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Ramsey
ParticipantMy point is that we donāt live in a free world, no matter how many people are convinced we are and will try to convince ME that we are. Exploitation is unavoidable under capitalism because business owners will ALWAYS take most of their employeesā labor. I donāt want to be part of that, nor do I want to change it. I just want to watch it all die from the outside. Thatās why I donāt vote
Ramsey
ParticipantAll of us are being exploited- despite level of happiness with work.
People who can’t find work and are living on the streets get the sh*t end of everyone’s stick because “they didn’t work hard enough,” or “they’re junkies”- which is totally unfair to their circumstances.
Money forces people to be doing things that we don’t wanna be doing because we have to survive- which is bull because if it weren’t for private ownership, there would be a more equitable chance at living for everyone; not just for those who aren’t rich.
The need for money also forces people to have to work long hours away from other things that are necessary, but we’re lead to believe that sacrifice is the only way to maintain the things that are important to us- which I believe is true to an extent, but needing to sacrifice most of our time isn’t noble; it’s coercion- because those with money want our money and will therefore give us the means to live in exchange, but this hierarchy is arbitrary and needs to be dismantled.
The rise in mental illness is most likely a direct result of us living domestic lives and disregarding the fact that we need to take some time to ourselves and 2 weeks-1 month out of a year is clearly not doing anything to ease peoples’ minds and keep them satisfied.
Ramsey
ParticipantYes; and I believe that these unfortunate circumstances wouldn’t be present if it weren’t for the presence of money, authority, and all the social norms and ideas that have spawned about people who are regularly taken advantage of within the context of our current society. But my grievances extend way beyond just the destitute and those who don’t have jobs that can give them a “good quality of life.”
Ramsey
ParticipantMy point is that this is not how we were meant to live, and I donāt want to do all that until Iām 65 and can only spend my older years enjoying a life of not being employed.
Ramsey
ParticipantDear Anita,
Iām sorry if I gave off that impression. I just got tired of talking/thinking in circles and decided to open up a little bit. Ā I just donāt wanna wait until Iām 65 or older to stop working Ā because thatās not fair. Ā This whole āretirement ageā thing is bull, and having people Ā work their entire lives away for a society that was not part of natureās plan is inhumane in my opinion. Animal rights organizations may be a little on the crazy side, but theyāre 134% right when they talk about the effects of domestication on non-human animals; and as Iāve said before, I think that domestic life has the same effect on humans, but Iām going back into that circular cycle.
Regardless of whether or not I can find a job I lime, at its very core, employment is slavery, Ā because like Iāve said before, we only have contextual freedom- Ā and in this context, itās freedom on someone elseās terms; freedom to spend money… but thatās it. And for some odd reason, being required to do everything that a person is required to do with in our society, is considered freedom and I just donāt see how thatās true- Ā especially if you look at what happens to people who donāt have jobs and how theyāre treated/regarded by people who do have jobs and money. Sure there are people out there who work to help those people, but the general populace does not give a sh*t about anybody who suffering at the hands of the system; and thatās partially because we believe that everyoneās fate is within their own hands; and while that may have some truth to it, itās not entirely true… Ā The way I see it, every institution is bought, and is thus pursuaded to brainwash us into thinking the way that most of us do; that spending more time working a job than taking care of yourself/your family is a noble way to live. But I donāt see working a job as part of life, but rather as theft of life; regardless of how you wanna soften that. I get that all the things that work takes us away from- our families, our homes, our pets, eating, showering, etc., is all considered work, and that thereās no avoiding work and that weād still have to do those things if work magically disappeared, but working a job by which we can make money just adds more work to our lives; and a lot of people end up neglecting themselves, their families so that they can āat least be alive,ā but whatās the point of being alive if ALL you have to focus on is working/falling into trouble if you canāt get your stuff done? In addition to all my loneliness, and my inability to exercise, I donāt want to add something thatās gonna bring on an entirely new realm of stress, even if I like doing it. But… recently, Iāve been writing a lot- essays, letters, but mostly lyrics (to which Iāve received lots of good feedback) so weāll see how far that gets me.
