because I still don’t understand how a parent can do these kind of things to their child, wanted or not. One thing that I have to mention is that I have always been respectful to him, maybe even more than I should have.  In the last three months he insulted both me and my husband numerous times, mocked us, even in front of other people, told lies about us and made us look like we are the “bad guys” in everything that happened in the last 3 months. I don’t want to get into too many details, but his behaviour is just out of proportions.

    What I am actually confused about, is that he makes me feel very very guilty and although I decided to cut him out my life, he always finds a way to come back. I used to do this a lot with my mother, before they eventually got divorced and even after that he still found a way to come back into my life. I’ve changed cities, addresses, phone numbers, but he was still there, like a shadow waiting to show his face. The thing is, he is the kind of person who believes that he can buy your dignity and everything you stand for with money and expensive things. I’ve never been one for any of those and I’ve never been after his money, although the last time we spoke he told me I was a money-grubber. I’ve never asked him for anything. Anything he gave me, he gave because that’s what he wished to do, not because I asked for it. But he still told me so many things that weren’t true and made me feel guilty and put the blame of his behaviour on me. For a long time, because of him I thought I did not have the right to live, to breath, to express myself. I’ve become socially inapt. A few years ago, my psychiatrist at that time gave the advice that if he’s such a toxic person, I should break any ties with him and I did tried that, moved to another city and so on, but he still managed to slip back into my life because he knew I was in a difficult situation where I needed money to support myself (at that time I was still suffering of depression, barely could get out of the house because of my agoraphobia).

    Now I am again in that position. I have cut ties with him, change my phone number, but he still does a great damage to my life through other things. I just don’t know what else to do. I’ve tried talking to him. I told him the only thing I wanted was for him to be honest with me and just stop lying. I told him these with as much as respect as one person can say something. I’ve tried to get closer to him and even understand where all that damage he has comes from. I’ve tried understanding everything, even when he asked me to do things for him I didn’t want to do, like also lie his second wife when he was on trips with his mistress, that he was visiting me. I did everything I could just because I wanted to feel accepted by him. Now, I just know I want him out of my life and I want all the lies, the deceptions, the manipulation, the emotional abuse to stop… But he makes me feel so guilty because I want to do this. Emotionally I am a wreck, my depression is relapsing, my panic attacks are becoming worst (now I have them even just by going out of my room).  I took a time apart from his family because most of them are only intrested in the gossip and have ulterior motives in everything (mostly) they do and say (his siblings-they are more or less like him, cousins and even my grandmother- his mother, who I love dearly but I couldn’t lie to her because she always knows when something isn’t right and I just couldn’t call her anymore because I was to afraid of what I would end up telling her about my father). A few days ago he sent me an email, telling me to call my grandmother and I know she probably misses me and I miss her, but I can’t just bring myself to talk to anyone except my husband. And especially after I heard a conversation in which my father spoke with so much hatred about me and my husband, although we’ve done nothing to him. I know we also have our own fault because it got to this situation, because we trusted him and believed that he would help us with something important to us, but even so, even if I feel I brought this on myself and that maybe I deserve this lesson in life (it taught me he will never change and that he is the same bad person that he was years ago, and a lot of other things about myself), is this really something I have to feel guilty about it? I just don’t know… I’m kind of messed up right now with everything that happened. I’ve started having these horrible thoughts again. My brain keeps telling me I don’t deserve to be alive, that I’m actually the cause of all this just because I was born. Does that make any sense? So, how to you separate yourself from a person like this? How can you stop the manipulation that goes into thinking you are at fault for their actions? How do you stop the emotional abuse when there doesn’t seem to be any solution to it? Cutting ties just doesn’t seem to work, although I told him I don’t want to speak to him anymore, in a diplomatic way, but still, I told him… And apparently it doesn’t work. Be it mail, be it a text or through other people, he finds a way to enter my life over and over again, sometimes only to make me feel bad because I want to put an end to all of this.

    Well… I ended up writing more than I intended, but how could I say all that in a shorter version? I hope you will forgive me for such a long post… But your advices or opinions will be gratefully appreciated. Thank you!

    #274881
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Alexa:

    Welcome to the Forums, I am glad you posted here.

    A young child is not able to evaluate a parent as honest or dishonest, trustworthy or not, and then figure out what to believe of what he says, and what not to believe. A young child  believes everything a parent says.

    Your father told you early on that you are this thing that inconvenienced him, made him marry your mother, something he didn’t want to do, caused him to suffer being married to her, having fights over cheating that wouldn’t happen if he wasn’t married to her, a marriage that happened because of you.

    A child believes everything she is told, but when what she is told is not true to reality, it causes distress. So you believed and suffered for it.

    As an adult, your rational understanding says: what he said doesn’t make any sense, I didn’t cause any of these things to happen… but the child in you still believes what he says. The fact that you have so much evidence by this point that he lies on a regular basis does not change the fact that the little girl in you still sees him as a god, as all children do. She looks up to her father as all-powerful, all-knowing, all-good.

