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February 4, 2019 at 9:03 am in reply to: "If its meant to happen, it will" vs "If you truly want something, go get it" #278591Cali ChicaParticipant
Dear SRK,
I too, have deal with this question often, especially given my background, I have read and been “taught’ from the Bhagvad Gita often.
I like that you put both quotes down, especially since so much of what society tells us is – go get em!
I personally believe that both of these are not in conflict with each other per se – although they do come across very different.
The first quote from the Gita, emphasizes the concept of not “expecting” when doing good. In essence, doing good without expectation of good in return.
The second quote emphasizes, the fact that when you truly, authentically want something – it will happen in due time.
To me, the first, like much of the Gita, emphasizes the idea of “good” – to do good – is to do it, and not necessarily only when you’re expecting good back. If that makes sense.
To me, the second – focuses on a different concept, not necessarily good versus evil, but the concept of that “dreams” can come true if we truly believe in them, authentically, and put the appropriate energy out into the world. Of course, this is not a “given” as we know the universe does not work as “tit for tat.” We do not just get what we think we deserve if we pray hard enough, wish hard enough. We usually end up with what is best suited for us, not only what we always “think” we need/deserve.
Anyway, this may sound rambling – but I would love to know more of what the specific parts of the quotes you are struggling with. I too, have felt confused by such after a “string” of difficult times in my own life. I will wait for you to respond before elaborating more.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Starve the devil! By paying it no attention, observing it, notice it – but do not give in, do not feel it fuel or power – do not entertain the devil.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Self focused it is.
I did have a self focused weekend. I did notice a lot. I noticed that although self focused, the mother voice of course is present, perhaps not always, but is there lingering in the background – omnipresent in some form in that way.
I noticed that there is the “new” Cali Chica way of thinking, that is not forced, but often coming from a place of calm – but there is also the devil on the other shoulder, questioning or mocking it. Perhaps the “angel” and the “devil” on the shoulders such as they show in cartoons or TV – we can call it that for conversation sake.
Here’s an example:
1 -My mother in law asks, what are you doing for the super bowl:
Angel: oh we are invited to a party, but will likely stay home to relax, as we have an early morning Monday
Devil: oh how sad, sitting at home, I saw so many people in the lobby getting dressed to go out to parties, look how fun
2 – my friend on the phone mentions her plans for Super bowl:
angel: oh that sounds so fun, I think we are going to lay low this year
devil: oh, that sounds fun, how social. it sounds lonely to do nothing, and lame, let me make sure my friend knows we have options to do something fun too.
I observed this. The angel response was not contrived, it was innate and natural. It was real. But when devil reared his head, I did feel this feeling rise in me – the feeling to overcompensate, to explain, perhaps a feeling of guilt or shame?
interesting – I am glad I observed.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I re read your post about the elk. What a beautiful natural example. I thought about this often when I was in Africa a few months ago, seeing a lion, and a leopard. A sight to see – in their own habitat. So calm and majestic in one breath, and ready to attack nonetheless. The balance of these emotions/states – innate to such an animal.
Yet we aren’t such animals. We are not by nature ferocious hunting carnivores. Yet, we may feel like that some days, ready to attack – on edge, ready to pounce. Such as I did that day after yoga, attacking my husband – with my claws out, ready to fight.
Saying – “get close and I’ll attack” not thinking what “close” meant – good or bad. Nope, just ready to fight. Showing off those claws.
I see my sweet dog, a gentle being. Yet, if provoked, can easily change demeanor – the beauty of an animal, the alertness, the innate sense. I find it admirable.
Yet, in a human, in me – it served me – when my mother was lurking around every corner, I had my claws, ready to attack, to shield. Saying – okay what now – I’m ready bring it. And so even when the fearful predator is nowhere to be find now, the claws don’t automatically retract, we are still ready – I am still ready. And slowly – I know, I will retract, into a resting position, when I know it is safe. When I feel safe.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
When selfless you get angry and want to retaliate by being selfish.
yes! it is going from one extreme to another, being ravenous and then over eating as a result – now uncomfortably overstuffed. all or nothing, neither feeling/state is healthy or useful/good.
I prefer the term self-focused. and thank you for using the term sensibly. I like the term of sensibility, it makes SENSE. That is just it, coming from a place that makes SENSE. We have an innate guidance of common sense most of the time, we just over look it.
I used to get caught up in others that are selfish, oh it doesn’t seem stupid for them on the long term, they seem to get away with it. It doesn’t matter. For ME and most of us, being selfish or selfless is stupid! AS you say.
