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Viewing 12 posts - 16 through 27 (of 27 total)
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  • January 20, 2016 at 6:56 pm #93158
    Ladybug
    Participant

    Thank you for the complement jock and anita 🙂

    January 20, 2016 at 8:02 pm #93171
    Anonymous
    Guest

    You are welcome, Ladybug! It is an example of perfectly executed assertion that I hope all who need to learn how to do it right can learn from your real life assertion here, on this thread!

    anita

    January 20, 2016 at 8:05 pm #93172
    Anonymous
    Guest

    …And please post again, if you’d like. If I can help you reach your own conclusions… I will pace myself in my efforts, take it slow and easy, suggest something and then wait for your reply…not tell you how it is, but ask you: what do you think about this or that, etc…

    January 20, 2016 at 8:17 pm #93174
    Ladybug
    Participant

    Anita,
    I can say the same to you. You could have responded to my comment with passive aggressiveness or dismissing it, but instead you chose to reply with raw vulnerability. It does take discomfort (at least for me) to express my concerns, but I believe it also takes equal discomfort for you to sincerely take the assertion in stride. I’ve never had someone respond to an assertion so positively. Honestly, I felt surprised in a good way and was smiling when I read your post. You have helped teach me that not everyone responds to assertions negatively, and that an assertion isn’t always a gateway to a heated argument.
    As for my mom, she’s done both: she has done the half hearted apologies that, while they don’t feel like blows, they are definitely not apologies. It’s like the “I’m sorry you feel that way” defense. She has also apologized sincerely so it’s a mixed bag. She has the potential to be really manipulative.
    I have felt “crazy” and “stupid” in the past because of this manipulation. Without going too much into detail, I felt she had made an elitest comment about my boyfriend (my boyfriend wasn’t there just FYI). I later confronted her about that, saying that while that might have not been her intention, I felt offended by her remark. She responded that it’s all in my head. When I respond with “no it’s not” she says “of course it isn’t” and then continues with how she can’t believe I can’t trust my own mother to not be an elitest, that because I know she isn’t an elitest I shouldn’t call her out when she says something that I find elitest. She has said “it’s all in my head” I believe another time and “you must have a lot of stuff going on in your head”, and she has said “you can’t expect me to be perfect” and has commented how she has felt I expect her to be so perfect. While she has only said the comment “it’s in my head” a couple times, it really hurt since years ago I experienced a period of clinical depression in high school and at times felt like a crazy person. She has also made comments like she would do this or this when she was my age… or so-and-so behaved like that. For instance, I expressed a grievance and she responded that my aunt is like that with a chip on her shoulder, but then she said “well she’s in her 40’s and you’re only in your 20’s”. It’s her way or the high way. My brothers and I have talked about it and have come to the same conclusion. While she would never kick me out of the house or do something that severe, what I’m trying to say is that if I express a deeper grievance (not a milder one like knocking on my door first before entering) we would have a heated argument and more often than not my feelings aren’t validated. I have learned that assertions usually come with heated arguments. When I imagine myself telling her these things I can picture her voice saying “you really do hold grudges…that is so in the past…” or I can imagine her saying “when have I ever done this?” and then I feel immensely stupid, crazy, and embarrassed and start questioning my sanity. Just the fact that I feel “overdramatic” and mildly crazy writing this stuff down indicates something is up. I guess I feel like I’m going against my mom who has done so much for me and that I’m betraying her by posting this for some reason.

    January 20, 2016 at 9:04 pm #93186
    Ladybug
    Participant

    @Anita: Haha I believe I was writing the post before I saw you had responded.

    January 20, 2016 at 9:06 pm #93188
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Ladybug:

    This is a challenge for me, to pace myself on this because of my experience with my own mother. But I am up to the challenge, that is to avoid projecting my experience into yours. There is no doubt in my mind there are significant similarities between my mother and yours but they are not the same woman. So keeping them separate in my mind is the challenge.

