How can I let go without feeling guilty?

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August 15, 2017 at 7:30 am #164020
Mary899
Participant
Hi, and thank you in advance for reading this.

I’ve just finished my third year of college. Being someone who was raised in a small city and then moved to the capital of the country, right at the start I made friends with a girl who appeared to share most of my cultural values. However, after a few weeks I realized we could never become close friends. I was emotional and self-doubting, while she was critical and self righteous. She said she couldn’t understand why I missed my home city, and I had this feeling that she, although secretly, holds my emotions in contempt. Most of our conversations were one sided with me doing the majority of the listening. Either she was talking about the latest scientific show that she had watched, or was busy judging others, saying how they (I, too, was included) were doing things in a wrong, unintelligent way, offering unsolicited advice. Also, she was my academic “rival”. I have always been at the top of my class, and although I do care about my grades, I have always valued learning and pure knowledge above other things. Therefore, her constant checking on my grades and nagging about how unfair the professor had treated her if she had gotten anything less than me had become rather annoying. She had great confidence in her work, believing that because she was making the maximum effort she deserved the best results. I, on the other hand, look upon my studies as a source of pleasure as well as fulfillment, and although I do get tired at times, I try not to study merely in order to get As (ironically I’ve always been a straight A student till this day) or to impress others by my knowledge. Besides, although I try to put my best into everything, I know that there are always some areas that I could still work on, and therefore am not that much disappointed if the results (e.g. grades) are not as great as I want them to be, an attitude which my friend, supposedly, could not agree with.
During the three years of college people kept asking me questions such as: “How can you tolerate staying in a friendship with X?” My usual response was that she had her own good qualities…and she did. Mostly she was generous and she was, to some extent, willing to help others. There were times in which I thought although she often seemed extremely judgmental and critical of others, always talking about facts and always having too much confidence in herself, she did actually have a kind heart underneath. However, I still don’t recall a single time in which I totally felt comfortable in her presence, and I always felt ashamed of myself because of that. I kept reminding myself of her good qualities, telling myself that I should be more accepting and less sensitive to her behavior.
It was in the previous semester that everything was turned upside down. My other “friend”(later I realized she was a narcissist), who had initially rejected her, making it obvious that she didn’t like her, started to let her into our circle. I still haven’t figured out the reason, but the moment that she entered the group she grew to become extremely mean to me. She kept making fun of me in front of others, making some “jokes” which hurt me greatly at the moment. I never laughed at her jokes…I even looked into her eyes with a frown to let her know that what she said had hurt me. I don’t think she ever got the clue, however. She also belittled my future goals and dreams, saying, for example, that deciding to continue my studies in the field of literature meant that I had to find a rich guy to marry so that I wouldn’t end up poor in the future, and not even in a joking tone. Nevertheless, I again told myself that I should be more forgiving and less sesitive. Everybody kept saying how mean she was towards me…saying they had made friends with her because of me and now she was treating me like this. The first few times I said it was ok, believing that she actually didn’t mean what she said. However, as time passed and her behavior didn’t improve, I finally gave in and confessed that yes, I WAS irritated. We went on a trip together, and she proved to be even more inconsiderate than I thought she was. When we confronted her (a rare thing for me to do) she refused to accept her wrongdoings, making invalid excuses, as always. I had already had enough. However, as my other “friends” seemed to move on I did my best to do so as well.
A couple of weeks later the plan for another trip came up. My narcissistic friend called me, and we talked about whether we actually wanted her to come with us. She kept pointing out everything about her that irritated me the most, and I, finally taking her bait, said (although half jokingly) that if she’s gonna be there I’m not going on the trip. She laughed.

The day after I became regretful about what I had said, and went up to my friend and said whether she wanted to go with us on that trip or not. She said no. My narcissistic friend kept gossiping about her, calling her stupid, ugly, selfish, and lots of other things. She also asked me why I was still nice to her. At the same time, the friend texted me, asking me how come the narcissist had the audacity to remove her from the circle on behalf of everyone. I said it seemed as if she (the friend) wanted to be alone, and she said the reason is that she had seen certain behaviors that were not appropriate in a true friendship. I said I hope things would work out.

