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Cali ChicaParticipant
Dear Anita,
the first biggest hurdle was accomplished yes. And by daily practice continues to be.
Now onto the second. Yes there are plenty hurdles in life But in this case there is 1 and 2. The main one which is above and beyond, my parents. And the second one. My sister. It is easy to get overwhelmed and feel like there was one, and two, and what will there be three for five more? Sure life will always throw me hurdles. But it is important for me to separate what one and two are. Because they are primary. And when I don’t tackle them they become jumbled, and all of life is a jumbled. I no longer no myself in this jumble. So yes. Number 1 and number 2. I know in my heart these are the two main ones. I know it, and you reminded me thank you. I am in the process of resolving number two. I was able to resolve number one, and continue to do so every day. And will continue to do so. I am so confident and capable of resolving number one.
so number 2—
I have the courage and capability. I am not superhuman. No I am relinquishing that hat slowly. But I am me. And that is unique and able to do anything after conquering number 1. I am not superhuman, I am only human, but I have the insight, awareness, and intelligence to Conquer number one. And therefore now I am on number two. And I can do it. I can do it. My life in this moment (overall) my progress thus far. My interaction with you. Is all proof. It is living proof. I am me. I conquered number one. So I have the tools. Now to number 2, my life isn’t on hold. It is not backwards. It is not regressed. It is a pause the path is waiting for me. Patiently. But do I want to get back on? Yes I do. In fact I am already on the path! A stumble to the right is not falling off! But to get back on the straight line – I just have to attend to number 2.
Cali ChicaParticipantDearest Anita,
this is IT!!!
Many mother taught me to be loyal to my sister. Essentially be a good sister and bad wife.
Yes yes yes. You put it into words. Oh what an epiphany. This is like the last one I hold onto daily :
the good is not here it is over there by this delusion I seek over there
Now this: to be a GOOD girl I must be a BAD wife
oh so brilliant – I have a slight release/joy right now for coming to this epiphany via route of your wisdom
You feel sure of and confident of Number 3 no help at all. I feel 100 percent sure of this in my bones.
But of course able to be done by understanding first. Respecting and savoring it. And With practice. Yes with practice
But anita – do you believe that by doing so I can get back on track and to my priorities. Which I was working so hard to do To my inner self and husband? Its like this. All this stuff with my sister doesn’t have me just frenzied in regards to her. It’s ocerall. It’s forgetting if I turned the stove off because my mind is a mess. It’s not asking my husband how his day was bc my mind is in circles. You get the idea and you know this pattern. It’s not living because it’s being consumed with anxiety and toxicity. I feel so off track today off the path that I quesion it. So I am asking you to explain to me the link – how will removing myself from helping her – allow me to go back to say , Cali Chica “en route of good progress” 2 months ago. I am almost there and do believe it somewhere deep down. I just need a reminder. That it is possible. And by doing number 3 I will be able to facilitate the process back on path better
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Thank you for taking the time for reading my very verbose posts. This is very interesting. And your statement about there are only two options, either no contact or having psychotherapy together over a long period of time of hard work. I understand this. I truly do. I must process it I would like to come back to this after this post. And I will. Because I do need to get more out. If that makes sense.
What I am struggling with this at this exact moment this morning is the following, I abused her. Never in a direct Sense. More as a result of the interaction with my mother which created toxicity All around. Or more because of the role that I’ve had to have in her life which led me to feel depleted, something I see now more below. But it is true I never actively directly abused my sister out of hate for her. It was that she felt so singled out by my mother, and my mother seeing me as the golden child made it that much worse for her. It is true, and I will be the first to admit my fault. I never truly abused my sister directly. Physically or emotionally. This is the truth. And if you know me well enough by now, I am no enemy of the truth. I would like to admit all of my faults to learn about what can change to increase the better mental health for all of us. Example I actively admit that I have abused my husband psychologically, and continue to do so to this day, as you saw from my previous post. was more about lashing out at her with resentment after feeling overwhelmed by her. That’s it, feeling so angered by the things that I have to do for her and then becoming quite nasty about it after-the-fact. That is very wrong, and In it’s OWN way it is abuse. I agree. But I just want to point that out that there may not be a difference in terminology or effect. Sure. But between active indifference lack of love, meanness and abuse – and something like being angry at my sister for making the same mistakes over and over and me cleaning up her messes – there is a difference to me. Maybe you’ll understand once you read more. Maybe it doesn’t even matter. its not the point of what I want to say. As the point is in the real life examples. The real feelings. The repercussions of what happens
I will try my best to explain and would like to see your feedback. Pardon me for it being a stream of conscious nest, as you can tell I am in a distressed state, this is not me two months ago that was able to write to you eloquently from a state of calm. And that is OK, the path ebbs and flows. This is a time of distress.
So here’s an example, I am a mother of a 16-year-old daughter. The daughter gets pregnant, by accident of course. She tells me. I am just stressed beyond believe, losing sleep, losing my appetite. Feeling so much emotion. Feeling angry at my daughter for her getting onto the situation. Feeling sorry for my daughter for now having the situation on her hand, and wishing that she didn’t have to go through it. Feeling angry again that finally when I had some peace and quiet that of course another bomb dropped into my life. So many things. But most of all feeling so upset for her and worried about her. It is unexplainable, it is the stress A parent feels when their child goes through something difficult or has been given a difficult piece of information.
