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September 30, 2017 at 8:32 am #171059MinaParticipant
[Sept 30, 2017]
What an eventful day for me.
I saw the Fireworks festival with Evelyn nuna today. It was so magical that I almost cried. I wish you were there with me.
Did you perhaps got to see the fireworks all the way from Daegu?
Probably not, right? Since Daegu is so far away from Seoul.
By the way, I saw the picture that you uploaded today.
I am well aware that you are concerned and stressed out about Korean Thanksgiving day next monday.
You will have to meet every single of your family members that will ask you stuff about college, when are you going to military, where is your girlfriend, annoying stuff that is none of their business.
You will have to meet your annoying aunt who is always giving you a hard time because she is jealous of you.
Jealous because her son is a loser while you are such a star at everything.
I have told you before and I will tell you once again : those people do not matter. they are just jealous. do not believe anything that they says about you.
You will always be Gyunnie, the most amazing and thoughtful guy I have ever known in my life.
Do not be too sad or stressed out, please.
Your life will get back on track next year once you start your new semester at your new university. Trust me.
It is killing me to see you being stressed out and having a very hard time. I wish that I can hug you for one minute and support you.
And give you tons of encouraging words.
This is off topic but today I heard in details about what happened to that girl that apparently jumped off from Liberal Arts building.
She did not die.
In fact, she was not even a student at our university. She was just some crazy girl that came from a rural area in China, making a fuss out of nothing because of a guy in our university.
She met him while the guy was doing volunteer work in China, out of 80 persons – she was one of his students.
She apparently liked the guy so much that she came Korea, and to our university looking for his information.
Of course, our university would never give out students personal information to anyone. Let alone a crazy girl like her that came from China.
She climbed up the top of the Arts building and threatened to jump if the guy does not come.
The poor guy ended up coming. They talked for 4 hours, but the girl jumped off anyways because the guy does not like her or even know her that well.
The girl survived because the police had a mattress set up already.
What a disgusting and selfish girl.
How dare she came into one of Korea`s prestige university and disturbed the students?
More than that, I am very mad. How can she did such awful things to a guy that she apparently loves?
HOW?
I was so mad and dumb founded that I had to take a walk for 40 minutes to calm myself down today.
She just embarrassed the person that she loves, and even gave him a huge personal mental scar to him for the rest of his life.
I feel so so sorry to him.
I wish that the girl had died now. She does not deserve to live for doing such things to the person that she loves.
It is the most cruel and selfish thing I have ever heard in my life that you can do to anyone.
Our university and the guy decided not to sue, If I were them – I would.
I would never be able to forgive such things.
Imagining Mina doing that to Gyunnie …. makes me shiver in fear.
I would rather hurt myself than hurting you. I would rather die and suffer alone than letting you see me dying in front of your eyes.
How can she that claim that she loves him after what she did?
It is not love to me. I think she has some serious mental issues.
Sorry for sounding really angry 🙁
Not really in the right mind due to that news.
Love always,
-Mina x
P.s : for everyone who is reading this and wondering what kind of picture that Gyunnie uploaded, he uploaded a picture basically saying how much money he would get if everyone asks those very basic questions during family gathering such as,
1. Asking about when he will go to college (100$)
2. Asking about girlfriend / dating life ($150)
3. Asking about when he will go to his military service ($150)
4. Asking about what he will do in his future career ($500)
He was being sarcastic that he is selling those “worry” that people over him according to that price.
September 30, 2017 at 10:05 am #171071AnonymousGuestDear Mina:
What Gyunnie was suggesting was that he should charge people those prices for asking him these questions, correct? If so, an excellent idea. I wish he implemented it in real life. If I understood correctly (first part so far of my post), then it reveals what is most distressing to him from most (future career) to least (when he will go to college.. does this mean he is not attending the SKY university I thought he was attending…?)
Notice that his uture career is way more distressing or consuming to him than having a girlfriend: $500 compared to $150.
Regarding the girl that jumped to a mattress- the assumptions that it was an overly distressed student was incorrect then, another indication that it is better to check assumptions before …well, before assuming they are facts.