A couple of weeks passed. The narcissist, who had previously put me on the pedestal, got into a fight with me for the nth time, said she’s gonna “take revenge” and reveal to everybody what a huge hypocrite I am. Her first step was to go to the friend, making amends with her, and then tell her it was all about me and I was the one who had all the problems with her, not her, probably quoting the negative remarks “I” had made about her (which she remembered with great precision). I don’t know what she had exactly said to her, but whatever it was, it was enough for her not talking to me after that. Also the friend has said to the narcissist that I have said I hope her problem with the narcissist would get solved (I didn’t, I just said I hopedidn’t things would work out.). Itexted her, telling her that we’ve been friends for 3 years and I know that she won’t make wrong judgements, saying the narcissist and her gang are trying to destroy me, that I don’t want her to become upset with me because of her exaggerations. She didn’t reply. I agree that I was a bit desperate.

Now I don’t know what I should do. As we are classmates I have to see the narcissist, her gang, and the friend on a daily basis. I know that probably my worst mistake has been having poor boundaries with the narcissist. I have no intention of getting close to the narcissist again, but the friend…as I said I never felt totally comfortable in her presence…I never trusted her with my secrets or emotions as I knew she’d be way too critical…however, I never wanted things to end this way. I’ve got mixed feelings about the situation. Sometime I grow angry with the way she treated me in order to, supposedly, appear “cool” in the narcissist’s eye and also the way she kept bothering me about getting lower grades than me…other times, I think about apologizing to her as, after all, there is a little bit of truth in what the narcissist had said to her. What I know, however selfish it seems, is that deep in my heart I never valued her friendship as much as my other ones, the ones that actually made me feel loved and appreciated for who I was. Thinking about this makes me impatient with myself, as I tried my best to love her for who she is, but failed apparently.

What do you think is the best policy? I’ve grown tired of apologizing, of always being the scapegoat. At the same time, the thought of I actually DID sth wrong with regards to her bothers me. Maybe I WAS too sensitive after all…

How can I make peace with myself? To what extent has it been my fault?
- This topic was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Mary899.
August 15, 2017 at 1:17 pm #164128

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Mary899:

You asked: “To what extent has it been my fault?”

I see a fault in your thinking. You wrote regarding the first friend: “I still don’t recall a single time in which I totally felt comfortable in her presence, and I always felt ashamed of myself because of that. I kept reminding myself of her good qualities, telling myself that I should be more accepting and less sensitive to her behavior”-

The right thinking, I believe, would have been:

There is nothing wrong or shameful about my feeling of discomfort around this person. There is a valid reason and a message behind my feeling, and the message is that I should stay away from her.

Regarding the second friend you wrote: “I again told myself that I should be more forgiving and less sensitive”- again, faulty thinking, I believe. The correct thinking would have been:

Regarding forgiving: I should not tolerate disrespectful/ abusive behavior. I can forgive a person for such after protecting myself from that person, after no longer exposing myself to her, not before.

Regarding sensitivity: I am sensitive and it is a good thing because I can sense who I should associate with, befriend, and who I should not. Being sensitive protects me this way, leads me to make wiser friendship choices.

anita

August 15, 2017 at 10:32 pm #164178
Mary899
Participant
Dear Anita,

You don’t know what a great burden was gotten off my chest when I read your reply, so thank you 🙂

Actually, both of the quotes that you mentioned in your reply refer to the same person. I read my post again and I realized in some places it was hard to keep track of who I was talking about. Sorry for that.

So you believe distancing myself from her would have been the best option from your objecting point of view…how I wish I had started this post much earlier!

But what about the things that the narcissist has said to her about me? After making a failed attempt to clear the air (as I said she didn’t reply) I’ve decided to let things go, to keep my distance, and to let her believe whatever she wants to believe, such as I was the (only) one who had problems with her all along way. Do you think it’s a wise decision?