    As a child you didn’t have anyone to hold on to, your mother sent you to her parents, then got you back, then to her parents again. She blamed you too for inconveniencing her.

    What does a child do? A child has to hold on to something, to someone. So she holds on to  the parent that seems powerful, more powerful than the other, and that is your father. He is her hope.

    Or is she afraid of him?

    anita

    #274987
    Inky
    Participant

    Hi Alexa,

    It sounds like your father has a narcissistic personality disorder (NPD). Let me tell you, for all the times that they make you feel bad for daring to breathe on their planet, what they fear most is DYING ALONE. He pushes you away because it’s all about him. But then he all but hires a private investigator to track you down.

    No wonder you are afraid of people. (He’s a person, even if he is a doozy!) If I were you I’d be cloistered in a room too, rocking!

    I know this is SO HARD. What I want you to do is not tell anyone in your family where you are living (the next time you move) or where you are (a home away from home??). He finds out through them!! You know he does! Get rid of email too! Maybe wait until your grandmother dies. But definitely take a ten year break from freaking EVERYONE. He is that bad.

    What I want you to do is look in the mirror and proclaim, “I EXIST!”

    I also want you to repeat what Simba said to Scar: “Everything you ever told me was a lie.” 

    Even though he is your father, every bad thing and experience he said to you and gave you was a lie. It helps if you believe he was demon possessed and that you will meet your REAL father in heaven when the demon leaves him. Medieval thinking, but it worked for me!

    Best,

    Inky

     

    #276795
    Alexa
    Participant

    Thank you Anita and Inky for your responses and I am sorry to also respond so late. I took a break from things in the last few days because everything is so overwhelming for me right now. I have to put up this facade that I am okay because people around me don’t actually understand the problems I have with my father. Most of them, when I tell them I decided to put an end to anything that has to do with my father, their first reaction is “You can’t do that. He’s your father. Be upset, but you can’t just cut him out from your life. Try to make thing right.” And this feels like a deep cut right through my sanity. Because all these people tell me it’s wrong what I do, than there’s all the emotions and thoughts that come from what my father said and did… I decided. I don’t want to talk to him or see him, but I have these moments, especially when I wake up, when I feel so guilty. My mind has this idea that it’s my fault and I can’t get rid of it.

    Anita, as a child I believe I did have that image of him, although now I know I shouldn’t have. But with time this image faded and all that was left was this monstrous thing that I don’t know how to face (is it okay to call it that?). Or maybe I can choose not to face it and just move on. I know that’s what I want. I always gave him chances after chances. I always told myself “this is the last time I will ever give him a chance”, but soon after I ended up doing the same once he would also commit the same mistakes or having the same attitude and behaviour towards me.  My mom is nowhere perfect. She did what she did in those circumstances. Sometimes I blame her, but then I try to wake up from that and try not too because I know her situation wasn’t the best either. She was lied and cheated, she was young and she had a child she didn’t know how to raise because she had no money, no home, no food on the table. I also am now conscious that as a mother she could have done more. Like get a job. But my father, from what I know, had a big influence over her too. Because of him she also probably became something she didn’t want. I remember her crying almost every night (we were sleeping in the same room). She would turn her back at me and just cry until she fell asleep. Because of that I made the decision to never show how much all of that hurts me, so I usually cried when no one was around or I would pretend that I’m going to the bathroom, cry for a few minutes in there, wash my face afterwards and put up a mask once I came out of the bathroom. But all that, suppressing my feelings so much, turned into anger and frustration over time. I became an over the top shy child with anger issues because I could never really tell someone what was going on with me. I couldn’t speak to my mother or with anyone else. My father always yelled at me or ignored me completely. And there is so much hurt behind everything he did and said since I can remember.

    I actually think I developed agoraphobia since that time because it was very difficult for me to go outside. My mother used to basically drag me out. I just felt anxious and afraid to go out by myself or with anyone. I didn’t know back than what those feelings where, but I know now. I’ve started being suicidal since I was 13. My mother only found out when I was 20. I believe she chose to ignore the signs because even after she found out and everything became even more serious, she didn’t seem to care much. She left me all alone, with no one to care for me when I was unable to. At some point in my teen years I realised I needed help when I cut myself too deep and I was so afraid of being lonely that I got into a relationship I didn’t wanted (my mother left me by myself when I was in the 11th grade and moved into another city). That relationship was what I hold on to because I had no one else. It was a hard time for myself because over time, that relationship also became toxic. I think that’s when things got worse for me and because once I got into college my father was a constant in my life that just turned everything upside down even more and that’s when things got from bad to worse to madness.

    Inky, your response was an eye opener for me. Believe it or not, the Universe somehow showed this to me today. I was on the internet looking for some information and from one to another, I found a blog post about narcissistic fathers. I read it and all morning I read about it this topic because it felt so true to me. Everything I could found on the internet about this was the precise description of my father. I even told about it to my husband because that’s how exact everything was. Then I logged in here and saw your response and I was like “I’m not the only one seeing this. I’m not imagining this only to make myself feeling better.” So I thank you for that and I am grateful for you, and Anita, taking the time to give me an answer. Because it actually made me have a little confidence in me and in my decision.