To be authentic is to be sensible.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 9 months ago by Cali Chica.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I am glad you shortened your walk, this is not a weakness, but you also being “inward” and listening to what your body needs.
Yes, when I read the concept of inward oriented, as an outsider, as when you wrote it just now – it almost sounds silly!
Well inward oriented, where else would you be? Funny how it seems this way, yet the “innate” sense of thinking of yourself first, or prioritizing yourself – for someone like me with my history – is foreign and a deliberate practice.
I also want to note that I would have read this prior as “selfish” or “self-centered” yet, it is so far from that. In fact I have noticed a trend – when I am NOT, inward – I will retaliate out of anger – “gosh, why can’t I be more focused on MYSELF, agh! Well screw that I am going to be SELFISH today.”
This in fact is much more detrimental than being cool calm and inward from the get go.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
How was your walk yesterday. Happy friday. I had a very good pleasant and calm week. I felt very inward oriented. I felt that I checked in with myself about what I was feeling, what I needed, what I truly felt in the situation. There is always time for this, although at times it feels like it would be unnecessary or a damper. There is always time for checking in with yourself, only good can come from knowing yourself first before you even attempt to tackle your surroundings.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I agree. I will create this calm environment to approach the scenario with my sister. That is an excellent idea given that such a scenario requires calm energy as a prerequisite.
N is no where close to my sister, in a way shes a nobody, but a somebody as she was involved in my wedding, and was a “good” friend back in my 20s. Someone who brought glitter like you said. but no substance.
I have removed many such people in my life over the last year – the last year since speaking to my parents. Removing insignificant people is of course easier.
As an aside.
Do you believe that anxiety creates constant “seeking” as a response to fear. Do you think in a way, it is a way of fleeting, or always having a survival instinct, thus always seeking something out. Unable to sit with what just is – seeking elsewhere, or more.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
You are right. I do need to create a scenario, and practice – here with you. I will think about this now and through the weekend. As at this time, I do not have the correct mindset to approach it.
Speaking of, I know now that some days our mindset allows us to approach certain topics/situations, and sometimes not. If we are able to – and we can – we should protect ourselves and approach accordingly – to create less distress.
So today – thinking about my sister feels foreign, I will approach it when my mind is ready.
Today is a very cold day here, perhaps the coldest of the year. Interesting as I have always dreaded winter and these cold days, as of course when you are already feeling low, the cold does not help. I look back at feeling worse during the winter often, and thriving in the sun. I look back and felt that the winter was to blame often.
I see that sure the winter may exacerbate feeling down or low, for just about anyone – but surely it is not to blame.
It always felt external all of it Anita. I feel this way, because of this person, this situation, what they DID to me, what this made me feel like, because of the weather, because of many things.
But like my post yesterday, It is news to me that I actually do have control over myself and approach to life. What a concept!
It is interesting, taking N out of my life – I ended up actually having to block her by the way, as she was shameless in her texting and “fake” interest in my life in random spurt when convenient to her – and just the sight of her meaningless flakey messages added toxicity I did not need.
So taking someone like this out of my life, not someone instrumental in it, but someone there in my life for many years in some form – even not a large form – creates space.
I feel a small amount – 1 percent – increase of space. I am appreciative of this one percent increase of space. I am glad that it serves as a reminder. When we remove toxicity, space returns in a different form.
It returns, and we may not be aware of it – but even without our consent, energy and space come and go. They slip away when we don’t have strong boundaries, and they return when our boundaries remain intact.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
It is a path of creating rather than reacting
Thank you for this great quote. How true. So far, when I work on doing no harm, I am creating a new habit, not just simply reacting based on patterns and habit.
Interesting you mention my sister, I was thinking earlier how we haven’t spoken much, but I am sure in the next month or so – I will have an interaction with her – which to be perfectly honest, i don’t look forward to – I dread.
I do not miss spending time and talking to her. It is important to be honest with yourself and admit such things even if they do not sound nice. So I do not miss our interaction. In fact, over the last few years, it has been more guilt oriented than anything. The fun times are like you’ve stated, a respite from the distress. A “respite” during which I am still ON and not turning OFF.
Do no harm/no help must be practiced in life circumstances that are small and large, before we are able to employ them with people who are very emotionally triggering. I am glad I am doing practice with daily routine, so that – hopefully – when larger circumstances arise, I have a sense of what protecting my spirit feels like
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
I think mood is interesting. We spoke a few weeks ago when I was suffering, about the use of medications, to help ease suffering so we can heal. It is interesting, as so often we need this help, whether it be from a medication, person, or other treatment – to get us to a place that we are able to focus on healing again.