The thing is I am ok with apologizing for what I have said to the Narcissist with regards to her. I don’t remember all my words, but I know they were mainly about how her behavior had hurt me. I also don’t know to what level the N has exaggerated what I had actually said. However, I don’t think apologizing is going to be of any use, and I don’t know if it is a good idea or not in the first place. Is it?

Thank you again.

Love,

Mary
- This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Mary899.
August 16, 2017 at 10:32 am #164246

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Mary:

You are welcome.

You wrote: “But what about the things that the narcissist has said to her about me? After making a failed attempt to clear the air (as I said she didn’t reply) I’ve decided to let things go”- I don’t see any other option. You tried to clear the air, no reply. So what can you do but let things go.

I agree: “let her believe whatever she wants to believe”- if it suits her to believe what she believes, she will continue to believe it. There is very little, if anything, that you can do to change what people believe. We have to find a way to live with the fact that some people believe what is not true, or what doesn’t suit us.

You wrote: “The thing is I am ok with apologizing for what I have said to the Narcissist with regards to her”- only if you said or did something you believe is wrong. And then, keep your distance, as big a distance as possible. Learn from this experience so to prevent problems like this in the future.

anita

August 16, 2017 at 11:56 am #164284
Mary899
Participant
Dear Anita,
You say I should only apologize if I believe what I said or did is wrong. The truth is that, with regards to this situation, I no longer know what is right or wrong anymore. Is telling somebody that you’re hurt by someone else’s behavior “wrong”? Was it wrong of me when I said “if she’s going to be on the trip, I’m not going.”? The thing is I didn’t even remember having said such a thing until the Narcissist brought it up, saying that she’s gonna let her know what I’d been saying behind her back. I said to N I didn’t actually mean it, that I felt regretful after having said that and that is why I later asked her (the friend) if she wanted to go with us on that trip. However, the N had already made her decision to “take revenge”, saying: “Why do I always have to appear to be the bad guy, and you the innocent angelic one? I’m gonna let everyone know what a huge hypocrite you are.”
I’ve tried to write everything as clearly as possible. Generally, I don’t consider myself to be a hypocrite…however, sometimes I think maybe there is some truth in what the N says. What do you think, Anita? I actually need an objective point of view to see things clearly.

Mary
- This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Mary899.
- This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Mary899.
August 16, 2017 at 5:34 pm #164310

Eliana
Participant

Hi Mary899,

You can analyze this, till you are blue in the face, but these are very toxic people. They are narcisists, gossipers, perfectionists and overachiever. They only care about themselves, and find other people They can find who are like them to “add to their clique”. They were most likely raised like this, by parents who themselves were raised to be this way. Critical, judgemental, belittling. Stay as far away from these women. Have no contact at all with them. If you see them, you can give them a brief smile, but move on your way. Don’t make small talk with them. If they want to talk to you, pretend you have a call to make it you have a cell phone with you, or tell them you have somewhere you have to be. These women are still in Junior High School mentality. You are better than this. Make friends with people who bring you sunshine, not clouds, positive people who lift you up, happy people, secure and optimistic. Stay far away from these little girls.

August 16, 2017 at 9:32 pm #164344
Mary899
Participant
Hi Eliana,

Thank you for you reply.

Oh well. If only turning “blue in the face” was the only side effect. For an entire month I couldn’t eat, sleep or basically enjoy life the way I used to. I had to seek therapy, and STILL I have nightmares with them in it. People say I’m making a mountain out of a molehill…I don’t know. All I know is that it hurts. Badly.

These women are a group of college classmates…which means that after the end of summer vacations I’ve got to see them again on a daily basis. During the summer the Narcissist made a few attempts to contact me… I didn’t reply. I had already made my decision to stay as far away from her as possible. Immediately she started slandering me and turning other people against me. Defending myself was of no use. After doing all of this, one day she texted me and said how come I no longer send her my best wishes on her birthday!

