Am I fooling myself out of love?

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This topic has 21 replies, 7 voices, and was last updated 5 years, 5 months ago by Marge.

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June 13, 2017 at 9:53 am #152958

Marge
Participant

Hello everyone,

This is the first time I’m writing here. I recently broke up with my 6 years boyfriend/fiancee but we have tried to come back together few times, only to fail again and suffer more.

He has angry issues, eventhough he never touched me, he still yelled and curse at me and his families members, including his mother. I always found that unacceptable, specially because I come from a “respect-based” education and my family cherish respect and empathy more than anything.

Besides that, he was very jealous and I ended up distancing myself from all of my friends in order to make him feel more secure – because he has self esteem problems.

Unlike me, he kept hanging out of his friends during weekdays and unappropriate hours while I was working real hard on my career and studies. I always tried to make him realize he should go to work and dedicate to studies in order to build a better life, but he always ignored my advices and just kept hanging out with his friends (all of them never worked before and keeps on live from their parents money eventhough most of them are over 25 years old).

The positive aspects were that he was very devoted and zealous, always having my back whenever I needed him. He also said inumerous times that he loves me and that I’m everything to him.

Anyway I decided it wasn’t enough and I couldn’t keep on a relationship like that and broke up few months ago. My intention was to see if he was capable of changing once he lost me.

Of course, it didn’t work out. He ended even closer to his friends and this Peter Pan’s way of life. In the meantime he was also involved with another girl.

When we were together this girl was always a problem to us. She was never nice or polite to me and I have always found that annoying. Until one day I caught him slightly flirting with her and we had a big fight. Even with all this fight we had over her he never lost contact of cut her off from his life, like I did with all my male friends.

Now, I discovered he was having sex frequently with this girl and they even went on a holiday trip together.

It hit me hard as rock because it got me questioning everything during our relationship, including the fact the he might have actually cheated on me.

The thing is, since I discovered he has been begging my forgiveness and asking for another chance. As I said before, I tried twice but I just can’t get over the fact that I can’t trust him anymore. It’s like I have never even knew him at all.

I mean, after the disrespect, the lack of commitment to build something together, the lack of motivation to do the things I ask, I also have to deal with lack of trust, with the possibility of being cheated on. It’s too much to handle.

But I still love him and everytime he contacts me I question my own motives and see myself believing in him again. He says he has changed, that I’m his everlasting love, that he realizes now how wrong he was and etc.

I don’t want to be a fool, even less being responsible for it. I don’t want to go through all the pain again, but it’s seems like I can’t move on. And I got myself wondering “what if?”, thinking that he could have changed. Sometimes I think I’m never falling in love again, that I will be forever in love with him and that this pain will never ends.

I really don’t know what do. Maybe some of you has walked in my shoes before and can give me a hint about the future.

I thank you all in advance.

Best Regards

Marge

June 13, 2017 at 11:55 am #152988

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Marge:

It reads to me like a bad idea to get back together with him because of “what if?” and your emotional attachment. But if you are invested in what-if-he-really-changed, and you decide to find out, better check if he has changed from the position of a non-girlfriend. At the least, don’t put yourself back into a girlfriend role with him.

Meet him for coffee, in a coffee house, for conversations, over time, months… converse. Evaluate whether he changed in a few months, and take it from there at that time, a few months from now… perhaps December of this year…

anita

June 13, 2017 at 12:18 pm #152992

Marge
Participant

Dear Anita,

I’m really thankful for your idea. It seems very simple and viable option.

I just need to be able to keep this emotional distance and not get involve or talk into a relationship again. Sometimes I get to angry at him for everything and we end up fighting. I even got out of social media because I get jealous and frustraded that he didn’t change at all.

So at first I’ve tried to cut all contact, but I couldn’t mantain that, maybe because of my emotional attachment. As I said, I no longer have any friends. My family is very supportive but I feel alone most of the time, thats probably why I miss him so much.

I’m also trying therapy and meditation in order to forgive him and myself. But most of all, I need to let go this expectations.

June 13, 2017 at 12:26 pm #152996

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Marge:

You are welcome. Don’t be in a rush to forgive him, is my recommendation. When a person is harmful to you, the anger toward them has a purpose: to protect you, to motivate you to move away from a source of harm. When you are protected (no longer in contact with him, nor inclined to be.. then forgive him)

If you are unable to keep your distance, as it reads to me, that is, to meet him for coffee and keep your distance otherwise, better work in the therapy you mentioned on staying away from him.

Emotional attachment, like the one you have for him, is what keeps … millions of people world wide in bad relationships. You can respect the force, the power of the attachment, and learn how to make the right choices for you nonetheless.

anita

June 13, 2017 at 1:13 pm #153008

Marge
Participant

Anita,

I can’t thank you enough for your time and words.

