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August 29, 2016 at 1:54 pm #113650helleiaParticipant
Hi Nina Sakura. The first thing I noticed about you is your name. I remember watching Ultra Maniac back when I was a tiny kid! 🙂
I would like to know more about you too. What is the title of the post you want me to see?
August 29, 2016 at 2:04 pm #113653helleiaParticipantDear anita:
It’s quite sad to think that something that is quite “normal” and “peaceful” has been really inadequate for me. Sometimes I feel guilty that I do not appreciate what I already have. Maybe I am the type of person who sees things in a very deep way, and my family rarely filled my craving for that sort of stimulation.
Then again, I feel like it’s not just my family. It’s most people I encounter. From the school I entered since I was young, people felt shallow. I hope I am not being judgmental, but that is really how it feels.
However, I often think that if from the start, from first grade, I entered into a more competitive school with much more diversity, I might have been able to fill that gap sooner rather than later. What I noticed when I got into college was that I see people I yearn for in so many places, but I am currently only able to talk to the “regular ones” because I am shy and because those are who I am used to talking to.
The problem now has become reversed. Instead of me being on a different level from everybody, I found people who I recognize as getting along with a future me, as being the type of person who I could be.
Since I did not interact with them since the beginning, since I was young, I feel like I am very, very behind them. Like I have to “catch up” to their level. That’s what I mean by it becoming “reversed”.
August 29, 2016 at 2:15 pm #113657AnonymousGuestDear helleia:
If this is what you meant, that most people are lacking in their ability to interact lovingly and intimately with others, I agree. When you wrote that your parents were the “typical parents” and later on I wrote (in so many words) that they socially neglected you or didn’t interact with you adequately, I knew then that it is typical to neglect a child.
You wrote: “Maybe I am the type of person who sees things in a very deep way, and my family rarely filled my craving for that sort of stimulation.” It is my guess that you were not born with an abnormal need for deep interactions that a normal family could not satisfy. It is my belief that you are very likely to have been a child with normal needs and your family, your parents did not satisfy your normal needs.
Maybe you now have a need to … be different and so you present thoughts that I can’t follow, thoughts that are too difficult for me to understand, like in your last two paragraphs.
Like I wrote to you before, I believe things are much simpler than you make believe that they are. You were neglected as a child, you were not validated, taught, and loved adequately. Unfortunate but not complicated. And yes, quite typical.
anita
August 29, 2016 at 2:36 pm #113660helleiaParticipantReflecting more about what my family has done for me, no one can really tell, no outsider at the very least, that there is anything wrong with my family. They would even think that it’s one of the healthiest families they see and I’m quite lucky to be part of it.
Sure, healthy as in an absence of too much drama or issues. Socially, my siblings grew up quite normally, or at least they learned to adapt a little sooner rather than later. However, I do know that one of my sisters has also been bullied, but it had the opposite effect on her, which made her chase people. while being bullied made me withdraw into a shell, it made her keep trying to adapt herself too much to the people around her, to the point where she had become confused of her own identity. In her own words, she “got involved with the wrong crowd”.
My other sister has also had awkward tendencies, but she’s really quite the most friendly person. She has made friends with very diverse people, a lot of people from other countries and beliefs as well. She tells me she’s shy and I guess I can see that because she’s not too loud or charismatic. But she makes an effort to be friendly to people, that much I can see. Her personal drama I guess would be between her and our parents. She had been the most rebellious. She is kind of a hippie, you see, and many of her beliefs do not coincide with my parents’. However, my parents have become more open-minded (or at least more tolerating), and they never stop being loving to her. My sister just has a tendency to be impatient and quick-tempered, so that has contributed a bit to the difficulty of her relationship with our parents.
My brother, well, I don’t know much about him, because he’s the oldest and doesn’t live with us right now. From my perception, he is the most similar to my parents in terms of values I think, because he is married with two kids and works a stable job. My two sisters have been a little less consistent when it came to their jobs.
