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- This topic has 1,633 replies, 6 voices, and was last updated 5 years, 5 months ago by Cali Chica.
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April 17, 2019 at 7:56 am #289431Cali ChicaParticipant
Dear Anita,
It sure was. In fact, some of which I only realized during our recent exercise. Here are some of the things I observed during this exercise (in addition to all that I have written recently)
- my mother’s voice to me in private, the true mother-daughter talk is forgotten. because it was not important. it was not important to her to speak to me, her daughter in a certain way – in order for my development to be appropriate or positive.
- all of the mother-daughter talk that is remembered is her talking AT me, about life, and tragedy, and woe is me, and “lessons” about the bad world, and what I should and should not do.
- I see now, as an adult, that the talk between an adult and child also “should” include aspects of self development, and identity development. or if not promoting that out right – at least not inhibiting it.
- her voice to the public about me was not congruent with her voice to me
- in fact she was unpredictable all around – and so this not develop trust in a child, and it surely does not build..self trust
April 17, 2019 at 8:47 am #289435AnonymousGuestDear Cali Chica:
“the true mother-daughter talk… it was not important to her to speak to me, her daughter in a certain way- ..for my development to be appropriate or positive… all of the ..talk .. is her talking AT me, about life, and tragedy, and woe is me… her voice to the public about me was not congruent with her voice to me”-
– I don’t think that in her mind there was a mother-daughter, a wife- husband, a __- ___. Everyone, in her mind was people, and people inconvenienced her. In her mind there was chatter, some of it was her imagining that others were criticizing her. For example, when she was speaking to a man in the closet, not wanting your sister to hear what she was saying, and then get so angry at your sister, exclaiming she doesn’t have privacy in her own home, the chatter in her brain was something like: this people (your sister) is thinking I shouldn’t be talking to a man, she is thinking that, or about to think that, so I will hide… oh, she caught it, god d*&**, I have no privacy in my own home!
She got so angry at not being able to hide from the criticism she imagined on the part of your sister that she kicked her out of the house. She kicked her own critical voice out of the house.
Whenever she felt challenged, that is her self critical voice being activated (ex., you telling her that other mothers don’t over-react like her and when in Peru, you told her something to the effect of her overreacting regarding there being less oxygen in high elevation) she called your father to.. protect her from her daughters, that is, she called him to kick out that critical voice in her brain.
And then, often enough, she voiced her mind chatter, her rationalizing, making believe things that made it easier to go through the day, like she being strong for being a housewife, not working outside the home, or your sister being “hot” and you, not so.. or whatever BS crossed her brain at this moment or the next.
There was no mother/ daughter, there was she and people, one batch of people, a sticky substance, aka people who happened to be there, usually an inconvenience.
anita
April 17, 2019 at 9:52 am #289449Cali ChicaParticipantdear Anita,
How well put, this is exactly what it is.
She wanted to escape from this self-critical voice. If she saw it in others, her own self critical voice, her own reality, she would want to push those people far away. She could not handle the “truth” – truth being the self-critical voice.
She did make up things in order to sooth herself, convince herself things to drown out the self critical voice. She then fed my sister and I these “values” these made up delusions.
So as an adult, I navigate this world with these delusions. Unlike her, I am functional, and I don’t consistently run away from self criticism — but on the contrary living a life of delusion. Not knowing the true definition, of love, support, morality, or meaning of life. Not knowing the true definition of what it is to be a good person, partner, and content human being.
Her abuse in many parts was this pushing away of this self-criticism. But as a result she also changed the idea of what my sister and I thought was right and wrong. It became normal to approach life in this way, and not face issues with any sort of coping. It became normal to live in fear, and believe anything and everything – as we were taught only lies to begin with.
April 17, 2019 at 9:58 am #289453AnonymousGuestDear Cali Chica:
When she told you that you were most special, was that a lie, on her part?
anita
April 17, 2019 at 10:46 am #289463Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Yes it was. It wasn’t a lie because I am not special. It was a lie because she did not mean it.
She spewed out words that were convenient to her at the time, to decrease her suffering, to escape from the critical voice as you say.