Now you can say, well the daughter didn’t ask me to feel like this. But that is entirely irrelevant. Because by the nature of the relationship, the mother will feel this. Well a mother that cares of course. This is an something that people dissect that often, because it seems pretty obvious. The mother of course is not complaining about how she feels, because you’re focuses on her daughter at this time. The way she feels is just of course a part of nature of events and her being the mother.
Well, this exact thing happened to me a week ago. Now I by no means am telling you that I am a mother. I am not overstepping my boundaries and calling myself a high and holy mother. But in reality Anita I have had to take on this role for my sister. Not because she asked for it, and not because I forced it. It just is. So for listening/writing sake let’s keep it at that.
My sister last week started having these very strange symptoms, I told her to go to the urgent care of course. But she was home with my parents, who are beyond controlling. She explained some of this to my father, and he told her to come to the urgent care where he works at. Clearly an appropriate, as the symptoms she was experiencing were private and feminine in nature. He said that one of his female colleagues could see her, but once again inappropriate, as he would have access to the chart and read all of it and then of course be right her about anything. So my sister continues to tell me her symptoms and how she is scared and suffering, and lets me know that she is now deciding to go out to dinner with a friend that she met randomly. She is using this as an escape to get away from my crazy parents. Understandable. But here I am Anita stressed out about what she is going through. Once again not because she told me to be, but because I am a caring older sister. In that moment I have no idea what I was doing, I could’ve been climbing a mountain, or cleaning my bathroom, all of my attention and energy was focused on that. I guide her and tell her that she should ask her friend to take her to an urgent care on the way to dinner so at least that she can be checked out and get a diagnosis, and that I will pay for any expenses. Anyway it turns out that she has a pretty horrific diagnosis. No it is not cancer or that she is dying. It is not pregnancy. But it is something that is quite appalling without giving too much detail. I am besides myself for the rest of the day and night I could hardly sleep. I was so distraught over this. I felt like how could this happen to my sister, and why. I also felt sorry for her for dealing with the repercussions of this. Now just like the example above with the mother, the daughter did not ask her mother to do this. But it was the natural way for me. Of course my distress and anxiety over all this rubbed off onto my husband. Like you said it affected his health. It was his first day back to work as a surgeon Now in nyc.
Ironic isn’t it Because rewind back to two years ago when we first started our jobs elsewhere, the same exact thing happened, but it was because of my mother. I am not comparing as it is not my fault that this happened to my sister. But it’s just an example. It really doesn’t even matter this example because as you know with these things is the pattern of everything overall. Here is more.
Two years ago my sister got a training position in Phoenix. It was July a few months before wedding. A background about what was happening at that time, is that my mother was terrorizing us every day. She would call my now in-laws and send them nasty messages, call their community and try to let them know that they are evil people and that my mother is really concerned that I have to marry into this family, calling us at midnight pretending my dad is having chest pain. So much, terrible stuff, this was at a point where I literally felt like I was dying every day. You know this we talked about this all the time it is what led me to my own breaking point Anyway, it was Fourth of July weekend, my husband had that weekend off for the first time in years, he and I never get these sorts of weekends off together. Forget the holiday, what we truly needed was 24 to 48 hours and just other piece. Well my mother and sister call me the week prior and say OK well she is moving to Phoenix so when should we book your ticket? Of course as reflex I immediately start planning, I don’t even think about how my husband and I need one to two days to her self. Of course not, of course I have to jump in and help my sister. So I book a ticket and I’m ready to go. At this time my husband was not as outward as he is now. But he did mention, that he was hoping that we would have at least one or two days of peace given that we have been through such a hell storm. And that literally he and I are not sleeping or able to even function (it’s a miracle how we perform in our jobs). I say to him I totally understand, but I have to be there for my sister. Later on in the day I am telling another friend about how I am going. She said something that was very interesting to me. She says, wow that is so nice of you it is only a few months before your wedding and you have been through so much, yet you are jumping on a flight to go across the country to help your sister. Don’t you think that she would be able to manage on her own, because it’s not like she’s really moving anything physically. I said to her yeah, but she’s my baby sister so I always support her. It’s her first time moving out of state.