    I am touched what you wrote in the first few lines, about my response to your assertion and it is true, raw vulnerability it was, discomfort was there… and it was all authentic. I am so pleased that you recognized all this. And thoroughly impressed that you did.

    I can very much relate to the last sentence you wrote, the feeling of betraying your mother by posting this. There is so much I have to say about this betrayal issue, so very much. But pace myself… This is what I found out: these beliefs that we have about our parents are deeply ingrained in our brains, so even though we realize something that doesn’t fit with the deep belief we have, it feels strange and… it takes time, healing time I call it, for new beliefs to take hold. Literally it is about new connections between neurons being formed and old connections being weakened. This takes time and there is discomfort involved.

    What do you think of the following: what if you, Ladybug, are betraying yourself for the purpose of not betraying your mother?

    Does this mean something to you? If it does or not, my hope is that your loyalty is to yourself as one capable of seeing what is true and what is not.

    Hoping you post again…I do.
    anita

    January 20, 2016 at 9:08 pm #93190
    Anonymous
    Guest

    * and wow indeed, you posted before my second post today!

    January 20, 2016 at 9:19 pm #93205
    Anonymous
    Guest

    * Bedtime for me. Will be back at the computer in about 10 hours,
    anita

    January 20, 2016 at 9:55 pm #93209
    Ladybug
    Participant

    Dear Anita,
    What you said does ring true: the literal weakening of strong neuron pathways and also betraying myself in order to make sure my mom’s image isn’t tarnished. It’s conflicting because my mom and I can have these deep conversations and she has apologized sincerely (more so as she has gotten older). She has been there for me emotionally and physically at my lowest points and have supported me in my endeavors, yet I’m starting to realize most of my life my “negative” (anger, sadness, annoyance, frustration, irritation…) feelings towards her weren’t validated or on the rare occasion that they were, we would have to go through these long, heated arguments in order for them to be. Long story short, I just wanted to have them recognized whether she agreed or not. I wanted to feel heard and seen when I expressed these certain emotions, not twisted to feel bad or worse crazy.
    By the way, I appreciate your patience and taking on this challenge 🙂

    January 21, 2016 at 7:48 am #93215
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Ladybug:

    You are welcome! You are making a very good point about “negative” emotions and you are making the point so clearly:

    these negative emotion, anger (of different intensities from annoyance and on), sadness- a person can not help but feel them at times. It is not possible to never feel these feelings. And in any close relationship it is not possible to never be angry at the other person. The purpose of the anger is to assert oneself, to right a wrong and it should go both ways.

    You are very clear: you needed to be heard and seen, to have your (“negative”) feelings validated and recognized.

    To be “twisted to feel bad or worse crazy”- when your mother twisted you mentally that way (and it was twisting because it goes against nature to disallow … natural emotions)- what would you call that, what she did? That twisting… it is not an act of love… (I am making an effort here to not put words in your mouth, to not tell you: this is what it is! although I think to myself that .. this IS what it is, so I recognize it and … breathe in and think to myself: be open for Ladybug’s input, open)

    So I am very curious then, what you would call that act of “twisting to feel bad or worse crazy”?

    * I am glad we communicated this long and hoping there will be more. I also know that you may choose at anytime to not answer, but for as long as you do choose to continue, I find this communication very special and helpful to me!

    anita

    January 21, 2016 at 10:24 pm #93305
    Ladybug
    Participant

    Thanks Anita:) It has helped me as well:) I would call it manipulation. It was based on her fears with herself and those types of emotions and she projected them on me via manipulation.

    I think I’m going to use the info on this thread and let it set in for a bit. Thanks for helping me out again Anita 🙂 I appreciate it:)

    January 22, 2016 at 8:09 am #93320
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Ladybug:

    You are welcome and … thank you. You wrote above that you are going to use the info on this thread and let is set in for a bit. This is another assertion so well stated and heard on my end. If you choose to post here again, anytime you do… and as long as this forum exists and I exist too, I will reply and we can continue to communicate.

    Take care of yourself!

    anita

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