-RA
Ramsey
ParticipantCan you give me any recommendations? Ā I feel like I had lost my ājuiceā once I graduated. I didnāt have a plan throughout college because I didnāt know what to study, so I settled for history. Now, I donāt have ANY relevant experience to put on my resume and Iāve been stuck at home for the past 7 months; but I donāt want to get a job that Iām gonna have to settle for like I did with my major; and I CERTAINLY donāt want a job thatās gonna bore the crap outta me. But nobody will hire me, Iām injured so i canāt exercise, Iām getting fat again, I donāt get out and see things, I didnāt make friends in college, I still have yet to even KISS a woman, and Iām supposed to just think āHey, itās normal for entry level jobs to require 2 years of experience, and youāll find a woman, Ramsey; donāt worry; just keep looking up and things will eventually look up with you!ā, but Iāve been staring too long at the sky; my headās in the clouds and Iāve been blinded by the sun, so Iāve lost sight of myself, my purpose, and everything thatās made me me over the course of my life thus far and the last thing I wanna do is confine myself to a lifetime of working as someone elseās āemployeeā so I can maintain the rest of this oh-so-wonderful life that I didnāt ask for but am REQUIRED to be happy and grateful for, regardless of whether I had any say in the matter. Do I want to keep thinking like this, no… but Iāve never been one to think positively about myself so I donāt know how to not think so pessimistically.
Ramsey
ParticipantOkay here. I think that human beings have overlooked the potential effects that our domestication of each other is having on us. We have to answer to too many demands- demands that ONLY exist because of our Ā dependence on money/human productivity. However, I donāt believe that humans were meant to work as much as they do- 2/52 weeks to themselves d during those weeks only 2/7 days to themselves and their families, and out of those days ~7 hours to themseves and their families. Mental illness is on the rise and I think that having forced ourselves into domestication is the main contributing factor to this sense of dissatisfaction- I mean, 70% of people (in the US, at least) arenāt satisfied with their work- which is too big a number to overlook, but I donāt necessarily think that itās only the TYPE of job that is the cause for dissatisfaction; I think itās the having of a job itself; the sacrifice of one personās time to anotherās authority which ultimately decides whether youāre worthy of your pay (which one needs to survive). This is wrong; no person should be allowed to determine whether other people are allowed to survive; no one person should be considered above anybody else because at the end of the day, weāre all going to die and then decay; nobody looks at the skeleton of a former king and says āwow his bones are SOOOOO regal!ā No; everyoneās bones are the same; everyone uses the bathroom and picks up after their dog. We are all the SAME and yet we allow accumulation of money- something that was never present in our nature to begin with- to distinguish ourselves over others. Which gives regular people feelings of inadequacy because Ā weāre never gonna be able to accumulate as much money as the super rich- whoāve achieved their goals thru the manipulation of numbers/peoplesā time while there are people who can barely afford to feed their families despite being on welfare and working multiple jobs. This is another potential contributing factor to the rise in mental illness- a sense of hopelessness; a sense of wonder as to where their next meal will come from- but hard work IS the answer (despite how hard theyāre working already and how little time they get to spend with their families)- while rich warmongers, and resource thieves can spend barely any time working because their jobs require very little if any energy at all- weāre busy doing all their grunt work. They get to retire early and live comfortable lives while everyone else works their asses off and has to decide how āresponsibleā they want to be with their money- as though that was something that EVERYONE collectively agreed upon. But no, the majority of people HAVE to worry about the potential of going hungry because of a system that is drivin by greed; we HAVE to worry about allocating family/friend time because if we get too consumed in our jobs, we just end up tired and not wanting to do anything with anybody, and we have to deal with mental health disorders that I believe are caused by excess stress, minimal autonomy over oneās body, and lack of personal time/time spent in nature all of which are integral to the advancement of American capitalism because our society relies on the subversion/suppression of human nature in order to survive- which is mentally unhealthy.
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This reply was modified 6 years, 3 months ago by
Ramsey.