And then it occurred to me, there was no question about me going. It was just assumed, it was assumed by my sister and mother, but equally it was assumed by me. Not once did I question whether I had a choice. A CHOICE. Doesn’t this sound familiar Anita, just like with my mother, I never thought to myself that I had a choice to engage in a conversation with her even if I was in the middle of something important with my husband. Never did I think I had a choice to perhaps not pick up the phone if I was in the middle of a work emergency. Nope, my mother was always a priority, it was instant yes. Similarly I jumped on this plane and went to Phoenix. The entire time I thought extremely guilty about my decision knowing that I really didn’t need to be there at all, all it was was my mother and I hanging out with my sister while she put some things in her apartment away. But of course I was there for support. But what did Cali Chica need that weekend? did she need to take a six hour flight to Arizona for 24 hours and rush back. And have perhaps six hours with her husband before they go back on their crazy call schedules as doctors. Know what she needed was some mental peace for at least 12 hours. But she never preserves that, she didn’t know she had the choice. No choice at all. Family above all. No thought. Of course this was not even in the question. I ended up mentioning something slightly before I left for my flight. My mom made a snide remark about how I was only staying for 24 hours. And I said to her, or TRIED there’s only so much I can do, the fact that I came across the country just for a day, that’s all I can because I am trying to get back to spend some time with my fiancé. I FEEL SO SO GUILTY saying this is hardly comes out without me brushing it off. My sister remarks, well of course you would come, I’m moving across the country. Of course you would.
And that’s JUST it. Of course I would come Anita. Of course!!!! Of course! Without a question. Assumed. And why not, whh wouldn’t it be. It was never a pattern to be otherwise. why didn’t I say to them, sorry I can’t make it I know that you are moving across the country but you have mom, and I can’t make it for just 24 hours, my fiancé and I really need this time for my mental health. Why didn’t I say that? Of course I didn’t say that. Do you want to know why Anita? Because this is what my mother would say, and my sister would believe it too. My mother would say oh, now that you have a man in your life you forgot about your own family, look how quickly your priorities change, look how you are helping him and not us. See if it was him you would jump to do anything (not true at all as I threw him on the back burner and did nothing for him and everything for Mom and sis) but look she would say you forgot about your poor sister and helping her. What kind of sister does this, what should we expect of you when you get married, figured You will just throw out your family and your sister. I not only felt guilty by this I truly believed this, so of course without a thought I ran over. Always. Of course. This is a key paragraph.
So what about this?
The Phoenix story, and my being there for her strange diagnosis two weeks ago. These are just two, these things happen almost every month. While in Phoenix she was dating some guy, it didn’t work out, and she was so distraught that she thought that she would have to leave her training program. I had to Set her down, over the phone of course, and talk to her and tell her that she would be OK, that it was going to be fine, I then got on the phone with her director, and was able to explain to her that she was having some mental health troubles and that she would need some personal days. I got her in touch with a psychiatrist of course continue to follow up.
And I was glad I was there for her, but it continues to go in circles, not in a straight line. Two months later or something similar, another boy, not that that’s the case. But feeling like she can’t pass the exam that she has because she can’t stop thinking about all this crazy stuff. Then again later a breaking point over the summer, when she was at my parents house and they were driving up up the wall and she hit another breaking point. I know what you may say perhaps, or perhaps what anyone would say. That I’m not supposed to be her therapist, and that she needs professional help. Of course, and she does have other resources. But that is not the entire point. Just like my example above, the mother of this newly teen pregnant girl is still going to be affected. She can seek therapy and so kind a daughter. But it is hard to not be affected and consumed by such. And the funny thing is Anita, I’m not even a parent yet
My mother and sister have hardly any respect for my relationship for my husband. And let’s take my mother aside, the thought of my sister. I have never made it a priority. I didn’t act like a 32-year-old before the Phoenix example and say. I know sister that you are moving across the country but I know that you are going to handle on your own just fine. And that we have set everything up (I found her apartment and all for her and other logistics) This is an important time for me to have some mental health and sanity or else I will be at my breaking point. So I will not be able to come for 24 hours to Phoenix. I hope you can understand.
Nope I never did say that. There was ZERO space for it, because as above, and I don’t want to reiterate, this would be the response of my mother, and quite possibly my sister
I don’t want credit, but my health and my husband‘s health is depleted and on the line. We made so much progress and instantly and the two weeks that she has been around we feel entirely different. It is because of me. Is is not her fault. It is because of the way I act around her, it is because I become consumed by her and what she’s going through. Yes I know. Because of the ingrained patterns that we have, over the years that are so deeply entrenched in us.
I know I am not really the mother of this teen parent. But in that scenario it was nothing different. She was the teen girl with this new horrific diagnosis. And I was her supporter. That’s it. The teen girl goes off and lives her life and accepts it and is relatively fine, but the mother was affected too. And for examples sake, the mother’s new boyfriend is affected because this mother has been so distraught and disheveled over the last three days it has affected him too creating angst for him.
I know all of this might not be that coherent, as it is a stream of consciousness. But what I would tell someone like me is this, you need to focus on your own health and your husband’s health first right now. Yes your sister might see you as an abuser in the past. Yes she has passive aggressive anger. Yes. All that.
But what about me? (For analogy sake) What about the fact that being this mother to those teen pregnant child has now made me lose my “boyfriend” Has now made me have to go on antidepressants. Has now made me have trouble coping. See the teenage girl is dealing it with her own way but she is out with her friends living her life today. But what is Mom doing?
She comes home and says mom, I’m fine, why are you so upset? And then the mother may lash out. (Which is not the right way) but She feels angry and frustrated. But all in all, she doesn’t know how to not feel like this because she is a mother after all.