Do you truly believe that there is such thing as unforgettable love? Or this is just a romantic vision of love and relationships?

June 13, 2017 at 7:52 pm #153050

PearceHawk
Participant

Marge I hope that by the time you read this that you are well on the way to healing and have a clear vision for a better life for you. Sometimes, giving people a second chance, such as the man you speak of, is like giving someone extra bullets because they missed you the first time. Forgiving yourself is paramount. To forgive him does not mean you have to stay with him. It just means you forgive him, and move on. Respect yourself so that you can let him go so that you can move on so that you CAN meet the person you deserve. A couple of times I noticed that you use what I call “The J Word”, aka jealous(y). I think that jealousy is a very destructive element in a relationship. I recall once upon a time that my now and I got into an argument. I don’t even recall what it was about. Anyway, she said something that , to this day, do not understand. She said, “You don’t care about us because you’re not jealous!” Whaaaaat? I said to her, ” I am not jealous because I do care about us.” Jealousy is just not a part of my life, I suppose because I am secure within myself. There is no need to go through what you are going through. Forgive, let go, embrace wonderful possibilities coming your way, and most of all, love yourself.

June 13, 2017 at 9:03 pm #153082

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Marge:

You are welcome. You asked: “Do you truly believe that there is such thing as unforgettable love?”

You will probably remember him, so in that sense it is unforgettable (forgetting would have been possible if we shed our brain cells as we do our skin cells).

But I don’t think that is what you meant by “unforgettable love”- what do you mean by it?

anita

June 14, 2017 at 7:50 am #153160

Marge
Participant

Hello,

@PearceHawk, thank you for your time and words. Your metaphor actually makes a lot of sense. Sometimes we are so absorbed by the problem we can’t see things clearly.

At the same time that I feel guilty for staying so long and for allowing him to manipulate me, I still feel like he’s not that bad and maybe he could change. It’s like the rational part of me knows that patterns never change and the emotional part of me wants desperately him to. Anyway, the good news is that I feel that my rational part is gaining more and more space in my mind.

Yes, jealousy was always a problem between us. At first I wasn’t really jealous, but he was so controlling that I started to believe that this was how a relationship should be (as he is my first boyfriend ever).

Today, what scares me the most is that I will never be able to trust anyone anymore. Maybe I was in an abusive relationship and it’s kinda hard for me to admit it because I let that happen. I was always so sure I loved myself, insecurity was never a problem to me (at least I thought so).

But when I saw him flirting with this girl and then discovering he actually had sex with her shook all my self esteem away. I was so sure he was never going to do something with her, even when we were apart. Mostly because she’s not intelligent, she’s not classy, not beautiful nor educated, she doesn’t work or have a career, she doesn’t study. Also, she have had sex with all of his friends, including his brother. So I used to thought he was different and that he had higher standards. But truth his that he didn’t and he was also available to keep on going out with her, making holiday trips with his friends and her by his side. I mean, it was not only sex, they were together somehow and they were hanging out as a couple.

He says he regrets it, that he was depressive and didn’t know what to do. But still. And even when we were talking back again and trying to figure things out he was still seeing her and lying to me about it. Actually, he still does and says everything I discover was just a coincidence and that never happened when we were together or trying to. He swears he cut her off when we started talking again (but I simply can’t believe that).

Thing is, it shouldn’t mean nothing anymore. I don’t want to stay in this relationship, therefore it shouldn’t bother me anymore, but it does and i’m almost obsessively thinking about it. That’s why I experience this rollercoaster of emotions, in one minute I’m so angry at him (and at myself) and next minute I’m feeling pity for him.

@Anita,

To explain what I meant maybe is better to say how I feel. I feel like I’m never going to be able to love somebody like I loved him (in the same intensity) and I’m afraid I will never be able to let go of this feeling.

I frequently see love stories of two people we were never able to let go, or to stop loving someone eventhough years went by. Like this is the only one and true love. And that true love only happens once.

I know that forgetting is not possible (unless I have amnesia or something haha), he is part of my story now. But what I mean is I fear he is my only true love and therefore I will never stop loving him, or that it will never happen again. Like this will never be over.

June 14, 2017 at 9:09 am #153194

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Marge:

No, this was not the “only one and true love”- not even close. I know it because of what you shared about his behavior and your feelings about his behavior. If it was a “true love” there would be different sharing about it.