At the end of the day, it shows me, that as long as we are working on healing – we are going in the right direction.
That is quite refreshing. For some it may only be medicated, for some entirely unmedicated, for many it depends on the phase. For some it may be esoteric, removing all toxins, caffeine, alcohol, etc. For others, it may be a life that supports different habits as well as healing.
I am learning to open my mind to what healing looks like Anita.
It does not have one face. It has many faces, and those faces depend on the day and phase. Such as the moon – different faces, based on so many variables – all of which are beautiful.
I think I have held onto for a very long time what right and wrong is – well of course, as mother voice has taught me good and bad right and wrong.
And more so – recently, the idea that healing is a certain way. It is when your life looks a certain way, and MOST importantly – when I FEEL a certain way.
this would describe a destination, or an idea, or a goal. this does not describe healing. Healing is the process. Healing has many faces.
2 weeks ago when I was truly suffering – well that – that’s healing too
6 weeks ago when I was on a beautiful beach feeling serene – that’s healing too
1 week ago when I had a nice glass of wine, and enjoyed a TV show – that’s healing too
A few days ago when I crept into bed early and let my thoughts wash over me – that’s healing too
Today when I did a hot power yoga class, and was able to enjoy it – that is not just healing, that is progress
And today, as I write this, it is healing, and progress
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Very selfish. yes we have covered it, but it is always worth covering – given that it all goes back to that mistreatment. when on the path sometimes – in my own experience – it is easy to forget the root – especially when it is the result of someone else’s mistreatment. so much of the symptoms we have as a result feel only specific to us, we can forget what triggered it all, or “created” it in the first place. this is not to blame the other, or to take away from the importance of self directed learning, healing – it is just a reminder.
our conversation yesterday reminded me that – it was never about anyone else but her. how mean, how rude, how terrible, how evil.
but as per your point, she flipped and flopped on what was important to her – important to “make me” and so it was an endless hamster wheel of seeking. seek others, okay check, now seek myself, okay check, okay now back to others —ok.
seemingly okay – not realizing that this is not compatible with normal mental health, behavior, or stability. we are not superhuman, I am not SCC. It is no achievement to be this way, just foolish, and exhausting. It is slavery if you will. Enslaved by an outward approach to life.
I’ve said this before, my parents now feel like a distant memory – and even my sister. But the goo remains. The sticky stuff. I work on it day in and day out, like its my job – in fact it IS my real job. My other job feels quite secondary, as that does not require nearly as much mindful observation, it has become second nature.
healing can not be second nature, or else we drift into the same patterns over and over, and wondering why. I now have taken the reigns into my own hands.
The work this month, is not seeking to help, in fact not seeking at all, just doing no harm.
So far so good. I gave you one example – with my husband the other day. I gave you an alternate example, not picking up the phone the other day – which was in a way not “helping” aka entertaining aka engaging with a friend. In a way that would be a disservice to me, perhaps helping someone else, and unhelping myself and partner.
I no longer feel that this healing path is lonely, for sure, it is a path that many/most will not understand. But keeping people along the way that no longer fit – such as N – the user — does NOT take away from loneliness. It is an illusion. It is just baggage, extra weight to drag around, while I embark on a path of going up a mountain, and that person pulls you down at your ankles. While I decide to take a dip into the beautiful crystal blue water, and that person pouts in the background to stay indoors.
Well I don’t want to stay indoors, so if you do – great. See you later, or perhaps never.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
SCC – i like that.
I guess I never thought about it as that she never gave me permission early in life. As I always felt I never gave myself permission. Early in life I found myself pushing myself more than she pushed me. But here’s the thing, theres the whole aspect of her trying to live vicariously through me. Feeling that her life was so bad, and so her daughters should seek all and live the life she never could.
Then later in life, yes. She NEVER gave me the permission. Nope, I had to fix all- most importantly her! My role in this universe was to fix her. I was placed her to bring joy to her, and take away suffering.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
Yes, I was feeling lazy today and wrote CC! Yes, you do need to be very careful walking uneven ground of nature, especially those hidden tree roots that can get the best of us.
Yes you are right. I always think back to how you mention that changing deep rooted habits takes a lot of time and effort. It is moments like yesterday that made me realize how deep the habits run.
I thought yesterday how in psychotherapy, the first questions often refer to our earliest memories as children. I notice how I don’t always have a good recollection – but do overall, versus exact scenarios.