So in our house as it is right now, I live with my parents, my two sisters, three cats, and my grandmother lives in the neighboring house. The first sister I talked about is moving to her own condo soon. She’s already like… 28 though. Haha. Also she’s been with her boyfriend for years but hasn’t married yet. Maybe she doesn’t ever want to? I don’t know. I don’t really want to ask her because I’m shy. This is the sister who I said I wasn’t really close to, but at least we’ve talked and bonded a bit.
Hmm, of all the family members, you’d think I’d be satisfied with my other sister, because she seems to fit the description of being more “different” and open-minded to various other things. That’s true. Now that I think about it, I’m guessing that it’s because she is only one person, and a community of such people would be more right for me. At least a small group of friends. You can’t hang around one person all the time or else we wouldn’t be able to give each other privacy.
If she was my age, maybe I’d be more satisfied. She’s 31.
And I guess the fact that she didn’t even talk to me until I was older was… well, not that I hold any grudges or anything, but I think she was probably not the same type of person when she was younger, either.
And now I grew up in my own head and I have gone in too deep, and there are still some things about me that she can’t reach. Am I doing this to myself? Am I the one who’s making it hard for other people to reach me? It is hard for me to pretend to be otherwise. To be not who I really am.
But to have a more peaceful social life, I sure do wish I could pretend. If I have Theater lessons, I may be able to help some of my social anxiety. I met someone (briefly, don’t think I’ll ever see her again because she is not a schoolmate and it was during a workshop of some sort) that had been in Theater and I would never have guessed she was actually an introvert! She said she still has trouble expressing her ideas, but nonetheless, I wish I had what she had! She seems so friendly! But it is surprising that even the people who appear most friendly are also the most unsure of themselves inside (like she said there are many times she does not know what to say). I, on the other hand, worry about looking like a snob or a serious person.
August 29, 2016 at 2:48 pm #113661helleiaParticipantI forgot to talk about my parents. My mom seems to have an absence of hobbies or an elaborate personality. I hope it doesn’t sound like I’m demeaning her. We often joke that about her, actually. I tease her when she keeps playing 2048 on my iPad. I’ve seen her read books sometimes, but the last time she did was because I forced her.
I guess we’re quite close because I can do this to her. I love to hug her, but not so much talking. I ask her about her favorite music and she doesn’t have much to say. She cooks but that’s because it’s a necessary thing to do everyday, but at least she tries new recipes from time to time. She doesn’t reallt see it as her expertise or anything. She’s retired now but used to work in a bank. None of my siblings like corporate/financial stuff that much, besides, it’s not really a good conversation topic.
I also rarely see her go out with friends. Occassionally, perhaps.
My dad is interested in Jazz, running, movies (although my interest in film as an artistic medium is quite different from his entertainment-orientation), drinking (no worries, there is no alcohol abuse in my family. It’s just that my dad’s side of the family likes social drinking), and he seems to have made a lot of friends with my 31 year old sister’s friends. Nice, huh?
However, I am not close to him. I do not like him that much because sometimes he has a temper. He makes fun of me sometimes (but he thinks he’s just trying to bond with me). It’s not his fault. He’s not trying to hurt anyone. I just don’t really “vibe” with him, that’s all. I’m not scared of him but he kind of annoys me and I don’t want to talk to him all that much.
He seems to be an ambivert. He has social anxieties as well, although in different situations from mine. Likewise, my mom doesn’t have a lot to teach me regarding socializing, considering her personality. She is good at mediating between arguments, though. If my dad gets a temper in any way, she does not fight back, which helps dissipate anyone’s temper, of course. But she doesn’t “intervene” when maybe it might be more necessary too. It should always be a balance, of course.
- This reply was modified 8 years, 2 months ago by helleia.
August 29, 2016 at 3:00 pm #113664AnonymousGuestDear helleia:
Tell me about your father’s temper. How often does he get angry and what does he say to your mother/ to you when he is angry?