If this is the first serious romantic relationship in your life, and you had hopes and dreams about a “and they lived happily ever after” future, then there was magic, at times, to everything. It is like a child waking up to a new day, the sun shining, the grass green, the future feels magical, promising. An adult waking up to the same day… well, it is a nice day. Nice, not magical.

Similar here. In your next relationship, your hopes and dreams will probably be different (I hope so), and so there may be less- or none- of that magic you experienced.

But that magic was not about who he was and is (and it is not about the sun and the green grass), it is about the magic in your brain, the newness of the experience, the hopes and dreams.

In the future, you have a chance to experience “one and true love”- in a relationship with a dependable, reliable, honest… truly loving man. What will make it true love will be in the nature of the relationship.

anita

June 19, 2017 at 8:38 am #153970

Marge
Participant

Hello Anita,

Thank you again for your time and answers.

It’s been really tough. I wish He coud Just stop looking for me and trying to reach me. It would be a lot eaiser. He says he’s never letting me go, that he will do what it takes. This even doesn’t make any sense, since all I’ve ever asked for was respect and commitment. I’m trying being friends with him but I keep asking questions, imagining he is lying about where he is or what he’s doing.

I hope I can let go of these feelings and be able to cut any form of contact. Because I simply don’t want to live like this anymore. It feels like he’s blocking my way to freedom while I’m blocking his. It’s almost like I’m not able to let him go. Maybe I’m not prepared to see him with somebody else, especially this girl.

June 19, 2017 at 9:38 am #153988

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Marge:

You are welcome. I have two comments today. One is about what you wrote earlier, that it feels “Like this will never be over”- it FEELS this way, but that doesn’t make it so.

Second comment is about what you wrote in your original post: “He has angry issues… he still yelled and curse at me and his families members, including his mother. I always found that unacceptable, specially because I come from a ‘respect-based’ education and my family cherish respect and empathy more than anything.”

It is unacceptable, of course, for him to yell and curse at you. The fact that he did that is worrisome. Next time he feels angry, will he do that again? And if not next time, maybe the next…

Clearly he is angry at his mother. If you were to connect with him, to reach a higher level of intimacy (which probably is not a good idea for you), you will need, I believe, to … respect the fact that he is angry at his mother, to feel empathy for him because he must have been significantly hurt by his mother. A child doesn’t unjustly feel anger at his mother (I assume that is when he started feeling angry at her). It may very well be that empathy is something she lacked for him. Something he desperately needs.

anita

June 20, 2017 at 12:36 am #154134

treegirl
Participant

” Sometimes, giving people a second chance, such as the man you speak of, is like giving someone extra bullets because they missed you the first time.” very good, very good..

if you come from a family where you learned respect, with kindness and empathy. where anger is under control, and your boyfriend is not from that back ground, it will take him a long time to learn how to be that kind of a true kind person.

You do not want to wait for him to learn. He may never. some people will always carry that negative way with them. The kind emotional secure people are taught this in childhood.

June 20, 2017 at 9:04 am #154218
Marge
Participant
Dear @anita, thank you again for your time and consideration by keeping coming back to answer me. I’m trying not make you bored or tired of this, so I’m sorry if I can’t be brief.

There were sometimes when I was worried about that anger. He didn’t hurt me, but he often punch walls and doors, break things, driving reckless while we were fighting inside the car and etc. So yes, there was a point where violence became something to worry about, even though if never actually happened.

Regarding his mother, my conclusion is that he is angry at her mostly because of what his father tells him. His father used to treat his mother disrespectfully, they got into a traumatic divorce and they both still kinda hate each other til this day.

So his father basically criticizes and bad mouth her on a daily basis to him (since his father is his boss).

I know his mother is not perfect and she’s made mistakes such as spoiling him and preventing him to assume responsibilities for his actions, but, as far as I know, she was never abusive towards him. What I saw during these 6 years was a mother always trying real hard to “deserve” his love and affection. As he is always refusing – saying she bores him or whatever – I guess, she desperately tries to compensate by buying things and paying his bills and this cycle goes on.

I became close to her and we used to spend hours talking, so I could see her both perspectives.

I tried everything I could (or knew as I have my own limits) to show him another way. At first I tried to explain to him how a loving family is supposed to be by bringing him closer to my family but he always avoided them, making excuses for not spending time at my place. Even in special occasions he was always in a hurry to another “appointment” (but when he left I always discovered that this “appointment” was with his friends).

Then I tried to talk to him about forgiving his mother, showing that she’s just a human being, she made mistakes but she’s not a cruel mother. I tried meditation, yoga classes, conventional church…I was available to go to him, I was always searching, inviting. I even got him to meditation classes but was a dead end.