    I try to stay away from any relatives, but is hard. Especially with my grandmother, because I don’t want to make her suffer. I called her yesterday and I didn’t finished my conversation with her that my father’s sister was already on the phone asking me all kinds of questions about my personal life. And that wasn’t actually something I wanted to talk to her because she’s gossipy and she’s more similar to my father than I would like to admit. I don’t want to make my grandmother suffer because of all these issues I have with my father. She’s a kind person. She took care of me (and my grandfather) when no one did. They gave me more than my parents did. If it wouldn’t have been for them, I would have never learned what kindness is or what being genuinely good as a person means. My heart just can’t do that do her and I know that by doing this, my father probably will try a lot of things, but I try keeping this as “safe” as possible. For example, I changed my phone number last week and I decided not to give that phone number to anyone else except just a few persons I know he can’t find it out from. In a few months me and my husband will move from where we currently live and hopefully he will not find out where we will live (at the moment we can’t move). I just hope he will stay away this time.

    Thank you once again.

    All the best,

    Alexa

    #276849
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Alexa:

    You are welcome and no worries about taking your time to  post again. You determine when and if you post, no time limits here.

    People say these things, “You can’t do that (end contact with a parent). He’s your father. Be upset, but you can’t just cut him out from your life. Try to make things right”-

    People say those things because this is what they do in their personal lives and this is why millions of people are anxious and depressed on an ongoing basis, living dysfunctional lives.

    We are told to respect our parents  in the bible, and we hear other people say it, especially abusive parents. So we obey and suffer for it.

    It is okay for you to cut all contact with your father. It is okay legally and ethically. I did it myself, eventually. I ended all contact with my mother. I suffered guilt, it was difficult, but necessary for my well-being. I just wished I did it earlier, much earlier.

    I first dreamed of doing it when I was a teenager, then sent her a letter declaring (oh so gently and apologetically) temporary no-contact when I was 30. The letter was ignored. Twenty years later I finally did it. If I did it earlier I would have wasted less life and I wouldn’t have had my life quality deteriorate in decades of dysfunction that was born  out of this most sick and sickening relationship I had with her.

    I hope you don’t wait for as long as I did. The time  to cut your father out  of your life was long ago. Next best timing is ASAP.

    If cutting contact with your grandmother is necessary for the purpose of cutting contact with your father, do so. Save yourself, save what is left of your life, is my advice. Do what needs to be done for that purpose.

    anita

    #276923
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Hi Alexa,

    Just reading through your posts now and my conclusion is to cut ties with your dad if he continues to behave so abominably. He sounds like a very bitter man who was obviously totally immature when you were born and has taken out all his frustrations of becoming a parent, when he didn’t want to, on you. It’s easy for people who have never experienced anything like what you have to urge you not to cut ties with your dad because he’s your father, for better or for worse. That is no excuse to continue to have a relationship with someone who has treated you with total contempt all your life.

    My wife was in a similar boat with her mum – from an early age her mum would tell her how useless my wife was and was verbally and physically abusive to her throughout her childhood and adolescence, even leaving her sleeping in a urine-stained bed for days or weeks at a time. She definitely fell into the category of ‘narcissistic’ mother and she was regularly comparing my wife to my wife’s sister and younger brother, the ‘golden kids’ in the family who went on to high-flying jobs. My wife took on a fairly respectable career herself but this was never good enough for her mum. On top of her mum’s disrespectful behaviour, the aforementioned ‘golden kids’ have treated my wife with total contempt since she confronted her mum about her abuse. Needless to say, this has had a profound, life-long effect on my wife’s self-esteem and she considered suicide on a couple of occasions. Being fortunate enough to come from a decent family myself, my initial reaction to my wife’s consideration to cut her family out of her life was similar to those people who advised you not to cut ties with your dad, but since I have found out more about what my wife has been through with these truly despicable people I completely understand why she would not want to have anything more to do with them, blood or no blood. She, like you, was convinced for a long time that she deserved the abuse by her mum and has gone through those guilty feelings of cutting ties with family but since she has started to have less and less time with them she has become a much happier person.

    Alexa, you come across as a good, decent person and you deserve so much better in life. So, it is time now for you to move on with your husband and start LIVING your own life. You are not responsible for your dad’s, or your mum’s behaviour, and you have given them more than enough chances. Time to focus on yourself and building up your own happiness (and steer clear of all toxic people – only hang out with people who respect you). Also, if it’s any help to you, I’d highly recommend that you check out a great site on YouTube called ‘Rising Higher Meditation’ by Jess Shepherd and the ‘I AM’ affirmations. I don’t know if you do mindfulness meditation (for me it’s been a life-saver) but for anyone suffering with low self-confidence this particular meditation is brilliant for instilling positive thoughts into your head and helping you believe more in yourself.

    Hope this helps and I wish you the very best for the future Alexa.

    All the best,

    Derek.

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