What about coming back from Phoenix depleted, and that not having any energy or reserve for my husband so feeling like I want to lash out at him, but also feeling resentful that my sister had no understanding of such. What a lose lose situation.
She may be angry Anita, she may see me as abusive in the past Anita but what about all this.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by Cali Chica.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Sorry for my rage and venting tone – I wanted to add one more thing. It is hard to explain but perhaps you’ll be able to see what I mean when we speak next.
Its that in a way I act immature and childish as a way to make my mother (and sister) happy. It was always a default to entertain them and make them laugh and feel less alone. It was a default role I was given years ago without asking for it, it became innate – not the personal fault of anyone. It’s that oh when Cali Chica comes home she “lights up the house.” I would have friends over and stories and bring my sister here and there. I helped create a life for her. Entertainment. And as for my mom – well there was so much of that to help make her happy. Of course it never worked. So his is the root of this immature scatter brained silly clownish behavior. That at this age and stage is useless, immature, and clearly something I nor my husband want around. With that – and this is huge. I NEVER learned respect for marriage from my mother. As you know. It’s all about what was over there. Not here. Moreover, and this is difficult to explain – I think I deep down inside feel guilty – so I will quickly push aside respect for my husband and instead “clown around” with my sister. Not because she asks me to – but it is a way I relate to her and also not make her feel like she doesn’t have “me.” This is silly because clearly she and anyone knows that I am a married woman and I have other priorities too. But it’s not them it’s me. I instantly do this and almost downplay my maturity responsibility and my husband/marriage as a priority.
Here’s a small example. Before she left today she’s like do you want to sleepover. She was half joking. But in reality if I didn’t downplay it so much, a younger sister wouldn’t ask her older married sister (whose house she’s at) to come sleepover at hers. She didn’t mean harm by this.
My example is that it’s My behavior. I act foolish. I act childish. I don’t act like a mature married woman. Instead I “stoop down” to a fun kid that I assume would be relatable for her. I disregard that my husband should be my priority and act silly – so that she feels happy and included. I do this all subconsciously. Because see when it’s the three of us hanging out it was always fine. Just like family. But when I act like this it doesn’t help anyone. My sister isn’t asking me to. And she’s younger and influenced by me – so it’s an act she follows. If I act all silly and foolish- and the next day say gosh you being here makes me all frenzied and makes my husband annoyed. Well that’s on me.
Juat wanted to add that. The first post and the example about how she reacted to the gift are still relavent. And those are on her. But in this world I must focus on what I can change. And perhaps that’s my behavior – and allow my husband some space away from the ups and downs.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
my sister came over for dinner today as my husband was going to give us our Xmas presents (it was a group surprise so he wanted us to receive it together). All in all – long story short. After he left he was at a tipping point. It is hard to explain but over a year ago when things got really bad with my mother it began to really affect him. This is because of how it affected me. It’s that being around my mother / her energy would change me into a different person. Of course that was on me, but her presence would turn me into this person who non stop entertains talks, makes people laugh, on on on, a manic energy. And also an angry resentful person for the despair and desperation the person brings
I do the same with my sister. And after our conversations I tried to be more aware of it, but inevitably it is still there and would take a ton of conscious effort to be aware of and even change. That is a conversation in itself
Anyway – so one small example for today about my sister is that she decided not to come to his parents party for Xmas and so we brought the gift home from his parents. (This example is not about a gift or material thing, but a concept). She opens it and says thank you and all. Then a short while later begins saying how it’s not something she would use, or a brand she likes as it isn’t what people wear anymore. I quickly jump in and say oh don’t worry we can exchange it – or find something else at the store. Feeling quite bad she is saying this in front of my husband. Like hello what NOT to say when his mother kindly got you a sweet gift and invited you to their home
Once again only a small example this entry of mine today is not about that – it’s about a breaking point
So ar the end of the night after my sister leaves, my husband who never complains or brings things up unless he is at his WITS END – said. Wow after all that your sister is sitting there acting like she is too good for a gift from my parents. She literally has no self awareness or respect. He is angry he is fuming. He is beyond frustrated
He spoke about a few more things, and the way I act like a manic frenzied person when she is around (absolutely true, and feels uncontrollable and automatic). I saw in him what I’ve only seen once before. A man who literally has nothing left. I saw this months before I went no contact with my mother. He is so frustrated tears are almost coming out of his eyes. Like someone who has given his all (he has and you’ve read this in the past)
He said – now that he has the insight of my family – that he is sick and tired of the same thing over and over. And that my sister being around is starting to feel just like that. (Background he is amazingly supportive of her in all ways ) – but the combination of her energy, the way she acts, and MOST importantly the way I act and who I turn into around her – is just too much.
I see it exactly clearly. If someone on the outside heard this they would think of this as simply a husband annoyed with his wife’s family. But this is not that. It is the feeling of toxicity and anxiety creeping in. It is above all when someone has had enough they have nothing left. This is after years of torture and trauma from my mother.