Eventually, I accepted. But as I was always around in their house I saw these fights constantly. So the only thing I asked for was: “do not fight with her when I’m here because I can’t not stand seeing it”. It was also a dead end and he never respected the fact that I was present. Everything she said was enough for him to snap. Sometimes, I liked to spend time with her in the dining room and he used to become very angry about it saying I should go to his room with him, when I refused, he would go out with his friends, leaving me with his mother.

When I thought about my future, I couldn’t help to think about him treating me this way. His mother once said to me that he was his son, so she didn’t have a choice but that I did and I was not bound to bear his mistreatment.

Well, by reading my own text I really don’t know why I stayed so long. Maybe I was blinded by the faith that he could change. I guess he could, but he doesn’t really want to.

So this leads me to what @treegirl said about him not learning. Maybe he never will.

I’m really thankful for your taking your time to read my story and answering me.

I just believed this soooo much, I invested soo much. I gave up my own friends, sometimes I didn’t spend time with my family to be with him, to be available to him 24h. I worked my ass off to build up a career so we could start a family together. It feels like I was the only one putting effort to make this relationship work. When I broke up, he said to me it never crossed his mind I would (even though I said I would leave some day innumerable times).

Even now he won’t help me, the break up is all on me. The whole process depend solely on me. Instead of stop contacting me, he is always present. He talks to me everyday and I’m tired of being rude. Specially because he will play the victim if I treat him badly. Now he wants to be friends with my family, calling them asking about their day, saying he misses my grandmother. My family likes him very much. I never told them how many times he belittle my family. I think it’s important to point out that the day I decided I couldn’t take this any longer was the day he decided to curse my father. That day I said to myself I had to leave, that this was beyond everything he could say or do to me. It took me 9 months to have strength to do so.

Few months ago his life became to fell apart, his stepfather was very ill and I had just broke up with him. He lost a lot of weight, saying he was devastated. He used to tell me he was going to kill himself. Maybe he was and that’s when I felt guilty for leaving him. I felt guilty for a long time and I ended up giving him another chance, that’s when I discovered he was hanging out with this girl and the lies became to appear. So I decided to end things again. Two days later his grandfather died and I felt like I should support him, be there for him, and that’s what I did. Since then, we keep in touch, sometimes we hang out but it’s really hard for me to move on when he’s still so present and I can’t cut him off. I don’t know why. He is always making promises, he is very affectionate, very supportive, saying he sees things clearly now. I’m starting to obsessing about this situation. Sometimes I feel really sad and look for hope inside my heart, but then I think about his lies and this new/old girl. Thinking that besides all, he might have cheated on me.

I really miss him and our life together, our good moments were special and happy, we used to say we were best friends and it really breaks my heart when I remember. When I think we could have been very happy together. That we could have build a really beautiful story. I just can’t seem to let go of it and I also can’t forgive him for his lies. Sometimes I think he is manipulating me but then I feel soooo stupid, like “how could I be fooled so much for so long”. But it’s hard to truly admit that, so I take comfort on the fact that he is just troubled and don’t do that on purpose, so I really don’t know.

Well, thing is I really don’t want to fool myself again and I want to be able to let this situation go. I feel like I’m trapped into this for too long, I just don’t know how.
- This reply was modified 7 years, 4 months ago by Marge.
- This reply was modified 7 years, 4 months ago by Marge.
June 20, 2017 at 9:27 am #154232

Anonymous
Guest

Dear Marge:

You can make your posts as long as you want them to be- I can always take a break from a post and return to it later.

He reads like a troubled man and that is unfortunate. It is also unfortunate that you are “trapped into this for too long”-

Better severe ties. End all contact. I don’t see how a relationship with him can possibly work for your benefit. And it is not working for his benefit either. He may feel better at times, but overall, he remains as troubled as he has been for so long.

Your attachment to him is strong, it is an emotional attachment. Similar to separating from any object of attachment, from food (overeating), alcohol, drugs, clothes (over-shopping), it is not easy but doable. Many people have done it, separate from the object of their attachment, and so can you.

anita

June 20, 2017 at 9:41 am #154238

Eliana
Participant

Hi Marge,

I’m sorry, I’m a bit late in replying to your post, and it looks like you have some great replies from very caring, amazing people. One thing that concerned me, was that you had hoped “that he could change” after reading your posts, the saying came into my mind, is that you can’t change someone who’s got so much stuff and troubled inside going on, and there was no mention of him wanting to do any work to want to change. (such as therapy).

Another thing that came to mind is “you can’t teach an old dog new tricks” meaning, he is very set in his ways and that is how he wants tto stay, you can try to change him, rationalize with him until you are exhausted, but I am sure this is not what you want for your life. It is best to find a healthy man who deserves you.
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