When you wrote last that your mother doesn’t “intervene” when he gets angry, what do you mean? Do you mean that she doesn’t protect one of her daughters when he is angry at one of you?
And when you wrote she doesn’t fight back when he is angry, how does he fight?
anita
August 29, 2016 at 3:06 pm #113665helleiaParticipantDear anita,
You said: “It is my guess that you were not born with an abnormal need for deep interactions that a normal family could not satisfy. It is my belief that you are very likely to have been a child with normal needs and your family, your parents did not satisfy your normal needs.”
Possibly. But I am not sure. There are so many factors that could have made things happen. I don’t think I can blame most of everything on my family. My siblings have turned out more socially adapted. They have their own problems, and their problems are simply different from mine, that much I can say. So in that sense, why did I have the problems that I had, and my siblings did not have the same problem?
In terms of what I know from family history, my parents did not change very much. Maybe they worked more, perhaps, and got older and more tired when they get home. But that would be speculating.
Maybe it’s just the age gap. They’re now in their 60’s. I just turned 20. Perhaps, the larger the age gap, the less there is to talk about. If you noticed when I talked about my siblings, my brother, who’s 37, became most similar to my parents in terms of life direction (he has his own interests and hobbies of course that are different from my parents).
It might also be because my dad would have more to talk about with my brother, compared to us daughters. My mom seems to be just there to care, not really to talk.
You also said: “Maybe you now have a need to … be different and so you present thoughts that I can’t follow, thoughts that are too difficult for me to understand, like in your last two paragraphs.”
I’m sorry about that. Haha. I’ll try to explain. I just mean that in my old social context, my old school, there was less diversity, and I did not really see any people that I feel “drawn” to. That doesn’t mean I wasn’t interested in becoming friends with them. But I had more insecurities back then, and I wasn’t really sure I can relate to them. In my current social context, that is, college, I start to see more people who I really, really wish I could get along with, but now realize how inferior I feel in comparison to them. I have not been blessed with like-minded friends when I was younger, so now there really is a GAP in our mental developments. It’s like I see these people (the ones I yearn for) as being like me, however, being a more “mature version” of me. But since I have not matured in this age yet, I am very, very nervous when I try to talk to them. So it’s sad because social isolation in the past begets more social isolation in the future. It’s a spiral effect. Unless, of course, I work hard to break the pattern. Definitely, some patterns have already been broken. I just have to keep at it.
August 29, 2016 at 3:16 pm #113667helleiaParticipantDear anita:
My dad usually get’s tempered when there’s traffic. He also tends to get angry if he perceives that someone is being disrespectful to him. Like for example, my 31 year old sister. She also has a quick temper. So I’m really used to it when sometimes she sounds a little mad at me, although she doesn’t actually do it on purpose. I just get annoyed because I don’t think the tone of her voice is very nice. She makes it sound like she’s annoyed with me, or something. Anyway, I am kind of like my mom. I neutralize it because I do not react to these sorts of things.
Anyway, because my sister has that tendency, two quick-tempers can clash. Sometimes it can be about trivial things. The most recent one I’ve witnessed is my dad getting angry because he perceived my sister’s “disrespectful” tone of voice. He would say things like “don’t talk to me like that, I’m your father.” even though I know that it’s just my sister’s habit and she’s not really saying insults. It’s just the way she speaks sometimes. Basically they both get madder and madder, and my mom does tell them to stop. She does it gently.
So far, you see, it’s only verbal. There is no physical tendencies. This is very good.
I only mean that my mom doesn’t “intervene” in terms of life advice. I feel very lost in life sometimes and she doesn’t really guide me that much in terms of the adult life. Of course she answers my questions when I ask, but I don’t even know what types of questions to ask sometimes. Of course, she tries to help, but I would have appreciated if she was actually a little more nosy into my business or something. Like, if she had more OPINIONS about things. (Hope that doesn’t sound too demeaning…)
I also mean she doesn’t “intervene” in my basic growing up. She thinks I can learn most things on my own. I guess that’s because that’s also how she grew up, but I’m not sure. It really, REALLY, could be just her personality.