We made SOO much progress over the past 2 months while at his parents house and away. And it feels like it is all undone, a huge step back. He said it himself – and he usually would be positive and optimistic. But he spoke the truth. We are back where we started. It feels terrible- it is terrible – and foolish it feels too
It has gotten so bad over the last 2 weeks. Over the last 2 weeks I am agitated and anxious at almost every moment. I have had horrendous insomnia, and my anxious energy of course transfers to him. I’ve been negative and ruminating – and nothing like the progress I have made.
Bow ofncourse this is multifactorial and I do know some biological triggers for anxiety in me that I am working on. But I do also know that as soon as my sister decided to move here it has been overwhelmed by her. Her coming over. Asking us which apartment. Not even having furniture or a second to breathe but immediately sitting down and helping her find an apartment. It being present for even a second about this new chapter we are starting because now it’s abour helping her sell her car and how she will do this and that. Going to the bank to get her money. Bam our vacation and week to ease into nyc life is over. Where did it go? These are all small and simple things. These are normal. This is perfectly fine. But it’s the emotional aspect of it. I do feel I have been entirely enveloped in her, and as a result it has become all about her for my husband too. I don’t just blame myself though. The example today about the purse gift she received is just one – she does not have awareness of how she comes off to others – and I make excuses for it – but at a certain point others will have low tolerance especially when they are putting so much energy into assisting you.
I dunno Anita. It leaves me in a tough spot. It’s not a choose my husband or her situation. No it’s not. But I know first of all I need to change my behavior around her. I turn into an immature lunatic with frenzied energy that doesn’t relax. It is on me to change that. I also no that some distance is key. My husband just started a very tough new job and I should have respect for this and not constantly dig him deeper into family drama. It is inevitable sure. But I can have boundaries and spend time with my sister elsewhere and less often. That would be better for all. She came over with a sense of loneliness and feeling lost. But I know that I can not help her. We talked about this earlier and I let that sink and savor.
What i know is that my sister has to find her path. If along the way this destroys my marriage because the effect it has on me (and as a result my husband) that is not okay. She is not the one destroying it- I would be letting the situation create harm. So in reality it is the situation. A tough one and how to do damage control.
I know Anita something must change – I feel as horrible as I did right before no contact – and it’s hard to explain What the situation is exactly. It’s about energy and interaction and not what my sister and I truly said or did. It’s her dog peeing all over the floor and her slowly getting up, and or having a reflex sorry,while I run there and clean it all up. It’s not about cleaning – it’s about the difference in reaction and personality. And if I or anyone else was in that situation would quickly get up and apologize. It’s aboit getting a gift from someone who really is being nice as they aren’t your own family. And after opening it saying to my husband oh it’s not a brand People really use I feel bad. It’s not about the purse it’s aboit respect. It’s about feeling like my husband and I are parents to her. And no, not because I am being domineering. Because she truly needs us. Who else will pay for her first 2 months rent? Who else will help her navigate adulthood like selling her car. Who else would help her find this job. All that though Anita is the easy part. I do it gladly. So does my husband. It’s not about those thugs. It’s that my husband is at a breaking point. Perhaps I just need to do a better job at acting mature around her and not regressing back into a CHILD. Or perhaps I need to see she is a trigger and create space. Perhaps I am expecting too much of my own self during this time of HEALING for me. How easily I forgot that I am still healing aren’t I. No wonder I feel like utter garbage – I’m still healing – how could I take on this…?
- This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by Cali Chica.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by Cali Chica.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
That is wonderful and succinct advice. I agree wholeheartedly. I am impressed by your ability to map out complex concepts and put them into – simply the truth.
After all, all of the progress that I have made in understanding what the truth is, and being able to progress in my life has come down to simple phrases hasn’t it? Oh so long ago it seems you said to me, get off the crazy train. You explained me that the only way I had a chance at a saying a normal life is to not have my mother in it. Oh how complex it all seemed back then, and Surely it is, entries and entries, stories upon stories. But what did it all come down to? That I should not have contact with my mother. Simply this. Time and again no matter what the story. It came back to this. Because – after all this is the truth, I am living the truth every day. Just like above, I must leave my sister alone, I am not helping her. The help she needs cannot possibly come from me.
It makes sense to me why I would get so distraught when I was “helping” her. Because Did not see the light: I was not really helping her at all. so that got me even more frustrated given that I was putting out immense effort. But this is not the way. This is not the path. Not for myself. Not for her – not for anyone.
It makes perfect sense Anita, my job is to protect her from abuse, it is not to “help“ her.
I will let this sink and savor, I would like to write to you more later on today
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita
so very well put. Thank you. I do agree, and can see why she feels abused by me. In fact, I did not actively physically abuse her, and during her formative years, I wasn’t always present. However, I will say that my role in her life because of my mother was often very abusive. To elaborate, if I came home from college it became all about me, my mother would use me as a way to put her down further. Perhaps I also added to that without even knowing. Perhaps I added to that actively as well. Or, I would go along with my mother. It was her and I against my younger sister. Given that my mother saw her and I as one, and felt like I was her chummy other half, I can look back and see how many times I just went along with my mother. I recall a dance recital during which my sister was unable to perform as expected, and my mother was devastated. I recall feeling quite torn, I was there for my sister and feel angry at my mother for putting so much pressure on a young girl, however I did not take my sister in my arms and say it is OK and that my mother was wrong. Of course not, only now do I have such insight, and so much more.