During this yoga class, something else came up. I recall feeling small and fearful in gym classes. This is not uncommon, during those awkward growing years, in physical education classes in a huge gym. But the memory wasn’t about this. It was something else.
It was this strange feeling of being vulnerable. Feeling hurt even before the punch. Feeling sad even before the incident. Feeling disappointed even before the fall. I recall only the mother voice. Only it speaking in my brain, the child brain. I recall feeling sad for my mom, feeling sad for this world, what a shame we live in this bad world.
This is what came to mind.
If i link this with the other thought that came to mind, the idea of having control over your own life – it makes sense.
I was fed these thoughts, values, delusions – whatever they were -as truths. Solid truths. Objective, uncontrollable reality it seemed. As a result, my mood or feelings based on those were also a given. Well of course I feel sad, why wouldn’t I – the world is sad! Of course I feel annoyed, look how bad people are!
All out of MY control, because that was the truth.
Or of course I am disorganized, there is no time to be organized, there are so many tasks and people to attend to! Its a given, so there’s no CHOICE. I have no CONTROL over how I feel or act, its a given.
But as I slowly go back to the truths – the “truths” I can begin to see what is aligned with a good life for Cali Chica – and what is not.
Cali ChicaParticipantDear Anita,
How is your foot feeling? Is it okay, I hope you are not feeling too much stiffness.
Yesterday, during a slow yoga class, restorative, one in which you have time to your thoughts – I came across something. For the first time in my life, I had this thought bounce into my mind – that I have control over my life.
It sounds strange. Of course I have control over it, who else would? I controlled in many ways my trajectory into career by applying myself. I chose who to marry, I chose many things. Many of us do.
Yet, when this small thought appeared in my mind – it felt new. I know exactly why now.
I have always felt as though I have no control over many things. I am just a person that gets messy easily, not dirty, but disorganized. My closet can go from perfect to a hurricane in a minute. i find myself easily with papers everywhere. Everything is always very clean and sanitary, but not always organized or in the right place. This is something that I have always in a way accepted about myself, even though it can be a barrier to feeling calm and structured.
Another one, I feel like I can never just do one thing at once, there are always so many things to do. How do people focus on one task at a time – how do they have the time!
This does go hand in hand with the disorganized comment. So yesterday I came home from yoga, and my friend S was calling. A nice sweet loyal friend from college. S is quite reliable and calls and checks in regularly, we both do.
Naturally the phone rings, and I go to pick it up. I do not check in with myself first. Nope, instant knee jerk to attend to this call, attend to this person. Although in all reality it was her calling leisurely. But naturally I am primed, to drop everything and pick up, and then resume my activities while multi tasking.
Yesterday I didn’t. When she was calling I was in the middle of organizing my closet. A dreaded task for me. By picking up the phone I would be able to distract myself from this annoying task, and talk while performing it. Then I would be done, and feel both, unrested, and also equally unorganized. This would continue, and years later. I would find, that
1 – I never allowed myself to focus on any given task at hand. Why – because I did not protect this time for myself
2 – I may be less organized than say another, but the true reality is, my mind is always on something or someone else. Like knee jerk picking up the phone to talk to someone, out of habit – and not giving yourself or your task the undivided attention it needs. The closet does not clean itself. The next morning it will continue to cause you stress.
So why?
Well my mother consistently throughout my life needed me to give her my full attention, and towards the end it was so intrusive it was – drop everything and run to her. This habit still runs deep.
guilt. guilt runs deep. the feeling that CC can do it all, so she should. that she is not deserving of doing just one thing at a time. why should she? if she can do 12 things at once, just doing one at a time seems a waste – seems unnatural. guilt that if she doesn’t pick up the phone, the opposite party will be disappointed. guilt that she is not the person she has always been if she now begins to focus on herself/husband and own life.
This is a common theme for me I know.
But yesterday, looping back. I realized that I control this. I can control whether this closet stays disorganized, or becomes organized. If you give yourself one hour, and do it and put your mind to it – its nothing! But if you give yourself one hour, and half do it, and focus your energy on the phone call with S – you aren’t helping yourself or your closet out. And S is fine either way, if I don’t pick up – I would another time. At the end of the day, it is my own guilt. But I see now how I can control how I felt yesterday. How my evening went, how my closet looked. How CC doesn’t always think about others because shes defective, its that she always picks up the phone -figuratively.
So OF COURSE my focus is not from within. put down the phone. and pick up yourself.
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