Another thing, what she did was not motivated, of course, by love but by strong emotions and desperation. When a person feels strong emotions of attraction and love another, it does not mean it is love. A person may be willing to die (jump off a building) in a demonstrative act of “love”, but it is not love.
Even way less dramatic demonstrations of “love”, such as heavy duty declarations of love, should not be confused with love. Love involves thinking and cognitive evaluation of emotion and the best interest of the loved one, as well as the best interest of oneself.
anita
October 1, 2017 at 12:52 am #171103MinaParticipantAnita,
Thanks for the feedback for yesterday`s letter.
I think I should make it clearer that what I have wrote above is only an example.
The picture that Gyunnie uploaded was not something that he made by himself.
It was just a regular picture taken from the internet being used by some Koreans when Thanksgiving day is coming, maybe since there are cultural differences between us, it is very common here in Korea and any East Asia culture that once you meet your family – you can ask things like weight, college, marriage, dating, or jobs. It is a part of our culture and it is considered NORMAL.
I will post what he uploaded exactly yesterday :
The Tittle : The Menu of Nagging during Chusok (Korean thanksgiving)
– Are you thinking about college? (50.000won)
-Please lose some weight (100.000won)
– Are you currently dating? (100.000won)
-When are you going to go to the military? (150.000won)
-When are you going to graduate? (150.000)
-Are you thinking about employment right now? (200.000 won)
-How much yearly salary are you getting? (250.000won)
– Isnt it time for you to get married? (300.000 won)
– Isnt it time for you to have kids? (500.000 won)
He is basically “selling” those concerns that people had for him that they expressed by asking personal questions. He was not serious, obviously and these things will never meant to be implemented in real life. Who will will buy such things? I would not. He was just being bitter and sarcastic about upcoming Thanksgiving day.
That is exactly what he posted. Some of them are not relatable for his situation (kids, yearly salary etc)
But young people these days find it quite uncomfortable for obvious reasons. Even I get uncomfortable when people ask such questions, let alone Gyunnie who is somehow going into the “unpopular road” here in Korea.
Out of SKY Uni – he got accepted into K University.
Now he is moving to Y University.
People find it very odd, that he is moving to a college that has the same exact standards as his previous university.
Like moving from Stanford to Yale.
I have never mentioned this but Gyunnie is an only kid which makes him the only son. In Korea society, having sons is somehow better than daughters.
He has a lot of expectations on his shoulders from his parents and family as the only son.
I think that is the main reason why he puts so much pressure on himself to be perfect.
He told me once that the day before the SAT, he could not sleep at all. He prepared that exam for 3 years. He can only slept after his mom lowered her expectations by saying that “It is ok to fail, Gyun-ah.”
He ended up getting #1 on that SAT exams.
He was a very good student but he did not have a good relationship with most of his teachers.
From what he had described, most of his teachers are just super subjective in grading. and too religious for his preference.
He spent his teenage years (12-18) in China. He went into a top international school there, with only 20 students per year – though he made a lot of good friends.
Imagine moving from his high school to K University that has 15.000 students per year. His major itself has around 500 students per year.
I think Gyunnie had a very rough transition from high school to college.
He is “shaking” a lot. In Korea, these are not good signs. People who were a good student and good son is expected to continue their roles like that forever.
His parents has a lot of concerns regarding moving college and military service as well.
He is losing time, and they are losing money.
Gyunnie is not in the best situation in his life right now. People are probably criticising him for being so unstable, one of the biggest sign is him letting K University go (from their perspective)
I can go into more details about his family stuff if you want, in my next reply to you.
But now, I can see why he was not happy in K University.
I noticed now that he never really made any comments or remarks about his friends from K Uni. Most of his friends that he talked about and introduced to me were his high school friends.
I tried to find out from my other friend in Business major, he said that Gyunnie has quite a lot of friends. Not to mention being in student council is a huge deal as well.
I feel like he did not have any problems in his social life but he had mentioned and expressed a few times that he does not feel like he got along with them very well deep down inside.
Like his personality and their personality is way too different.
But I mean out of 500 students, what can you expect? You cannot get along with everyone.
I noticed that he has a small group of friends (2 girls, 3 guys including him) before I dated him.