We also have a mutual friend (she’s genuinely nice and caring) who is going out of her way to restore peace. She constantly asks me to let go, think about the good moments that we had with the N, reminding me that I actually did certain wrong things which provoked her like this, finally telling me it was irrational of me to destroy “years of friendship” like this. At the same time she’s gone to the N and had probably asked her to forgive me. I love this mutual friend, but I honestly don’t think what she’s doing as a peacemaker is helping the situation. How am I supposed to deal with her?

The summer vacation is approaching its end, and honestly I still dread what is going to come after that. The thought of having to seat side by side to a group of people who are not afraid of smashing you in every way possible is scary, especially now that I’ve decided not to give in to any threats such as ” I will let your angelic mask fall off in front of others”.

How do you think is the best way to let go of this fear?

Mary
- This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Mary899.
August 17, 2017 at 6:19 am #164352

Eliana
Participant

Hi Mary899,

I know how horrible this is and the struggle and pain you are going through. Did you know “best friends” can turn into bullies? This happened to me. I think because “I’m the nice girl, sensitive, who is giving, kind, wears her heart on her sleeve” and unfortunately, best friends who turn on you, or become narcissistic and bullies see right through this and you become “their target” and they will continue unfortunately, because what bullies, narcissistic people want is a reaction. It’s like a high to them. They love to hurt people and when they get any kind of reaction from you, like anger, fear, etc..they will continue.

It’s when you stop reacting..they will soon give up and move on to their next target. It will and does get better. I got bullied from people I thought were my best friends in grade school, Middle School, High School, even today. People change, they get with another toxic person or wrong crowd, and they do a complete 360. Best thing to do, is to change your number, make all reasonable efforts not to sit by them, attend the same functions, and by all means, don’t show any reaction, fear, anger, retaliation, trading insults, because that is what they want. Block them from any social media. If you walk by them, just keep going. Just a quick nod and smile. The less communication and more distance you put between them, they will soon tire and give up. There are good people out there, that want to be your friend. Go where the sunshine is.

August 17, 2017 at 10:28 am #164434

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Mary899:

Regarding whether what you said here and there was wrong and something to apologize for- it is too much of a headache for me to figure it out, and it seems like it is for you too. The reason it is too much of a headache is because a whole lot of things have been said between you and one friend and between you and the other friend and between the two friends. I will have to figure out who said what, at what time, after what was said earlier, and so on, indeed a headache.

You wrote: “Generally, I don’t consider myself to be a hypocrite…however, sometimes I think maybe there is some truth in what the N says. What do you think, Anita? I actually need an objective point of view to see things clearly.”-

Hypocrisy is a form of dishonesty. It is a dishonest pretense. Your very friendship with the two young women who you dislike, one of which you label a Narcissist, is dishonest. The honest thing to do is to not be friends with people you dislike. And so, in this regard, you were dishonest. This fact does not make any one of them honest. It only indicates your own dishonesty.

When I wrote earlier to you to prevent problems in the future, I meant, be cautious regarding who you befriend. Learn who the person is, and only if you approve of much of who the person is, her/ his basic values, then proceed with a friendship. Listen to what they say, pay attention to how you feel and what the message is in what you feel.

Regarding going back to college and facing the same two women, do keep your distance, is my advice. Do not re-enter … close interactions or negotiations, defending yourself or any such thing. Keep your distance, make new friends if you can (following learning who they are, being selective).

The mess created with these two women cannot be fixed, as far as I can see. So don’t try to fix it. It is broken, let it be. You want your life unbroken- don’t focus on where it is already broken- focus elsewhere.

anita

August 17, 2017 at 11:56 am #164454

Mary899
Participant

Hi Eliana,

I’m so sorry to hear you’ve also been bullied by your “best friends”, and it’s been going on even to this day. To have trusted somebody who claimed that they loved you with your secrets and emotions, only to have them thrown at you and used against you…I had never experienced such a grand level of betrayal in my entire life. The level of paralysis is beyond imaginable. I had prepared a long summer reading list… During the summer I couldn’t concentrate enough to read anything. I wonder how long it’s going to take for me to get back to normal life. You say it’ll get better…thank you. That gives hope.