I do agree that an order for my sister to heal, she does have to spend time away. I also see that this is what she is trying to do without saying the word. I do not believe that my sister and I have to be a no contact. I do believe that this will be more harmful for both of us then beneficial. But, understanding that my sister is not my mother, and vice versa, there is a lot of good to the relationship. Given that she does have more insight and capability that my mother, and so do I, I do believe that our relationship can strengthen over time in respect, as we can both heal independently.
Yesterday I thought a lot about what we spoke about. I went for a jog, something I have not done in a long time. I was able to jog more than normal, caught up in my thoughts about all of this. When I finish my job, I realized, like many things in my life I do try to control my sister. I have been so caught up and what has allowed me to heal, that I push it on her. Without any understanding that I too was an abuser of her. Addition, my tone and manner can be very domineering at times, and although I do believe it comes from a good place, that is hardly the point right now. What this person needs is protection from abuse. That is simply it.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I am also thinking about one of your first comments today, the fact that you wrote that when you were unwell you thought that you could help your sister. And that perhaps I believe that I can help my sister. I wonder if that is still relevant given our conversation thus far. Perhaps it is true, I need to stray away from how much I try to “help” my sister and simply try to “protect her from abuse”. I wonder what that means, I am sure we can elaborate more tomorrow as I know you will be heading away from the computer
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
It is a difficult concept indeed. I guess I feel that I AM protecting her from abuse by steering her in the right direction, by offering support, by sharing my now family. But I also see that she is likely overwhelmed by a lot of this, and also needs to find her way. I guess I also feel that by instilling values in her, that I have now learned, I am protecting her – that I am guiding her. Helping her navigate away from the life of distraction, outwardness, and escapism – to inward focused life. (not with me or for me per se, for herself).
Perhaps, my tone and manner and intention must change. Showing her hard and tough love and guidance is not going to work for someone who feels abused by me. Perhaps gentle support but with some boundary is better. Clearly this person does not need to feel more battered or abused.
And in the sense that I feel quite overwhelmed by her, like the intervention in my prior post, perhaps it is better for me to provide this sort of support – as the more depleted and resentful I become, the more abusive I would be as well.
It reminds me in a way of being a parent. I don’t need to be her parent, she can find her own way – yet when she suffers and has breaking points, it is hard for me to not swoop in and be the guiding parent.
I take away from this that over involving myself, and taking on her issues is not helpful for her, and if it leads me to be angry and resentful to her, it is even more abusive towards her.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I know I am still missing your point, so would like you to elaborate. I will say I can see how she feels I am abusive, but also I know she sees me as her sole support…
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
you wrote “your sister believes that you sometimes abuse her”
I see. In a way I understand as well. I have often been such a strong domineering personality. I have put her down many times in my life, making it known I resented her, or that she burdened me with her problems or inadequacies. I know this has not been easy for her. This combined with my mother she felt like the black sheep. That cali chica could do no harm, yet she was incapable and never good enough. I of course never instilled that in her (my mother did) but I can’t say I did not contribute to it, when I was always “hard on her”
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I know exactly what you mean. And have even thought about this.. Here’s the thing. Sometimes I think about how she is harmed “more” and sometimes I don’t. In reality, she is not harmed more. To be quite honest I think about it more like this, my mother is the victimizer and my sister and I are BOTH the victims. (in reality it is not a concept that she or I or anyone had it “worse” because the true reality is that we suffered from a mother who did not provide us true love, foundation, and support)
The way I see it is like this, and sorry if it is graphic. There are 2 girls who are raped by the same man. One is older, and has some more things going on in her life. The other is younger. They both suffered trauma and abuse from this man.
Now, the older one, has made progress to work through her trauma, and she is extending a hand to the younger one. But – as you can see, it is impossible for this rape victim to help the other one process her trauma. Not only is it not possible, it also makes the older one regress back into traumatic patterns and ways.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Thank you for creating the space for me to describe my current relationship with her.
Over the summer she was at home with my parents, I did not hear about her distress everyday, as she knew that it was not something I wanted to hear about. But as it goes, it does not matter if someone TELLS you what is going on in their life, their dysfunction is the result. Thus, over the summer one day while she was living with my parents, she had a terrible breaking point. I drove from my in laws (where I was staying before vacation like I mentioned) and met her, and helped her “get back on track.” It was a mixture of tough love, hope, and pep talk. Along the lines of “you can do it” but you have to “toughen up” and believe in yourself. The acute issue was her passing an exam (that she failed the first time as she was unable to focus being around my parents) and getting a job so she could move out, and the overall was her feeling extremely depressed and hopeless. This is not the first time I have had to do something like this. It is natural for me. But you know what, I have felt the same as well. Us growing up in this toxic household we all felt like that often. But, I have now chosen a “different” life – she is still stuck.