But when I started dating him, he never once talked about them. They seemed quite close in my eyes, they even went to see Cherry Blossom together.
I asked him about them and he said that they are close but not that close.
I feel like Gyunnie put quite a distance between him and Business school people.
I asked our mutual friend that introduced me and Gyunnie, he said that he only met Gyunnie outside school to drink once.
Later I found out that they aren’t even that close, and they actually kinda got closer because of me.
I feel kind of guilty for not really seeing his struggles now.
Gyunnie was forcing himself to be nice to gain friends that does not even understand or get along with him very well.
I think in K University, he only has less than 10 people that he can really trust.
Now that I think about it, I was probably his best friend in K University.
I was the first person that he told in K University that he is moving, later on he finally told his “close” friends which is like 3-4 people that he is moving.
From the outside he seems like he has tons of friends but not a lot that he genuinely likes.
-Mina
October 1, 2017 at 6:24 am #171111AnonymousGuestDear Mina:
I understood that his post of questions and prices was a joke (with real life components, of course). But I didn’t thoroughly understand the joke. I understand a bit better now, thank you for elaborating.
Regarding the real life components of the joke, it reveals the following values: education, employment and income, marriage and children (future family). Too many expectations on Gyunnie led to his drive to be perfect, an impossibility. It was an act of mercy on his mother’s part when she told him it is okay to fail. Maybe that relaxed him and made it possible for him to get the best grade.
Life is very difficult for him, being torn between family and societal expectations of him and his differing individual preferences, values, interests. Here is a moment of fantasy on my part, and I am sharing it as a Fantasy: if you and Gyunnie left your respective families, and society, and took your combined very high intelligence to another country that offers quality education and employment possibilities, where you were free from expectations, from family obligations, the two of you would … conquer the world, so to speak, get the highest education possible, the highest income, and make the best life for yourselves in every way, making your own choices that fit your own shared preferences and values.
You wrote: “I feel kind of guilty for not really seeing his struggles now”- his struggles are much greater than what you could possibly help him with, in the context of interacting with him for only four months as a peer (not a parent, an elder family member, an employer and such). If you saw more of his struggles, what could you have done differently that would be of help to him?
anita
October 1, 2017 at 10:40 am #171165MinaParticipantAnita,
Thanks for understanding.
I think you completely understand the reason why we aren’t together at this very moment.
We are both suffering from our parents and society expectations of us. His issues goes deeper than just a simple college moving.
Your fantasy sounds … exactly like a fantasy. Something that only exists somewhere, maybe in our next life.
Maybe there isnt such a thing as past or next life but if there is – I am praying that we can meet like that.
That is why I was very angry and still angry at God in a sense, because I met him in a such difficult situation.
That we had to part because of everything in our life.
I cannot help to think that just like how Romeo and Juliet
s love was separated because of the family, and how Jack and Rose (Titanic)
s love was separated because of death.Me and Gyunnie, we are being separated by an ocean of expectations.
Our love will go on, even if we are not together anymore.
Do you understand what I mean by that sentence above?
It is a figurative expressions. Because the term “love” itself never ended for me or him.
It was cut off not ended. It is different from ending it.
I will always have a special place for him, maybe as a fond memory or someone that I respected.
P.s : It was very comforting, reading your fantasy for us. I wish that your fantasy would come true one day for us. I really hope so.
-Mina
October 1, 2017 at 11:05 am #171171MinaParticipantA world where I do not have anyones expectations on me.
A world where we can both be “losers” but are still happy.
A world where our love can be just the reason and the solution to life.
A world where we can make decisions without thinking about what our parents or family have to say about it.
A world where we can be ourselves.
I imagine this every single day, this beautiful that fantasy that probably will only stay as a fantasy.
I cannot help but to think about how unfair this is.
Two people that loves each other but cannot be with each other?
Why? Why? Why?
I was a very religious Catholic before the break up. I know that this website is a Buddhist website, but I know that everyone here are so nice and does not care about my religion.
I am losing my Catholic faith very slowly but surely.
I tried reaching out for help to several people regarding my faith, but I feel like it is not really working.