If I say to my sister for example, make more friends, mom is right – at this age you should be out socializing more
my mom may then say, look how mature and wise you are daughter
if as a kid I say to mom, god that friend is so annoying and jealous of us, we shouldn’t talk to her..
my mom might say, look how astute you are in seeing this, see how smart!
she may say anything – but if it fits the “non-critical” agenda in her head – yes
the moment it doesn’t — I am garbage, I am nothing
April 17, 2019 at 11:17 am #289465AnonymousGuestDear Cali Chica:
I believed I had the answer when I asked you the question, didn’t want to offer it to you before you answered. And your answer is my own: “Yes it was. It wasn’t a lie because I am not special. It was a lie because she did not mean it”.
You weren’t special to her.
It was mind boggling to me when I realized that I wasn’t special to my mother.
I don’t think it is possible to mentally separate from one’s mother if we believe we lose our only concept of being special (valuable, that is) when separating from her. It is important to have an idea that we are special even though we weren’t special in her mind-and-heart.
If you didn’t agree with your mother, you were “garbage… nothing”. As children we will hold on to any special feeling (a result of her saying you are special when you agreed with her), even though we know there is something terribly wrong, but if this is the only special feeling, however conflicted we feel, we’ll hang on to it.
anita
April 17, 2019 at 2:14 pm #289485Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita great points, I think of this in my own words as having an identity, the identity for me was given by my mother. As much as I am very proud of a lot of it, I don’t realize what parts I just took on as my own without thinking and what parts I actually chose. I will think about this tonight as homework
April 17, 2019 at 7:19 pm #289517AnonymousGuestDear Cali Chica:
Looking forward to read your next post!
anita
April 19, 2019 at 7:04 am #289731Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
What I thought about today, was the concept of saying I don’t know.
See Super Cali Chica always needs to have an answer – a decision, something to DO, something to find out, a way to go.
But I am noticing that so often the answer is – to not know. Or at least for now.
The concept of I don’t have an answer, and that’s okay – to say I don’t know – and that’s it.
To sit with that, to maybe perhaps know the answer in the future, or let it come in time – let it be
i don’t control everything, and so therefore, jumping to an answer is a delusion, an illusion that I can do something to change everything and fix everything.
to sit back and say I don’t know – I feel I can do that better now, and I will continue to this weekend.
April 19, 2019 at 7:15 am #289733AnonymousGuestDear Cali Chica:
This humility, being okay with not knowing, with not controlling everything, “change everything and fix everything”, this humility is healthy for you. I suppose it is peeling off the “super” from SCC. S can stand for Special. No longer Super, superior.
anita
April 19, 2019 at 7:31 am #289737Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Super is replaced with Special. I like that
I am thinking a lot about what Super means
Super seemingly means great! trying, ambitious, willing
But today, nowadays, super doesn’t sound so super at all
it sounds exhausting, and frankly a little foolish
I visualize a person running around circles, and getting no where – aimless, trying, seeking, but why?
no real answer as to why…it does take wisdom and humility to not now, and be able to sit with that…
April 19, 2019 at 7:47 am #289741AnonymousGuestDear Cali Chica:
“nowadays, super doesn’t sound so super at all- it sounds exhausting, and frankly a little foolish– aimless, trying, seeking, but why?”
The way you put it brought a smile to my face, should be in that book you will write one day, so well written!
What comes to my mind as to the why of your trying, seeking is that it is running away from something, not running toward something, so it is not seeking out there as much as it is not seeing what is here.
That is, the sadness, the despair, the hurt, the anger, not wanting to feel what we don’t want to feel.
anita
April 19, 2019 at 9:00 am #289755Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Thank you for explaining this well, we have touched on it before.
The seeking is running away…
running away from discomfort, distress..yes it is.
April 19, 2019 at 9:25 am #289763AnonymousGuestDear Cali Chica:
This kind of work does take going back again and again to things touched on before, retouching and then again. Adding something to what we knew before, gaining a new kind of knowing on top of the older knowing.
anita
April 19, 2019 at 9:31 am #289765Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I absolutely agree, it feels very good to go back to a point that was touched on before, and that made sense but in a superficial sense. As in, it made sense in “theory” but did not sink and savor.
Now, I feel that it makes much more sense.
Seeking feels like doing and being productive, but in fact it is running away – it is an escape a solace
But here’s the thing, this isn’t a restorative escape, because this “escape” involves doing.
What would be in fact a true solace is to allow myself to disengage, and wind down – to press the snooze button (so to speak)
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