So in terms of socializing, yeah, they didn’t teach me what I needed to know. I mean, the times have changed, so perhaps the context for socializing has also changed.
What I hate about my old school is that people have divided themselves on a social hierarchy. It’s so similar in many schools nowadays, of course. The popular ones, the cool ones, the okay ones, the outcasts. I don’t know how more common it is now than before. You do know the millenial generation has become quite narcissistic (I hope this sentence doesn’t offend anyone. Of course I am not trying to generalize it to ALL millenial kids).
- This reply was modified 8 years, 2 months ago by helleia.
August 29, 2016 at 3:23 pm #113669helleiaParticipantYou know how some parents automatically enrol their children in workshops and summer classes?
I WISH my parents did that for me or at least encouraged me, from a young age.
They definitely let me do things, if I ask. But I have to be the one to ask. I had to be the one to find things that were right for me. They didn’t give me much of a “taste” of diverse things, at least.
I did mention about theater, for example, but that would be nice if I was younger. Because I am so busy right now and my parents being retired, I am concerned about asking too much from them (Workshops are expensive).
- This reply was modified 8 years, 2 months ago by helleia.
August 29, 2016 at 3:31 pm #113671AnonymousGuestDear helleia:
You wrote: “why did I have the problems that I had, and my siblings did not have the same problem?”
It is a misconception that I myself had, that siblings are supposed to be similar because they had the same parents. It is often the opposite that is true: siblings taking opposite roles, or niches/ places in the family. When one sibling took possession, so to speak, of the responsible role, the other sibling takes possession of the role that is available, that has not been taken yet, and that would be the irresponsible role.
There is also the different environments within the family, as you pointed out, that exist for different siblings, from the age and circumstances of the parents at different time of their lives to how many siblings exist when the new child is born.
But to expect siblings to be similar because they have the same parents is simply not true to reality.
In your second post you wrote about your mother: “I also mean she doesn’t ‘intervene’ in my basic growing up. She thinks I can learn most things on my own. I guess that’s because that’s also how she grew up…” Well, her parents didn’t intervene or attend, interact, validate, ask questions of her etc. and she grew up to become a woman of no opinions, as you wrote, or very few. Every child needs attention, interaction, validation etc. and if the child doesn’t get it, there will be lack in adulthood.
The lack, or something missing in your person and life that you expressed is a consequence of this lack of much-needed attention from a parent.
This is why I suggested that indeed, quality interactions now will help you become more of a .. rounded person, more whole.
anita
August 29, 2016 at 8:33 pm #113693Nina SakuraParticipantHey Helleia,
You’re spot on – That was one of my favorite anime growing up 😀 I am more like Ayu though by nature 😛 This is my thread basically –
Do check it out when you get time 🙂
Regards,
NinaSeptember 10, 2016 at 9:56 pm #114904helleiaParticipantDear anita,
I was randomly browsing the forums, and I tend to notice a common theme in some of your posts. You seem to know a lot about dissociation. One of your posts reminded me of something you may or may not have also told me. And I am just reflecting right now and wondering whether the same could be applied to me. Was I ever a dissociating person? I am not sure. I can say that after being bullied and isolating myself, I have spent my time on mind numbing activities such as games and the internet. However, I wouldn’t say that everything was completely mind numbing, as I still feel like I feel life deeply, and I tend to yearn for things which I know exist in this world. I appreciate a lot of things, but I guess there are still things which I don’t appreciate fully, such as certain types of people, because on the inside I tend to judge that they, although attractive and admirable to me, are not understanding of people like me or wouldn’t be pleasant to hang around and would mostly just cause me anxiety.
September 11, 2016 at 8:22 am #114920AnonymousGuestDear helleia:
I didn’t understand your last post addressed to me, the one right above: is there a question there? Let me know.
anita
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