Ramsey
ParticipantāLetās just agree to disagree on this.ā I mean, we can. But doing so is only to ignore that capitalism promises infinite growth of commodified material wealth in a finite world. So, sure. There may be people who are experts in certain things and thatās why they should be allowed to get paid for providing them to those who need them, but soon weāre gonna run so low on resources that the prices are gonna go so far up that nobodyās gonna be able to afford them except for those with… money. Thatās a very real threat to our society. But sure, weāll just keep working for money- which will continue going down in value- until people start wars over water, food, and land (the latter of which three has always been an issue with humans) because there wonāt be enough to go around for the growing population.
Ramsey
ParticipantIf I became the CEO of Nike, Iād be exploiting all of my employees- especially the ones who get paid 10 cents a day to risk their lives working in sweat shops to make me some money, and you a pair of Jordans, but also the ones who have jobs in corpoarte offices, and in my shoe stores. And, yes, theoretically speaking, the people working in shoe stores should be young people with little experience- but that doesnāt account for the workers who couldnāt afford to go to college and have no choice but to rely on a part-time job such as working in a shoe store. āBut thereās the opportunity to get promoted to manager.ā Okay, but thatās likely a position given to one, maybe two people. The rest are left at the bottom. As for the people who have jobs working for Nike that have college degrees, whatās a bachelorās degree gonna get them nowadays? From every job posting that Iāve seen, people need āminimum 2 years experienceā to get jobs anywhere with a JUST a bachelorās degree. Why canāt people just learn what to do? Because itās cheaper to hire someone who doesnāt need training than it is to hire someone and then train them. What then? Should they apply to work in sweatshops, or something? This kinda crap suggests that a companyās main concern is what you can produce, and not anything else- not your needs, and most certainly not the truth (i.e. questions like āHow can you be an asset to this company?, āWhy do you want to work here?ā- both of which are used to get a feel for how gee-willackers excited someone is to work at Nike, when the reality is most likely that they just need to survive. Theyād replace you/fire you in a heartbeat if they felt like they needed to save money; to them itās not personal; but to the worker itās ALL personal; you played by their arbitrary set of rules, yet you still lost because they decided that saving money>loyalty to workers- but yayyy severance package. This is dragging, but work IS exploitation because without it we have no choice but to do it to survive- regardless of whether our bodies were meant to handle the stresses of a life of nonstop work within the context of capitalism.
As for living the hunter gatherer lifestyle, there is no way to figure out where that wouldāve lead had the population not exploded the way it did with the advent of cities and industrialization, so Iām not sure if my utopia WOULD be people people living in the wild. I donāt even know if Iām looking for a utopia- having expectations that high is unrealistic, and will only result in disappointment. Also, if 1243 people were to be asked what their idea of utopia was, weād get 1243 different answers- one of which answers is likely to be our capitalist utopia, and one of which is likely to be a communist utopia- which means that one personās utopia is anotherās dystopia. Iām not sure where I stand in terms of how society should be organized, but I DO know that other people should NOT be able to play god with the livelihoods of others; they shouldnāt jail people for stealing if they HAVE TO; people shouldnāt be jailed for not being able to pay for their healthcare; peoplesā homes shouldnāt be left to burn down because their money was in their house and couldnāt pay the fire dept (this happened); people shouldnāt be forced out of their homes if they couldnāt pay the bank in time- but NOOOO; sh*t like that is allowed because issuing an eviction notice isnāt a bullet to the brain- no… itās a cowardly way of hurting someone. But my main main main point is that all of the BS that humans (corporations and governments) do in the world is because of money; and they can get away with it because of money; and nobody wants to do anything about it because they have a job to go to because organizing is dangerous and can put their jobs in jeopardy… and they they need money! Itās a Ā vicious cycle.