Anyway, when I am driving back from this “intervention” – I feel only what someone on the path would be able to understand. I feel my entire body and brain scream out – as though it has been poisoned. Here I was enjoying a week at my in laws in peace, and this felt like a HUGE set back. Why? One would say – why is it a set back, you were helping your sister, she has the problem not you. But no, as you understand, it became my problem, it became my being. I felt so tense I felt I could snap, and was shaking. I immediately noticed I was feverishly biting my nails (a nervous and anxious habit I left a long time ago, and is a huge indication of unease for me). I arrived home, and from that moment forward I transferred all this negative and tense energy onto my husband. of course – it is subconscious, and especially with what we have been through with my mother he is quite keen and aware of my energy. So its 2 am, and I am tossing and turning and so is he. It is about 4 days before our epic month trip, and instead we should be relaxing and thinking about that. Well, should isn’t really exactly the right term. Anyway, he also snaps at that moment – and we are both laying there feeling like – wow it never ends does it. We have 2 months off as doctors at the same exact time – so hard to coordinate! we are about to depart on our belayed honeymoon, and finally enjoy time to ourselves (as you know how tainted everything from the proposal to wedding was – no need to explain) and here I am, but moreover, HE is sitting there feeling terrible.
So of course, then I feel angry. I feel angry at my sister, feel angry at my parents for harassing and torturing her to no end and contributing to her breakdown, feel angry at myself for pushing all these feelings onto my husband, and then feel angry at my husband for no reason at all. I feel so angry and frustrated that I literally could snap and explode. over the next few days my sister felt better and motivated, and i left for my trip knowing she would pass her exam and find a way – as I had guided her and she does have the capability deep down inside. I am also sitting there and thinking “wow, I am not judging her – but if getting out of that house is not motivating what is? if i had failed the exam that first time, I would do ANYTHING in my power to pass that second time and find an independent path for myself. Yet, she needs me to remind her that and put her on track. it is hard for her to focus I know, but somehow I feel that the courage to find a way out of that demon place should make her excel and rise above We are different, but she is battered and troubled and dealing with severe anxiety. The effects my mother had on her are in many ways worse than me, so I can not blame her per se, but she needs major help. At least for now I hopefully got her back on track.”
I fast forward to the trip, it was truly enjoyable and I was not in communication with anyone outside a few random emails here and there. We were able to enjoy the trip without outside problems, and it was a platform for me to practice what we talk about is most important – focus on myself and future family.
So we return around thanksgiving. My sister is pleased to say she passed her exam, and now is looking for jobs. she had a terrible time at home, and was using all sorts of escapes to get away from my parents as much as she could. hanging out with anyone possible (even if she didn’t love the company), trying to find hobbies, all sorts of things. she finds a job in nyc finally. I am happy for her, but nervous about her being so close as well. We are as close as could be and have lots of fun together, yet she triggers me in a way that I can not describe. That you have described so well in the past – that even if she doesn’t do something it is triggering, as it is the pattern of our history and interaction.
So now we are in the present, I had another intervention with her last week. More of a sit down and lets talk things out type of thing. I mentioned to her that we do not have a strong foundation of love and stability given our parents. She has been going to therapy and has a lot of insight on this too. So we talk about how seeking distractions and escapism will not lead to any change or growth.. And instead, she has to face her fears head on, and focus on wholesome people and activities. — to be continued below
Also, I have a wonderful family now, my husband and his family. And they have always been very welcomming to my family (parents always but thats the past) and sister current. In fact, my mother in law knows a lot of what went on at my parents house over the summer and stated that if my sister ever needed support or a place to stay she is always welcome. The holidays are a time where my family was always invited to theirs.. My sister joined my husband and I for their big family party this past Saturday, it was loads of fun, and she knows all the cousins very well.
So in short, it I guess feels that I am “sharing” my wholesome stable family with her, since she does not have her own. I am making her apart of it, I am spreading that support and love – not just of myself but of my husband and his parents. I guess I believe since it has helped me and is a positive influence, it will be for her.
So after this intervention above, that you read, and this holiday part on Saturday. the plan was to go to my in laws for xmas eve/day. I assumed she would come with us, as who else would she spend time with? not my crazy parents? and she lives in nyc where she is new.
She informs me that coming to my in laws will be triggering for her and she does not want to come. I say I understand, but tell her it will be a positive environment and its just us, not a party. She mentions that her whole life it has always been about me. She only sees the world through my eyes (background ever since she was a little girl, I would always take her out with my friends, and bring her, and have her experience things) – she says she wants to also start building her own life, and learn to experience nyc on her own. I totally understaand this, and in fact during the intervention I had stressed to her the importance of building her own identity and life..
but..I say – this is Christmas, you have all the time in the world to do that, but on a holiday like this it should be spent with loved ones, and you have us (my husband is like an older brother to her in many ways). She then says how she will be spending time with a friend (random person she just met) and this new guy shes kind of dating. she states that she didn’t want to tell me about him as she doesn’t know where it is going to go.
I accept it.