I understand that God loves me very much, and He wants the best for me but it is so hard to see His plan beyond this sad relationship that had to end due to all those things.
That is why I am mad at God, but at the same time – my heart still cried out to him to help me.
To help me stays alive, help me see things beyond him, or maybe let us be with each other somehow if He cannot do that.
My life right now has no direction. No hope. No light.
I am just holding on.
I have to.
-Mina
October 1, 2017 at 11:31 am #171173AnonymousGuestDear Mina:
I have very little concentration ability at the moment, getting ready to get off line. I want to re-read your first recent post and then read the second tomorrow morning (about 17 hours from now). From the quick reading of the first, you read, again, so very realistic, your thinking congruent with reality (I am impressed!).
And this: “Our love will go on, even if we are not together anymore.
Do you understand what I mean by that sentence above?”-Now I do, after all our communications and my developing understanding: yes, I believe I do. It too reads congruent with reality.
anita
October 2, 2017 at 5:02 am #171227AnonymousGuestDear Mina:
I read both recent posts and will be quoting from both.
You wrote: “We are both suffering from our parents and society expectations of us.. Me and Gyunnie, we are being separated by an ocean of expectations”.
You wish you could live in “A world where we can make decisions without thinking about what our parents or family have to say about it. A world where we can be ourselves”-
My input: It is possible for you, Mina, with or without Gyunnie (it is possible for him too) to live in such a world, perhaps a real ocean away, far away from your parents’ and society’s expectations, being your authentic selves without or regardless of societal expectations. It will not make you “losers” but winners.
I understand how unlikely it is for you and for him, separately or together, to take such initiative, all the actions needed to actualize this possibility, but others have done so. It was done. It can be done. It is very difficult, but possible.
Yet so unlikely I am okay with calling it a fantasy.
You wrote about the concepts of a past life, a next life, a God, prayer. You wrote: “I understand that God loves me very much, and He wants the best for me but it is so hard to see His plan”-
I believe there is no past lives or next lives for the individual Mina, for the individual Gyunnie, or for any individual. The brain that is responsible for the individual’s thoughts, feelings, habits, learning, remembering etc., it decomposes at death and so the individual ends. (I wonder, what is the point of education, of learning biology, physiology, biochemistry in one does not understand the fact that a brain does decompose at death and the individual ends).
There is probably some sort of energy or energies or a quality unknown to scientists that exists, but not the individual person.
I believe there is no god, no biblical god, that this god is a made up entity, fitting the concept of a good, loving, well meaning, all powerful, all knowing father with an individual life plan for every person born. Clearly there is safety in the concept. And plenty of evidence that there is no such father-in-the-sky.
anita
October 2, 2017 at 6:48 am #171235MinaParticipant[Oct 2nd, 2017]
Gyunnie,
I am very lonely these days.
I miss you very much.
Are you well? I hope that you are eating and taking care of your health.
I hope that I can talk to you. or see you in person.
I feel like dying.
I feel very lost.
I lost the love of my life, I lost my spirit to live, I basically lost everything.
I do not know what am I doing with my life.
Gyunnie, is it possible for me to see you for one day?
To go back, pretending like we were still together as a couple.
For just one day.
My birthday is less than one month away, I think receiving a birthday message from you would be the best gift to me.
I am not hoping for anything, and you might forget my birthday as you are very busy with life but I am praying everyday that you would remember and say something to me.
I won’t ask for any birthday present except for your sincere wishes to me.
That is it.
No new clothes, no new phone, nothing – except for you well wishes to me.
I only need that.
Tomorrow, maybe I will go to my favourite place in Seoul.
The airport! I am leaving for London in 84 days. Still a long way to go, I know babe. But I love going to the airport.
It is a little escape place for me.
I want to share my favourite song with you today :
“You have suffered, do not deny it.
Just let go, your heavy load.
You have been through a lot.
Now, learn the ways to receive as well.”
I needed to hear those words from you.
I miss you so much, Gyunnie. I miss you desperately.
Everyday is hell, and everyday is painful. I am not living.
I cannot reach out to you as well, for obvious reasons.
My eyes are blinded and my heart is shallow.
It is just like staring at a burning river.
Well, maybe now, it is time to stop.