Ramsey
ParticipantDear Brandi,
Iām glad that youāve found success and satisfaction in your work, and I do not want to take that away from you because there are very few people who areĀ satisfied with their work- ~30% last time I checked. As for the rest… well, they most likely had to settle for the sake of survival- given up on dreams they may have had, all because they probably werenāt ārealisticā enough; all for the sake of survival; which, again, shouldnāt be a personās main worry; not in todayās world at least. The idea alone that people have to sell their time and labor in order to survive- rather than simply leave their dwellings to pick vegetables and hunt for food (things that are -by nature- communal)- is counter to this idea that weāre āfree.ā How is it freedom if someone HAS to work for someone else so they can get express permission to survive (money)? I donāt necessarily care about how ONE person can improve their OWN worklife- if you did, thatās great; but what about everyone else? Say I end up getting promoted to CEO of Nike; thatās great! Iām now a billionaire and never have to work again! Now I am the very thing I hate about humanity- a bureaucrat; a āleaderā; an āowner.ā Itās idealism at itās laziest to just cite hard work as the recipe to escape being exploited because upward mobility is the path to becoming the exploiter. And why would anybody wand to become what they hate? The rich are and have been stealing resources, calling them theirs, and using their money to exploit people who can no longer get those things without money so they can get money to get the things that they otherwise wouldnāt need money to get had we not created a system that uses human beings as fuel, and just farts them away after theyāve been burned out. I donāt think that itās fair for me or anybody else to be afforded opportunities to work when there are people out there who āarenāt qualifiedā because that, as I said before, creates toxic ideas of self-worth.
Ramsey
ParticipantIām fully aware that injustice has always been around, but we- modern humans (humans with brains and empathy) know better than Hyenas and better than our ancestors. We outlawed killing sports and killing children becauze we realized that itās inhumane to do those things because we have the ability to think deeply and feel empathy. However, the people who outlawed those things are the same people who think itās okay to let those people who donāt have a source of income starve just because they canāt pay, and then imprison them when they steal so they can feed themselves and their families; as though money is- again- more important than a personās ability to sustain themselves. How is a life where we either have to follow the rules to game that most of us had no hand in creating or starve, any Ā different from a life in which rich people just go around shooting regular working people point blank in the skull in front of their families because they refused to bow down to them? Personally, Iād rather someone shoot me than starve at the hands of a predatory system that now acts as a middleman between the predatory elite- who, in the past, would kill/imprison those who didnāt follow their rules- and the people who rely on playing THEIR game in order to survive; we might as well cut out the middleman- at least that way weād all have SOME level of dignity. Progress IS important to me, but I donāt think that what weāve achieved is progress if all weāve done was created a system that INDIRECTLY harms people on behalf of those who used to do it directly when their followers didnāt obey them. As Ā organisms who are capable of rational thought, it shouldnāt be hard for us, as a collective, to see that the world isnāt OUR oysters- but rather that weāre being used as oysters ourselves. We create full pearls and are proud of said pearls, but in working for someone, those pearls are taken from us, and we canāt take full credit for being the one to create that whole pearl; weāre given small bits of each pearl we create for being an āasset to the companyā we had no choice but to offer our pearls to; then we get back maybe a small fraction of each of our pearls and are expected to be happy with that and just accept that ālife just isnāt fairā or that you should āmake the best of what you haveā when we can have more without being selfish. Why is it that when large companies fire groups of 20+ people to save money, or pay people sh*t wages theyāre seen as economical, or smart business people, but when people complain that they donāt have enough to survive, theyāre seen as selfish? I feel like enough people share these grievances, but are too afraid to put their voices out there in fear of being labeled too radical, or selfish, or entitled. But working class people shouldnāt be seen as selfish just because they want more than what theyāre getting from this parasite weāve created that is the economy. If we really WERE a progressive society, weād see capitalism as the injustice that it is. Injustice may be part of nature, but humans have no problem subverting aspects of nature so that their lives can be easier, why not try and subvert this sh*tty notion of social darwinism?