We are at Xmas, and my in laws ask where she is. I make up an excuse. They even have a gift ready for her, and I say I’ll have her open it when I get back. They are not annoyed at all, just slightly confused as to why she is not there – also knowing how much she is in need of “support and familly.” On the drive back, my husband was visibly frustrated. It was Christmas Day, and I had a feeling why. So we begin to talk about it. He states (not in these exact terms) that he is disappointed and annoyed with my sister. That all we do is constantly go out on a limb for her, find her support and resources and all, but she does whatever she wants.. That it was silly and stupid to go hang out with random people on Xmas especially after all she has been through recently, and thinking she understood the value of true support. not to mention how he felt it was disrespectful to his parents (not because they were at all affected) but because he is sick and tired of himself and his parents constantly helping my family. of course he was angry, but he is right Anita. He is Absolutely right.
I spend the rest of the day yesterday feeling awful, almost as bad as I did those weeks before I went no contact with my mom. I felt angry at my sister for being such an immature flake, but also understanding that she is lost and wants to find her way. I felt angry at myself for allowing yet another aspect of my family ruin a nice relaxing day. I felt angry at myself for getting consumed by others. i have a friend S, her sister is in a terrible marriage with no end in sight, yet S – lives her OWN life. She doesn’t suffer for her sister day in and day out. She lives her own life.
But I don’t. I don’t even know how to. I know where it stems from. My mother did not teach us love, shes taught us enmeshment. She equated boundaries and personal space as selfishness. She taught me it was my job to make her happy and save her,and make her life better. Well the same goes with my sister.. From a young age she made it known that my sister was unhappy and didn’t have a good life, so I, being the functional, likable, popular one, should guide my sister. I should uplift her. This was no fault of my sister, as it started before she even knew. Of course as she got older, she built a life of her own – but in many ways not entirely – look at the example of the intervention before my vacation. this has happened countless times, having to call her directors to speak with them about allowing her some personal days off. feeling like I should fly to the other side of the country because she states she felt suicidal. helping her find a psychiatrist, list goes on – all things a sister “should” do. but it is all encompassing. perhaps i am disappointed that after all that, the sit down with her last week and everything, she still decides to be hasty and didn’t learn a thing. it is not about Christmas, it is about priorities. which she does not have. she has no foundation or priorities.
I know why, it is this toxic upbringing.. She has made so much progress, and we both have awareness about our mother we never had. But perhaps thats not enough.. She is not me. I perhaps assume she has the courage, capability, and awareness of myself – but she does not. I must accept that.
and perhaps it is becoming clearer and clearer – I can not make her better or teach her. Perhaps I have to let her go. Perhaps – I can not help her. Perhaps she is not “helpable” – yes maybe not at all.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by Cali Chica.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I wonder if you have read my second post – if not, read please before this reply. As I want to speak to you overall, and not just about my sister.
And YES, you have had the opportunity to communicate with her. This rings in my ears daily for the last 2 weeks. I even said it out loud to my husband many times, and most recently last night – something along the lines of,” even Anita (who has not met her) believes that I can not help her, and perhaps she is not “helpable” and that she does have many qualities like my mother – that she too, may never truly get better.”
I don’t mean to misquote you, or to assume that is exactly what you meant – but I do know it was along that wavelength and a HUGE epiphany for me. Also that my efforts are in vain – you mentioned my consistent investment and efforts enable her, they do not help her. Just like my mother, it is all in vain. It is simply useless perhaps! It leaves me exhausted and depleted – and leads her to perhaps some understanding (transient) but no the fruits do NOT outweigh the labor for anyone.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by Cali Chica.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by Cali Chica.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I am not sure if you read my prior post already. If you did, that is okay. I want to write this anyway.
It was wrong of me to write this way, after not speaking over a month. Our interaction has been WIN WIN as you say. It has surely been a win for me, and quite life changing, and I do think it has been a win for you. I want to keep it this way, for now, and for however long we wish. I respect our interaction, and am grateful for it.
Thus, there is plenty more going on in my life than just the above. Most importantly, I did not even ask how you are. I assume you are well, and I do wonder about you everyday. I do hope in the near future I can learn more about your life and your husband – I admire your journey – and the path. I too am on the path now – so I can have a deeper understanding of those that are on their own.
Life is good Anita, and I have made a heck of a lot of progress. I credit this to seeing the light myself, with the assistance of my husband, and you.
Yes, there are steps forward and back, pebbles flowing off and on the unpaved road that is the path – but I (we) should never discredit our net positive forward movement on the path. This morning, I was doing such – and there is no need for it. Because beating yourself for stumbling off leads to no results.
I am glad to be honest with you, now and always. As without honesty with yourself, and closest confidantes, there is no authentic growth or change. Yet, sometimes honesty can be mistaken for allowing one aspect of your life to overwhelm the entire thing. It may feel candid, but it is up to us to CONTAIN and damage control – it is only up to us.
Anyway, I do hope to hear from you soon – when you feel up to it. I am glad to be back in touch, I know that this new chapter for me is starting with a lot more maturity and awareness than when I first spoke to you 2 years ago. For this I am wiser and grateful.
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