There is sth that I have trouble understanding. OK, so this person is a narcissist, has got a problem with me, and is now trying to destroy my relationships with other classmates. The question is…why don’t these people seem to be able to put two and two together and realize what is happening? They’ve known both me and her for 3 years…as you said “I’m the nice girl, sensitive, who is giving, kind, wears her heart on her sleeve” Why have they all rejected me and have taken sides with the N?

Thank you for your advice. I’m OK with not showing any signs of anger…but fear and resentment…I still have to work on those two. Unfortunately, I’m the type who gives her emotions away through facial expressions. What do you think I can do to minimize such effects?

Right now I’m back at my home city surrounded by supportive family members and friends. However, I dread going back to square one as soon as I have to go back to the capital, the place where my college is stated.

Again, thank you so much for your soothing words Eliana.

Love,

Mary

August 17, 2017 at 1:41 pm #164490

Mary899
Participant

Dear Anita,

I agree, it is a headache. A painful one. As I don’r seem to reach any logical decisions, I guess I need to let go of the whole thing.

With regards to the narcissist…I didn’t know there is a so called personality disorder at the time I was in a friendship with her. I truly loved her as at first, she appeared to love and accept me for who I am, warts and all. I was nore than willing to do the same for her. It was only after what happened over a very trivial misunderstanding that I realized true friends don’t treat each other like that…true friends don’t threaten you to get revenge or call you names. Therefore, I decided I’d rather get out of a friendship which no longer served me, even if it meant I might lose a couple of other friends and have my reputation ruined by her, which is exactly the thing that happened.

With regards to the other friend…I see your point and I agree with you about my own dishonesty. The thing, however, is that I never disliked “her”. That would be too general. I didn’t appreciate her being too critical and disrespectful behavior towards me at times and at the same time I kept beating myself up for being too sensitive. Still, that doesn’t change the fact that I was forcing myself to stay in a place which I didn’t feel comfortable in, and I do believe that is a form of being dishonest…mostly to myself.

As you said, I need to learn to become more selective with regards to choosing friends. I need to learn being lonely is much better than forcing yourself to stay in toxic relationships to avoid feeling lonely.

So you believe the mess created with these two women cannot be fixed. I already knew that my relationship with the N was beyond reparable…I had some hopes in fixing the other one, but now I can see clearly that despite having good moments, the foundations of that relationship had been shaky all along the way.

One question remains…now that all the doors are closed with regards to these people, how can I let go of my sense of guilt for possibly having hurt their feelings?

Mary

August 17, 2017 at 5:39 pm #164504

Eliana
Participant

Hi Mary,

The more distant and no contact with them you have, you won’t have to worry about showing facial expressions. But I can certainly understand where you are coming from because I struggled with resentment with people, I came to trust and love, and they hurt me terribly. So, what I did and still do, is when I feel resentment coming on, or thinking about them/the situation, I would feel sorry for them instead. Sorry, that they had had such small hearts. Then after time, the bitterness would leave, and it would just turn to empathy, no contact at all, but forgiveness, but this is a long process. So, please don’t allow these people to let bitterness and poison, resentment fester. Think that they are sleeping soundly, and going about their day peacefully, and you are fuming with resentment. You do not want to live your life this way I am sure.

If you have to walk by them, pretend you are occupied with something, look in your purse for something, look at notes, look down, look in your wallet, cell phone. What I did was put my friends pictures on my bathroom mirror and practice my “pity smile”. That way, if I ever ran across them instead of my heart pounding like crazy, and resentment, I would look in their face just like I looked at their picture on the bathroom mirror and give them the brief “pity smile/smirk” and keep walking. Just avoid them at all costs so you can let the sunshine in.

August 18, 2017 at 12:27 am #164524

Mary899
Participant

Hi Eliana,

Again, thank you for your soothing words.

I agree with you about forgiveness and resentment…resentment only result in me suffering, so I need to learn to let go.

Unfortunately, total avoidance is not a real option as I have to pass a large number of courses with them and our classrooms are too small.

The thing is, with regards to the narcissist, I’ve already forgiven her and have even felt pity for her…although I’ve decided to keep as great a distance as possible.