Ramsey
ParticipantIām not entirely sure if my ill feelings toward authority are rooted in my childhood. I got the idea that weāre pawns in the working world from my observations. Iāve stopped taking for granted that the world is as the world is and started thinking about what the world isnāt. And the world isnāt a lot of things- fair, and humane being but two of those things. Itās neither fair, nor humane for people who āownā things (like resources) to withold said things from others for money- yet, we do not question it when we see people struggling to survive/living on the streets; no… we label them as lazy, or junkies rather than victims of a system that relies on the exploitation of able bodies and rejects bodies that have done all that they can (retirees). Itās also neither fair, nor humane for people to have to answer to higherups, especially when those higherups have full power to take away the source of a personās income- ESPECIALLY when it comes to doing so in order to save whatever business some money (as though the coffers of a large corporation, or any business for that matter, matter more than a personās livlihood. I also dislike the idea of meritocracy and competition. It pits people against each other rather than encouraging them to work together.it also creates toxic ideas of self-worth; āOh YEAH, I sold more than you which means I get more money and more material things that I can use to prove that Iām better than you!ā āGreat job Allen! Youāve sold more gunk than everyone else here so youāre allowed to make more than everybody because you helped ME make more money!ā But I think that the worst part of the human work force is that the vast majority of people will be spending most of the years of their āfreeā lives as a subordinate to another human being- someone who eats, sleeps, uses the bathroom, getās sick, just like everyone else- until youāre too old to work and are no longer efficient enough to be exploited; thatās apparently the only time weāre allowed to be truly free- when weāre no longer useful to business owners. I dislike how humans come second to their work; even to themselves. We define ourselves by what we do for a living- as though what one can produce is more important in defining oneās personhood than actual personhood.
Ramsey
ParticipantMy parents were never strict with me, so thatās not it. I just hate the idea that humans have to go thru life having to pay for anything and everything when we could have made things a lot easier and more fair for everyone. I also hate how people like me- who see what human life REALLY has become (a moneygrab) – are brushed off as depressed and never taken seriously. I also hate how the human world doesnāt care about anybody that canāt contribute to it. In addition to that, I think itās ridiculous how people who spent tons of money on an undergraduate degree canāt get jobs right out of college anymore; unless they have 2 years experience right off the bat, and if they āwere responsible and majored in something with a good return on investmentā because that just reinforces the idea that weāre just pawns who are only good for furthering the agenda of the economic elite- who have ample free time and free will because they have money that they may or may not have worked hard to earn; and they want me to listen to THEM and help THEIR company or else Iāll be living on the sidewalk next to THEIR building begging for money because I didnāt want someone to own me for the time Iād be on this planet? Iāll pass. I want my time to be under MY control and nobody elseās. I also donāt want money. I just want to be able to craft my own life, and live it by my own terms. No IRS, no bills, no loans, NO EFFING BOSSES, nobody from the outside world there to bother me, nothing. I just want peace. But in the human world, peace is nonexistent and unattainable because we believe in a world where things HAVE to get done; I donāt. I hope everything falls apart so that humanity can f*ck off and stop shitting all over this beautiful place because we donāt deserve it. The way we exploit eachother and say that itās not personal; the way we kill each other and say that itās just business; the way we withold basic necessities from eachother and say that itās moral because itās being done for money, etc. Ā Humans disgust me and I donāt want to be one anymore.
Ramsey
ParticipantItās not about whether belevolence exists for me. I genuinely get upset whenever someone tells me that they want me to do something; professors who assign papers (regardless of the inocuity of their intentions), bosses, my friends, anybody. I guess that makes me a control freak, but why does it have to? All of these things (money, deadlines, work, bosses) arenāt inherently necessary for our survival; we made it so that they are and now they control EVERYTHING we do from eating, sleeping, healing ourselves; the only thing we control is how we handle being controlled by the corporate Westās obsession with corporate profiteering and prosperiy. I donāt want to be controlled by an ultimatum that people are forced to make- forced because the choice that we are expected to make is between survival and maintaining control over oneās own life, because NONE OF us told our parents to conceive us so why are we expected to be grateful for a life that Ā is only valuable if it can be exploited by people in positions of authority that they think they earned ? Ā Iām not a huge fan of the way that we organized society, and I know society is not going to change so I donāt really see a point in trying to ābe the change I want to see in the world.ā Ā Maybe if more people felt like me Iād be able to start some kind of movement, Ā but there arenāt enough people who do, so again, whatās the point?
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This reply was modified 6 years, 8 months ago by
Ramsey.
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This reply was modified 6 years, 3 months ago by
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