Love,
-Mina
October 2, 2017 at 8:45 am #171253MinaParticipantAnita,
Thank you for the feedback on my last 2 reply.
I respect all of your opinions.
I understand that it is indeed possible, to live like that.
But as you have mentioned, it is almost impossible to the point we call it a “fantasy”
-Mina
October 2, 2017 at 9:03 am #171259AnonymousGuestDear Mina:
You are welcome. I hope you have a better day tomorrow. Mentioning hope, your desire to escape (airport) this state, “Everyday is hell, and everyday is painful. I am not living”-
do you hope that after graduating, after having a prestigious profession, a certain income and/ or getting married to a man with a prestigious profession, a certain income and having children, then you will have a good life?
anita
October 2, 2017 at 9:31 am #171269MinaParticipantAnita,
My plan right now is to survive college and graduate with honours.
Future jobs? I still have not think about it very deeply or in details, except for the fact that I will not stay in Korea.
Singapore is my first choice, but it can still change – depends on the situation later on.
The most important thing is : my job will be temporary only.
I have no plans at all to continue working or my professional career after I got married.
The ideal will be me working for 1-2 years and then getting married.
Kids are in the picture, definitely.
Do I hope that I will have a good life?
Yes. It is an ideal life for me, personally.
Some people call it “stupid” or a waste of my brain, but I am almost 100 percent sure that my future life will be something like I have described to you. Hopefully.
I love taking care of my husband and my kids, just being surrounded with people that loves and accept me.
Maybe once my kids gets older, I will consider working again or doing something in my life to keep it busy, but it is still too far ahead of me to talk.
Anyways, yes, to answer your question, I hope so.
-Mina
October 2, 2017 at 9:58 am #171275AnonymousGuestDear Mina:
Yes, you did mention your number one priority in future plans before, and passionately, that is your desire to get married and have a family, and to do so as early as possible. Your hope is and has been in having your own family.
Your plan to work “for 1-2 years and then getting married” and not work following getting married does not make sense when thinking about the many years of hard work you spent in school and currently, that is a lot of time and hard work.
Your plan does make sense when thinking that your future SKY degree with honors will increase your chances of getting married to a man who will be a highly educated man and a high income earner (one to satisfy your parents, yourself and make him a more desirable father to your children) and that after your children are grown, the degree will be useful.
Your plan also makes sense when thinking that currently, you can’t see any way to do anything else but be a student in a prestigious university because of your parents’ expectations. It is what they want and you don’t see a way to defy them.
What do you think of my analysis here?
anita
October 2, 2017 at 10:27 am #171279MinaParticipantAnita,
Your analysis is quite accurate.
The main reason why I am studying at SKY is I understand that If I want to marry “someone” – I myself have to be “someone” as well.
I need to support my future husband well, and without a good brain – it is going to be hard.
You are not familiar with the Korean education system but being in the Student Council and majoring in Business at one of SKY Universities, your path to become a president is pretty much open, literally.
If not a president, then an assembly member in the government body 0r at least an important CEOs of Korean companies such as Samsung.
I believe that Gyunnie will become someone very important in the future, with or without his parents pressure, he is a brilliant person.
Our university lost one of their brightest student when he dropped out.
Imagine being a wife of someone like that. I have to prepare myself the basic things in order to survive.
I have to protect and support my husband as well.
I have to look presentable at all times and I have to be well educated. It is very important.
I do not want to be a cliche trophy wife.
I would actually love and take care of my husband and my kids.
-Mina
- This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by Mina.
October 2, 2017 at 10:37 am #171285AnonymousGuestDear Mina:
I understand your reasoning. I have three questions regarding the “someone” concept in your sentence “If I want to marry “someone” – I myself have to be “someone” as well”- a concept taught to you by your mother and a social convention in Korean and other societies.
1. Can a person be a Someone before graduating a prestigious university?
2. Is there anything else required for a person to be a Someone, other than formal education and a prestigious, high paying career?
3. Is your mother a Someone? Is your father a Someone? If so, how content is each being a Someone? And are you content with either one of your parents being a Someone, does it fill your heart with contentment, peace, love?
Answer if you would like.
anita
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