However, with regards to the friend who this post is about…I’ve forgiven her for what she has said and done, but I don’t seem to be able to forgive myself. As I was hurt, I said things with regards to her and her behavior to the N, whom I previously thought of as trustworthy…among them are things that I’m not that much proud of. After the fight with the narcissist, she went to her and supposedly told her everything that I had said with regards to her.

It still scares me when I think about it. I already had trouble forgiving myself for having made some unkind remarks about her BEFORE the N’s betrayal. After witnessing the N taking her aside and whispering in her ear right in front of my own eyes, with me being able to do absolutely nothing at the time, the sense of guilt was doubled. It turned into a painful anguish when I texted the friend after that and she didn’t reply. I felt worthless, rejected and betrayed…a horrible person.

Now I don’t know what to do to let go of the sense of guilt. Sometimes I can bring myself to laugh at how stupid and childish the whole thing is…other times, I’m paralyzed with remorse, guilt and shame.

Mary

August 18, 2017 at 6:49 am #164550

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Mary:

Three things:

1. The practical: the situation is a mess and best, I believe, is to leave it alone, don’t add to it. It is broken. Whatever happens next, happens. Probably nothing much will happen if there is no more added to the fire, so to speak. People are busy with their lives, new things, and this mess will be in their past. Focus on new relationships and pay attention to being true to yourself in those. Be slow to make a friend, learn, evaluate, pay attention.

2. The guilt in this situation: your guilt over words you said that you regret, about your participation in the mess that this thread is about: I think that this guilt can be overcome not by trying to fix the mess (see #1), but by learning from it and correcting your future behavior. You earn your self forgiveness by this very process: learning and correcting future behavior.

Would you like to list next what you learned and what changes in your behavior you would like to make?

* You are responsible only for your participation in every interaction. You are not responsible for others’, for what they do.

3. Your guilt that pre-exists this situation: as a child, you felt responsible, or guilty for things you were not guilty of?

Pre-existing guilt, unless addressed and resolved, will keep spilling into new situations, causing you to take responsibility for others’ behaviors, others’ choices, responsibility that is not yours to take and which will cloud your ability to evaluate people.

anita

August 18, 2017 at 1:34 pm #164620

Mary899
Participant

Dear Anita,

It’s a good idea to put things into perspective by making a list of what I have learned and what I’d like to change in my future behavior.

1. I have learned there is nothing shameful about feeling uncomfortable around a certain person. Instead of beating myself up for being too sensitive, I need to respect my emotions and take the message behind them seriously.

2. Just because somebody keeps saying how much they love you it doesn’t mean that they actually mean it. Chances are, if they are disrespectful towards others, always gossiping and always passing the blame, soon there will come a time that you, too, will be disrespected, gossiped about and be used as a scapegoat, no matter how much you were “loved” at the beginning of the friendship.

3. Just because someone says I have done something wrong doesn’t make it necessarily true. I have to use my own reasoning to evaluate the situation and come to a logical conclusion. Also, I certainly need to stop apologizing for the things that I haven’t done.

4. To have peace of mind, I need to let go of other people’s opinion about me. Instead, I have to focus on what “I” think of me.

5. Although it is good to be helpful and generous, my level of worth is not measured based on how many sacrifices I make for other people on a daily basis.

6. I need to let go of my constant fear of what other people can do to punish and reject me. (I still have to work on this.)

7. Although I’m generally very quiet and reserved, I still have to control my tongue, especially in the presence of someone who has shown a deep interest in gossiping.

8. I need to stop trying to fix and control every situation in order to feel secure.

9. I need to learn that it is very common for certain people to mistreat someone who’s been kind and giving to them. People are what they are and do what they do…you can not fix them or their beliefs.

With regards to the sense of guilt…yes. As a child I was always emotionally punished for being anything less than perfect in all areas of life. I was also punished for things that I hadn’t done or were not responsible for, such as my mother’s mental illness.

Again, thank you Anita for spreading your wisdom and for helping me to see the situation more clearly (:

Mary
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